Sam's contract and our options

[kungfoodude]

4 hours ago, panthers55 said:

What that Darnold is the answer? So far he isnt and that is obvious.  But the question is whether he will still be here next year. Based on contracts it would be yes but then again we dumped Bridgewater and ate a big chunk so we will move on quickly if we dont believe in you so there is that.   I want to see what Cam can do and if you dont believe in Santa Claus then how did we land Cam? Of course there is a Santa Claus and in the spirit of the season everyone declared good will to men  and came together for this Panthers Christmas and all is right in Pantherland.  The end..or just the beginning......

In your post you are talking about Sam as a rookie and him potentially being a long term guy for us. That isn't gonna happen.

This may very well be the last stop in Sam Darnold's NFL career.

[glenwo2]

1 hour ago, Evil Hurney said:

I haven't seen it mentioned in this thread so I wanted to add it to the collective consciousness.

There is a chance that if the team were to cut Sam and he were to sign with a new team the Panthers would only owe the difference. I haven't been able to find the language in the CBA that talks about how guaranteed salary works in this regard, but I did hear it mentioned briefly by Florio on PFT.

Now don't get too excited. If this were true any team that would sign Sam would also know this and would likely only give him the veteran minimum since Sam gets his $18M either way.

Which would end up being a boon for Sam 'cause he gets more money on top of the 18 mil.

After thinking about it, I agree with the person here who said that Sam may have one more team out there give him one final chance before getting booted from the league (basically)....

But that possibility is only if we cut him and yeah...Tepper may end up tossing Sam out on his ass(figuratively speaking) but we don't know if that will happen or not as I'm sure Tepper will exhaust all options in trying to see if there are any suckers..err, I mean "takers" for Sam out there before deciding to give him the ol' Heave-ho. 

[Khyber53]

5 hours ago, trueblade said:

Not that I necessarily agree with them, but I would remind you that in Rhule and Fitterer's mind, we already have those picks back.

This is from during the draft:

We came into the day thinking we were going to get two players and we got three, and we picked up a four next year, so basically the Sam Darnold trade is paid off now," Rhule said. "So we got three players we really liked, but we've also paid off that trade."

source:https://www.panthers.com/news/panthers-nfl-draft-day-2-wrapup-trades-scott-fitterer-matt-rhule

Gonna say the jury is out on that one. 

[mrcompletely11]

5 hours ago, trueblade said:

Not that I necessarily agree with them, but I would remind you that in Rhule and Fitterer's mind, we already have those picks back.

This is from during the draft:

We came into the day thinking we were going to get two players and we got three, and we picked up a four next year, so basically the Sam Darnold trade is paid off now," Rhule said. "So we got three players we really liked, but we've also paid off that trade."

source:https://www.panthers.com/news/panthers-nfl-draft-day-2-wrapup-trades-scott-fitterer-matt-rhule

I said at the time that was retarded

[TheRumGone]

5 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

In your post you are talking about Sam as a rookie and him potentially being a long term guy for us. That isn't gonna happen.

This may very well be the last stop in Sam Darnold's NFL career.

Sam Darnold is Ryan leaf/jamarcus Russell level bust category. Blows my mind people don’t see this.

[mrcompletely11]

22 minutes ago, TheRumGone said:

Sam Darnold is Ryan leaf/jamarcus Russell level bust category. Blows my mind people don’t see this.

I mean.  Darnold is a better person then those guys and I feel he tried harder but yeah the results are similar but I just hate comparing Sam to those two assholes

[TheRumGone]

4 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

I mean.  Darnold is a better person then those guys and I feel he tried harder but yeah the results are similar but I just hate comparing Sam to those two assholes

Im talking football field results. Top picks, dreadful play, full on busts. Sam was the #3 overall pick. Like goddamn he’s terrible. Not even competent. The best we could’ve hoped for was Alex smith type play. Alex did not play worth the top pick but he could play well and win some games with competent play. Darnold is truly one of the worst qbs I’ve seen on the field at times. 

[kungfoodude]

33 minutes ago, TheRumGone said:

Sam Darnold is Ryan leaf/jamarcus Russell level bust category. Blows my mind people don’t see this.

Yeah. Some of us knew this coming in but to see it live and in person....WOW. Can you imagine watching 3 years of that with the Jets? Especially if you were a shrewd Jets fan and could see it? Fuuuuck.

9 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

I mean.  Darnold is a better person then those guys and I feel he tried harder but yeah the results are similar but I just hate comparing Sam to those two assholes

I mean.....I don't really see the need to even add the qualifier that he is a nice guy. Matt Kalil seemed like a nice guy. So does Dennis Daley. If you suck, you just suck. It isn't any different than being at the workplace and having a co-worker that is atrocious at their job. So bad it makes everyone elses job harder and gets you all in trouble all the time. Doesn't matter how hard they try or how nice they are, eventually you all just want them gone.

Edited November 17, 2021 by kungfoodude

[mrcompletely11]

1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

Yeah. Some of us knew this coming in but to see it live and in person....WOW. Can you imagine watching 3 years of that with the Jets? Especially if you were a shrewd Jets fan and could see it? Fuuuuck.

I mean.....I don't really see the need to even add the qualifier that he is a nice guy. Matt Kalil seemed like a nice guy. So does Dennis Daley. If you suck, you just suck. It isn't any different than being at the workplace and having a co-worker that is atrocious at their job. So bad it makes everyone elses job harder and gets you all in trouble all the time. Doesn't matter how hard they try or how nice they are, eventually you all just want them gone.

He does indeed suck. 

[TheRumGone]

1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

Yeah. Some of us knew this coming in but to see it live and in person....WOW. Can you imagine watching 3 years of that with the Jets? Especially if you were a shrewd Jets fan and could see it? Fuuuuck.

I mean.....I don't really see the need to even add the qualifier that he is a nice guy. Matt Kalil seemed like a nice guy. So does Dennis Daley. If you suck, you just suck. It isn't any different than being at the workplace and having a co-worker that is atrocious at their job. So bad it makes everyone elses job harder and gets you all in trouble all the time. Doesn't matter how hard they try or how nice they are, eventually you all just want them gone.

I browsed the jets forum after we traded for him and some during his more “solid games” 90% of the posters said he would self destruct in due time. They knew. Some of us knew. There were a few who thought all he needed was weapons and better coaching. All of those posters gave up and called him a bust yet we still have a handful of posters here who think he can somehow grow into more.
 

Sam is a franchise killer. He sucks all the energy off the field. he gets coaches fired. He made Joe Brady look inept. The same Joe Brady who got 4 players 1k+ yards from scrimmage the year before with Teddy fuging bridgewater. All you have to know is he’s the worst starting qb over the past 4 years in clean pockets and this year at the end of his time starting had the second most time in the pocket with one of the lowest air yards. He’s one of the dumbest starting qbs I’ve ever seen in the league. Football dumb. Not a slam on him as a human being. Like maybe worse then jimmy clausen or just as bad. I think the worst part of this is that he ruined a championship defense for half the season. At least with jimmy we could be like “ok we’re gonna get the top overall pick to build from.” But this team is so good overall that him being as bad as he was is magnified ten fold. 

[davos]

Another question to consider is QB room allocation. Most teams have what? Around 40 mil invested in the room.

If Cam plays respectable to keep for 2-3 years, I’d negotiate a modest deal and look to draft. Sam’s contract wouldn’t impede a ton on re-signing other players. 
 

The issue that comes into play is if we’re trying to dish out a 25 mil+ contract to a vet starting next year which I don’t see happening. 
 

And if we really need the cap, do think us paying half plus a throwing in a 6th for like a 7th could work for a team with dog poo backups. It’s something. 

 

 

[kungfoodude]

2 minutes ago, TheRumGone said:

I browsed the jets forum after we traded for him and some during his more “solid games” 90% of the posters said he would self destruct in due time. They knew. Some of us knew. There were a few who thought all he needed was weapons and better coaching. All of those posters gave up and called him a bust yet we still have a handful of posters here who think he can somehow grow into more.
 

Sam is a franchise killer. He sucks all the energy off the field. he gets coaches fired. He made Joe Brady look inept. The same Joe Brady who got 4 players 1k+ yards from scrimmage the year before with Teddy fuging bridgewater. All you have to know is he’s the worst starting qb over the past 4 years in clean pockets and this year at the end of his time starting had the second most time in the pocket with one of the lowest air yards. He’s one of the dumbest starting qbs I’ve ever seen in the league. Football dumb. Not a slam on him as a human being. Like maybe worse then jimmy clausen or just as bad. I think the worst part of this is that he ruined a championship defense for half the season. At least with jimmy we could be like “ok we’re gonna get the top overall pick to build from.” But this team is so good overall that him being as bad as he was is magnified ten fold. 

I was very pessimistic about Darnold coming in but even I didn't think he would be this big of a fuging disaster. It is crazy how bad he is. If anything, this is the worst season in his career with no bottom in sight.

[TheRumGone]

4 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

I was very pessimistic about Darnold coming in but even I didn't think he would be this big of a fuging disaster. It is crazy how bad he is. If anything, this is the worst season in his career with no bottom in sight.

The only dumb thing I said was I thought Brady could get him to post career numbers. Which isn’t that much more but I thought he’d throw something like 20-25 tds with 15-18 picks. I thought he’d be able to push the ball downfield and give our receivers a chance. I thought Moore would post big numbers with him because he has a strong arm. He was worse then I thought for sure. The biggest issue I always had was the price and picking up the 5th year option.
 

I’m fine with trading for a guy who has some talent but needs to be worked on. But you give up 4th round picks for that not a second, 4th and a sixth. And then pick up a 19 mill option without seeing a snap? We gave up that much for a guy who had 9 tds and 11 picks the year before. We got fleeced so fuging bad.

[kungfoodude]

5 minutes ago, TheRumGone said:

The only dumb thing I said was I thought Brady could get him to post career numbers. Which isn’t that much more but I thought he’d throw something like 20-25 tds with 15-18 picks. I thought he’d be able to push the ball downfield and give our receivers a chance. I thought Moore would post big numbers with him because he has a strong arm. He was worse then I thought for sure. The biggest issue I always had was the price and picking up the 5th year option.
 

I’m fine with trading for a guy who has some talent but needs to be worked on. But you give up 4th round picks for that not a second, 4th and a sixth. And then pick up a 19 mill option without seeing a snap? We gave up that much for a guy who had 9 tds and 11 picks the year before. We got fleeced so fuging bad.

Yeah, I was pissed initially about dumping that 2nd round pick. Even more pissed now.

This definitely wasn't Sean Gilbert trade bad but it might easily be the 2nd worst trade we have ever made.