Next Gen Stats - How bad it really was

[mrcompletely11]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

Fitterer has been getting GM interviews for years.

The notion that Wilson ran him out of Seattle is one of the most uninformed and hilariously stupid things posted here.

I read his post as hyperbole, I dont think he was being serious

[L-TownCat]

7 minutes ago, Waldo said:

Drafting need blindly yes, taking positional value and need into consideration while making the draft board is essential.

Hurney locked on to his guys so I would say his evaluation  skills were a bigger problem then his drafting for need. Little should never have been on our draft board before the 5th, that was poor evaluation, dude was a first round pick that Burns saved us from making in Hurney's mind.

I still can’t figure out what info or photos or recordings Hurney has that keeps him in the NFL.

Fitty hasn’t even been here a full calendar year, a roster littered with holes, 1 draft and only 5 games in to his 1st season.  We’re 3-2.  The 2?  No CMC.  Weird…

The need for oline will still be there come draft time.  I bet we spend some cap and draft capital on that group.

[Mr. Scot]

1 minute ago, mrcompletely11 said:

I read his post as hyperbole, I dont think he was being serious

I'd like to hope not, but given the history with that poster it's not guaranteed.

[Raleigh PF]

3 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Yeah, I thought I understood the pick. I thought it was made with the intention of allowing us to let Anderson walk after this season and net us a nice comp pick in return while replacing Anderson with a guy in a cheap rookie contract. But then we extended Anderson and he disappeared so now I don't know WTF the plan was/is.

If we were planning to extend Anderson all along WR probably shouldn't have even been on the board in the 1st or 2nd rounds. Hell, maybe not even the 3rd unless some insane value was there.

Have to think they were worried about the impact of losing Samuel along with the value of Marshall at that draft position. I really think they believed the line would be "serviceable". And I'm sure they expected the Darnold to Anderson connection to improve. It also removed question marks from that area for a couple of years, in the same way they are doing that at CB. 

Unfortunately, the line has been a spectacular fail.

[Waldo]

8 minutes ago, L-TownCat said:

I still can’t figure out what info or photos or recordings Hurney has that keeps him in the NFL.

Fitty hasn’t even been here a full calendar year, a roster littered with holes, 1 draft and only 5 games in to his 1st season.  We’re 3-2.  The 2?  No CMC.  Weird…

The need for oline will still be there come draft time.  I bet we spend some cap and draft capital on that group.

It's early but we can still do a limited evaluation of Frtts. His FAs were bust, exactly as advertised. He under prioritized the oline, especially with trading for Darnold and his needs. He ignored tape and player stats of guys in the league at least 3 years, which is more than enough and a lot more than any draft pick. He is way to reliant on guys with huge injury flags. Now we get to see how he adjust to this and where he ends up as a GM. Good news is that all of this is fixable stuff.

[philit99]

3 hours ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

And people gave me grief for being upset we took Marshall in the 2nd over a quality OL, even after I made it clear my problem wasn't with Marshall but with continuing to ignore the OL til later rounds. Let's take a quick poll, who would trade Marshall right now for a quality interior lineman?

I believe Marshall being drafted was a 3D chess move against the Saints. It was known that Marshall was extremely high on their board and with Michael Thomas having questions and issues, it made sense. It still does. We made our bed this year, it is still not over. There is a long ways to go in the season.

[LinvilleGorge]

21 minutes ago, Raleigh PF said:

Have to think they were worried about the impact of losing Samuel along with the value of Marshall at that draft position. I really think they believed the line would be "serviceable". And I'm sure they expected the Darnold to Anderson connection to improve. It also removed question marks from that area for a couple of years, in the same way they are doing that at CB. 

Unfortunately, the line has been a spectacular fail.

Honestly, I think that's it. I think they had Marshall valued significantly higher than any of the OL available and they thought the vet bandaids would be good enough to get by. They weren't when healthy and now the injury prone vets are predictably injured. Swing and a miss. x2.

 

[Jmac]

4 hours ago, BrianS said:

It's all on the interior.  If you can't anchor, your whole line looks bad.  Tackles can't do their job because a lot of their technique revolves around ushering the edge player upfield past the QB, or to a point where the QB can simply step up.  Whole thing breaks down when the pressure is up the gut.

The three turnstiles in the middle are a real problem. The tackles I think will be okay in the long run. One rookie and a quality player on the other side. the center and guards need to be replaced asap....sadly not many options at this point.

[Mr. Scot]

4 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I think they had Marshall valued significantly higher than any of the OL available and they thought the vet bandaids would be good enough to get by. They weren't when healthy and now the injury prone vets are predictably injured. Swing and a miss. x2.

I've said multiple times that I think this year's veteran signings were meant to be stopgaps while we tried to build the line through the draft.

Unfortunately, it looks like some may not even be "stopgap" quality.

Don't know if we'll look at free agents on the line next year, but if we do we'll have Dan Morgan in the fold to help. His background is in pro personnel. Fitterer is a draft guy.

Edited October 11, 2021 by Mr. Scot

[Jon Snow]

2 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

I've said multiple times that I think this year's veteran signings were meant to be stopgaps while we tried to build the line through the draft.

Unfortunately, it looks like some may not even be "stopgap" quality.

I'm not even sure you could classify them as speed bumps. 

[onmyown]

4 hours ago, Mage said:

The only offensive line in Panthers history that I can remember being worse, is 2014.  

Isn't that crazy though?  For as bad as this OL is, I STILL don't think it is half as bad as the one that year.  At least until Norwell and Turner started later in the season.  

The line the majority of the season IIRC

Byron Bell

Amini Silatolu

Ryan Kalil

Fernando Velasco

Nate Chandler

Now the question is does this team have any Norwell/Turner's they can insert into the line-up late in the season?  I'd say our only hope is Deonte Brown.  Play Moton/Brady at the tackles spot, hope Brown works out at guard, allows us to move Erving to the other guard position.  That leaves Paradis but not much we can do about that.  

Believe it or not, statistically this year is worse by about 3 spots (that 2014 oline was ranked 22 this one 25).

Of course that was before this latest game…

You’re looking at competition for the worst in the NFL…and worst in Panthers Franchise history. 

[Eazy-E]

Yeah guys were fine. There definitely isn’t a single available free agent that can do better than that poo.

[Mage]

12 minutes ago, onmyown said:

Believe it or not, statistically this year is worse by about 3 spots (that 2014 oline was ranked 22 this one 25).

Of course that was before this latest game…

You’re looking at competition for the worst in the NFL…and worst in Panthers Franchise history. 

Eye test tells me that line was worse.  

Let's not forget the Thursday Night Massacre in Philadelphia in 2014.  There has never, ever been a single game performance by the OL worse than that one, at least in Panthers history.  I still can't believe that team rallied and made the playoffs.

Newton before the last two garbage time drives had 0 TDs, 3 INTs, probably around 180-200 yards, and had been sacked 9 times.  And probably hit on every single snap.  A running game with Stew and Williams could barely do anything.  

The OL has been horrible, but hasn't had a "signature" game like that yet.  But if any unit could do it, its them. 

[Mr. Scot]

Continuously changing lineups hasn't helped.

That said, changes are still warranted. If nothing else, Dennis Daley badly needs to be benched.