Sam's contract and our options

[panthers55]

9 minutes ago, therealmjl said:

Here you go bringing up Cam again. Darnold's awful contract and miserable performance has literally nothing to do with Cam....so there's no reason to bring him up (again).

The discussion is - what can we do to move on from Darnold and this terrible contract? That's a valid discussion. He serves no value compared to his cap hit next year. Also, funny you should mention - he's hurt.

And are you serious right now? You expect Sam to compete for the starting job next season? Holy poo.

Of course they are linked in several ways. First of all we need to find a starting QB. So far we have none. If Cam struggles dont assume we couldnt see Darnold again. Thats right. The only one under contract for next year right now is Darnold and his 18 million dollars of guaranteed money. Second Cam is a vet who can help Darnold grow and could be one of the reasons he was brought here. Both PJ and Darnold could use some mentoring. Lastly Darnold was great and then lousy. So he had enough flashes to bring him to camp since he is going to get paid. So yeah I am totally serious and if you think about it for a minute you would see the validity of the argument. You may think the discussion is about dumping Darnold or trading but I dont think that Rhule or Fitterer are there at all. Even if Cam is awesome then they have their backup and the guy potentially down the road. Rhule said he was treating Darnold like a rookie which suggests he had a plan for him beyond dumping him if he struggles.

Edited November 17, 2021 by panthers55

[therealmjl]

24 minutes ago, panthers55 said:

Of course they are linked in several ways. First of all we need to find a starting QB. So far we have none. If Cam struggles dont assume we couldnt see Darnold again. Thats right. The only one under contract for next year right now is Darnold and his 18 million dollars of guaranteed money. Second Cam is a vet who can help Darnold grow and could be one of the reasons he was brought here. Both PJ and Darnold could use some mentoring. Lastly Darnold was great and then lousy. So he had enough flashes to bring him to camp since he is going to get paid. So yeah I am totally serious and if you think about it for a minute you would see the validity of the argument. You may think the discussion is about dumping Darnold or trading but I dont think that Rhule or Fitterer are there at all. Even if Cam is awesome then they have their backup and the guy potentially down the road. Rhule said he was treating Darnold like a rookie which suggests he had a plan for him beyond dumping him if he struggles.

Darnold sucks. He is who he is. He had 3 games where he looked halfway decent. Other than that, he has never been good and his ceiling is NFL backup. That's just being real.

[panthers55]

Just now, therealmjl said:

Darnold sucks. He is who he is. He had 3 games where he looked halfway decent. Other than that, he has never been good and his ceiling is NFL backup. That's just being real.

Well I guess if you said it, then it must be true. Ok bye.

[kungfoodude]

24 minutes ago, panthers55 said:

Well I guess if you said it, then it must be true. Ok bye.

If you can't see it, none of us can make you see it.

So, enjoy continuing to believe there is a Santa Claus.

[Jackie Lee]

24 minutes ago, therealmjl said:

Darnold sucks. He is who he is. He had 3 games where he looked halfway decent. Other than that, he has never been good and his ceiling is NFL backup. That's just being real.

PJ with a week of starting reps was obviously more comfortable communicating with the line, better footwork, patient in the pocket, all around immediate upgrade. Cam and PJ definitely both want to play here next year if our FO ask them back, and the players seem to respond to them better than they ever did to Darnold. 4 and a half seasons is plenty of tape on Darnold to realize he doesn't have it

[Waldo]

1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

If you can't see it, none of us can make you see it.

So, enjoy continuing to believe there is a Santa Claus.

[panthers55]

3 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

If you can't see it, none of us can make you see it.

So, enjoy continuing to believe there is a Santa Claus.

What that Darnold is the answer? So far he isnt and that is obvious.  But the question is whether he will still be here next year. Based on contracts it would be yes but then again we dumped Bridgewater and ate a big chunk so we will move on quickly if we dont believe in you so there is that.   I want to see what Cam can do and if you dont believe in Santa Claus then how did we land Cam? Of course there is a Santa Claus and in the spirit of the season everyone declared good will to men  and came together for this Panthers Christmas and all is right in Pantherland.  The end..or just the beginning......

[Peon Awesome]

Some of the takes on here are so laughably bad I can hardly believe it. 

Who in their right mind would trade a 2nd round pick to get rid of Darnold? That is the most absurd thing I've heard. We have 1 of the best cap situations in the NFL. There is literally zero problem resigning whoever we want, even with Darnold's contract. The Saints were $90 million over the cap, barely cut anyone worth a damn and resigned a few key contributors in the process and still had a bit of caproom to spare. So why do we need to do a desperation move to free up cap we don't need? Also keep in mind that a good 2nd round pick brings in more than $18 million in excess value. Look at Chinn. He's got a 4 year, $5 million contract. How much would we spend on a veteran starting SS for 4 years that's even 80% as good as Chinn? At least $30 million. So the net value is easily $25+ million in that case. 

I would keep Sam as a backup unless someone surprises and offers a Bridgewater type compensation. You want to trade Darnold and a 7th for a conditional 6th while eating half the contract, ok whatever, I don't hate it. Otherwise keep him in the vein of Nick Foles in Chicago and move on in 2023. Darnold's problem is mostly mental. Have him spot start a couple games due to injury when there won't be any pressure or expectations and he could be ok. Plus if a starter on a contending team goes down with an injury before the trade deadline, maybe they'd give a late round pick out of desperation. Cutting Darnold for nothing and then having to spend even more to sign a different backup just doesn't make much sense.

[toldozer]

We're not trading picks to get rid of him much less good players.  We will just eat the money. we paid teddy to not be here this year and still fielded a great defense 

[Basbear]

Im not putting much thought into this, given the team is making a playoff/all-in playoff push.

Just the league may to allow rules to be changed. Cause right now the panthers are stuck with Darnold. I doubt any team wants him with his current value and 18mill contract. Best would be a "buy-out", but doing that hed have to take less than the 18....which the players union will not allow.....but he can not riot away on the bench either..... I think the panthers just have to finish the job.....no one is going to save you after bring home a ugly whale.... now seeing their profile form the refrigerator light as they stuff their face with cottage cheese..wait a minute...

[Jmac]

 He probably will not see the field again in a Panthers uniform. Tepper will eat the $$ and move on. That last shot of Teppers face during the Patriots game said it all.

Feel bad for Sam, but  that millions of dollars sitting in his bank account will stop the pain.

Edited November 17, 2021 by Jmac

[Evil Hurney]

I haven't seen it mentioned in this thread so I wanted to add it to the collective consciousness.

There is a chance that if the team were to cut Sam and he were to sign with a new team the Panthers would only owe the difference. I haven't been able to find the language in the CBA that talks about how guaranteed salary works in this regard, but I did hear it mentioned briefly by Florio on PFT.

Now don't get too excited. If this were true any team that would sign Sam would also know this and would likely only give him the veteran minimum since Sam gets his $18M either way.

Edited November 17, 2021 by Evil Hurney

[Evil Hurney]

Another minor thing to consider is if Sam stays on next season (2122) and hits FA the following season (2123) we can net a 6th or 7th round comp pick out of him assuming he signs a typical backup QB level contract.

[trueblade]

7 hours ago, Khyber53 said:

 

And we aren't getting that draft pick back either.

Not that I necessarily agree with them, but I would remind you that in Rhule and Fitterer's mind, we already have those picks back.

This is from during the draft:

We came into the day thinking we were going to get two players and we got three, and we picked up a four next year, so basically the Sam Darnold trade is paid off now," Rhule said. "So we got three players we really liked, but we've also paid off that trade."

source:https://www.panthers.com/news/panthers-nfl-draft-day-2-wrapup-trades-scott-fitterer-matt-rhule

Edited November 17, 2021 by trueblade