Matt Rhule being as honest as it will get

[chbright]

1 hour ago, kungfoodude said:

Yeah, it is amazing how inept we are on offense given the talent level. 

It just shows how much a bad QB and bad OL will do to tank a team. 

The offensive talent talk needs to be questioned too. With CMC out, at best it's a cut below average. Can't be great with 24 fuging drops, regardless of the QB or line.

Then the line is a pass rushers wet dream. 

I'm cool going back to a pound the rock idea. Even in the 2000s, it's won a lot of games and hell made it to SB and won a few. It's not the in thing, but can still work.

Less margin for error when you can't really quick strike, but provides the other team less opportunities if you can stay on the field and take away drives from the other team.

Unfortunately, I'm not sold the O-line can be dominant as a unit in the run game. Maybe they can even be a good one, but not solid after 1 game. If they turn in to the 2008 or 2015 units that can blow people off the ball, then there is a chance this all works. But I don't see this group being close to those units. 

[MVPccaffrey]

Pro:  He is very quick to see personnel mistakes after they happen

Con: He and Brady keep making these mistakes 

[kungfoodude]

Just now, PootieNunu said:

Not even a Darnold fanboy whatever the hell that is, im just pointing out the obvious that we need multiple players on O. 

Sam played a decent game Sunday littered with drops, one that would have been a TD early in the game on a dime in the back of the endzone. 

Sam made a dumb move near the end of the game by not sliding and got popped. 

Currently on O we have a #1 WR who half-assed it on Sunday. A RT, and maybe a TE. 

Sam played a decent game by Sam Darnold standards. He played a well below average game by NFL starter standards. 

I am not sure what game you were watching on Sunday but that was legit probably the best offensive line performance we have seen all year(not a high bar to hit, admittedly). The OL had nothing to do with Sam missing throws or being late on throws. 

The drops are a persistent issue but some of that blame is on the poor accuracy and poor timing that Sam has displayed. Definitely not all of it. We have a fleet of offensive players that just aren't making plays or executing when those drops happen. 

Sam Darnold is not being put in a position to succeed. Sam Darnold would likely not succeed even if he were in a position to succeed because he is not capable of seeing the field well enough to play QB in the NFL. That isn't a new problem, it's an entire career problem. 

[grimesgoat]

1 hour ago, kungfoodude said:

Yeah, it is amazing how inept we are on offense given the talent level. 

It just shows how much a bad QB and bad OL will do to tank a team. 

What talent level are you referring to?  We have an elite RB that has missed over half the season, a sub-par OL, a reclamation QB, a rookie TE, and two above average receivers that have forgotten how to catch.

Get CMC back and upgrade a couple of spots on the OL and I think things begin to look rosier.  Until then, we are a ground and pound team trying to win close defensive battles.  I say get on board.

[Kuhndog94]

1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

Sam played a decent game by Sam Darnold standards. He played a well below average game by NFL starter standards. 

I am not sure what game you were watching on Sunday but that was legit probably the best offensive line performance we have seen all year(not a high bar to hit, admittedly). The OL had nothing to do with Sam missing throws or being late on throws. 

The drops are a persistent issue but some of that blame is on the poor accuracy and poor timing that Sam has displayed. Definitely not all of it. We have a fleet of offensive players that just aren't making plays or executing when those drops happen. 

Sam Darnold is not being put in a position to succeed. Sam Darnold would likely not succeed even if he were in a position to succeed because he is not capable of seeing the field well enough to play QB in the NFL. That isn't a new problem, it's an entire career problem. 

Sam bringing his lunch pail to work and showing grit is enough for these folks. 

[Catsfan69]

8 minutes ago, TLGPanthersFan said:

Not sustainable. Better teams won’t let us do what we did yesterday. 

If you impose your will on them there's nothing they can do about it. 

It all comes down to execution. 

[kungfoodude]

4 minutes ago, chbright said:

The offensive talent talk needs to be questioned too. With CMC out, at best it's a cut below average. Can't be great with 24 fuging drops, regardless of the QB or line.

Then the line is a pass rushers wet dream. 

I'm cool going back to a pound the rock idea. Even in the 2000s, it's won a lot of games and hell made it to SB and won a few. It's not the in thing, but can still work.

Less margin for error when you can't really quick strike, but provides the other team less opportunities if you can stay on the field and take away drives from the other team.

Unfortunately, I'm not sold the O-line can be dominant as a unit in the run game. Maybe they can even be a good one, but not solid after 1 game. If they turn in to the 2008 or 2015 units that can blow people off the ball, then there is a chance this all works. But I don't see this group being close to those units. 

The talent is there, the execution isn't. It would be different if these guys didn't have a history of production. It would be different if it was just one guy but it's almost the entirety of the offense that is struggling with drops. That makes me believe there is something going on with that offense, even beyond the bad play of Darnold and the OL. 

I think the run first attack is basically about all we have left on that side of the ball. Our guys have been better in run blocking the entire season and when we gave them the opportunity to do that, they looked much better than in pass protection. I'd say roll with it until it is proven it doesn't work. poo, if CMC had been healthy he would have punished the Falcons. Some of those holes being blasted open were the biggest we have seen all year. 

But, it was also a bottom 2 rush defense in the NFL. TBD if that will work against a better team. Guess we will find out on Sunday....

[trueblade]

This is Sam's day against Atlanta.

[Jmac]

1 hour ago, kungfoodude said:

Yep. Another top notch defensive performance on Sunday should have put us back in the top 10 overall defenses and likely will be a top 5 pass defense unit. 

No reason to fight it, we are a run the ball and shut the other team down type of team. Same as the Fox era, same as the Rivera era.

You win or lose with what you got. If he had understood this four weeks ago, we might be above 500. right now. Invest one entire draft and the first pick the season after on defense.....duh.

[frankw]

20 minutes ago, PootieNunu said:

So the drop by DJ was not a throw into the endzone? Did you watch the game? Dropping TD passes is not a sustainable way to win games, you are right. 

The weapons on this offense suck. 

It does not do us much good when the guys cant catch the ball, what else can we do? Replacing the QB is not going to fix the WRs hands problems, The entire offense needs to be rebuilt like we did the D. 

 

12 minutes ago, PootieNunu said:

Now that I think about it we also tried to throw into the endzone later in the game as well but the OL collapsed before Sam had a chance to read anything and he threw it out the back of the endzone, anxiously awaiting your response, but I know you are going to disappear again. 

I was disappointed DJ didn't haul that in but we have struggled in the redzone all year. You chalk it up to a false assumption that our weapons "suck" but anyone with a hint of common sense and history with the team knows these same weapons had us in almost every game last year with even a qb like Bridgewater and the same coordinator. So with that in mind what do you think is the issue besides the blanket "they suck" statement? There are no issues with Sam's processing? His timing with the receivers? We know the oline isn't what it could or should be and Brady has gotten plenty of flack but even with time in the pocket Sam has thrown some of the worst picks I've seen since the QB carousel days of Panthers fandom.  What were your thoughts on the Giants game?

[kungfoodude]

4 minutes ago, grimesgoat said:

What talent level are you referring to?  We have an elite RB that has missed over half the season, a sub-par OL, a reclamation QB, a rookie TE, and two above average receivers that have forgotten how to catch.

Get CMC back and upgrade a couple of spots on the OL and I think things begin to look rosier.  Until then, we are a ground and pound team trying to win close defensive battles.  I say get on board.

You mean the WR working on his third straight 1000+ yard season? Or the other 1000+ yard WR from last year? Make no mistake, we have plenty of offensive weapons. We just don't have enough other competent pieces on offense for them to matter as much. 

Agreed on the ground and pound. Our defense is elite, just try to stay out of their way and not fug this up for them.

6 minutes ago, Kuhndog94 said:

Sam bringing his lunch pail to work and showing grit is enough for these folks. 

Yeah, he's tough and he is a nice dude. That's great....but the object is to be good at your job. He just isn't. 

I don't blame him, I blame Rhule and Fitterer. They traded for a bad QB. He didn't trade for himself.

[TLGPanthersFan]

7 minutes ago, Catsfan69 said:

If you impose your will on them there's nothing they can do about it. 

It all comes down to execution. 

You are hilariously misguided. But you keep thinking that a team with a bottom league offense can win a Super Bowl. 
 

[chbright]

1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

The talent is there, the execution isn't. It would be different if these guys didn't have a history of production. It would be different if it was just one guy but it's almost the entirety of the offense that is struggling with drops. That makes me believe there is something going on with that offense, even beyond the bad play of Darnold and the OL. 

I think the run first attack is basically about all we have left on that side of the ball. Our guys have been better in run blocking the entire season and when we gave them the opportunity to do that, they looked much better than in pass protection. I'd say roll with it until it is proven it doesn't work. poo, if CMC had been healthy he would have punished the Falcons. Some of those holes being blasted open were the biggest we have seen all year. 

But, it was also a bottom 2 rush defense in the NFL. TBD if that will work against a better team. Guess we will find out on Sunday....

Yeah idk how they all got the collective YIPS the last 5 weeks but good gosh it's been bad. That's been #1 WTF of the year. Other things kinda knew would happen along the course of the year. Bad games from QB and O-line sure, but the poo show from the WRS, no, didn't see that coming.

As for the CMC, personally, he just gets 20 of the touches, all of Abdullah's and Freeman's touches, some from Hubbard. Only real way those other 2 come in are for a blow for the top 2 guys depending on the situation.

Of note from yesterday: lot more heavy packages than before. And it lead to success. I'm cool with that. As long as Sam can hit the short 3rd down conversions and use the 1st down as an extension if the running game, it may work. On 2nd down, we need to make sure we get into 3rd and 5 or shorter to at least keep a team honest vs just rushing the passer.  If it's a sure as poo pass coming we are screwed ATM all around.

[PootieNunu]

2 minutes ago, frankw said:

 

I was disappointed DJ didn't haul that in but we have struggled in the redzone all year. You chalk it up to a false assumption that our weapons "suck" but anyone with a hint of common sense and history with the team knows these same weapons had us in almost every game last year with even a qb like Bridgewater and the same coordinator. So with that in mind what do you think is the issue besides the blanket "they suck" statement? There are no issues with Sam's processing? His timing with the receivers? We know the oline isn't what it could or should be and Brady has gotten plenty of flack but even with time in the pocket Sam has thrown some of the worst picks I've seen since the QB carousel days of Panthers fandom.  What were your thoughts on the Giants game?

Yes Sam has been slow to process. im not a Sam apologist. He has thrown some bad passes. The Giants game was a utter poo show, but it seemed like the benching lit a small fire under Sam. Do I want him to be the starter for the next 10 years? Hell no unless he improves by a lot. However, he is not the only problem on offense. 

When I list our offensive strengths I have not been listing QB. #1 WR. RT. maybe a TE in Tremble. The other guys are trash or rookies that need to develop.

I was just wondering why you said we did not throw the ball into the endzone once? did you mean successfully?