Rashawn Slater

[Swaggasaurus]

Not surprised. Loved Slater and he already whooped that WFT guy in college. If he struggles it will be with the Burns type 

[kungfoodude]

1 hour ago, MasterAwesome said:

If your success largely hinges on your quarterback play, then you have to acknowledge that an elite CB significantly hinders the success of the opposing QB which is equally important to winning football.  Otherwise you're just hoping to win shootouts every week.  I mean it really just boils down to having a well-oiled offense vs. a shutdown defense.  A shutdown CB is as vital to your defense as a shutdown OT is to your offense.

Also an elite LT is obviously super important but the returns are less realized when you have other major holes in your o-line, otherwise you're just getting exploited elsewhere (like up the middle for us).  If an LT was the missing piece for us then yeah maybe Jalen Ramsey would be having to cover for 5+ seconds out there.  That being said, same goes for CB...but I would argue Horn kinda was the missing piece for our defense to a much larger degree than Slater would be the missing piece for our o-line.  Finding an LT would have gone a long way towards solidifying our o-line but I think that's something we would have benefited from more in the next couple seasons after one or two more drafts/FAs, to fill our other o-line voids.

All things equal, I'd probably still take an elite LT over an elite CB just due to the conceptual risk mitigation of injury to your QB.  I just don't think it's the slam-dunk obvious choice that people make it out to be.

Sure, just as much as if you don't have any pass rush, having elite CB's isn't going to accomplish much.

It's acknowledged that one elite player doesn't make a team. We all know that.

The point is that it is literally generally accepted wisdom that LT is a FAR more critical position than CB. The reasons stated in my previous post lay out why that is even more so the case in the modern era of the NFL. This doesn't mean that CB is important but it isn't as important as LT.

[MasterAwesome]

4 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Sure, just as much as if you don't have any pass rush, having elite CB's isn't going to accomplish much.

It's acknowledged that one elite player doesn't make a team. We all know that.

The point is that it is literally generally accepted wisdom that LT is a FAR more critical position than CB. The reasons stated in my previous post lay out why that is even more so the case in the modern era of the NFL. This doesn't mean that CB is important but it isn't as important as LT.

Yeah which is why I catered my argument to our team so we could have a bit more nuanced of a discussion rather than appealing to conventional wisdom.  We do have a pass rush so an elite CB is going to accomplish a lot.  We don't have a good interior o-line so an elite LT is not going to accomplish as much.

[Clicheking]

Not gonna lie Slater was my choice given how the draft played out before our pick, but I think Horn is gonna be a stud. 

I'd be willing to bet the front office had Slater rated highly on their board but went with Horn because of measurables.  The new regime seems to be all about RAS, and looking the part.

 

[ForJimmy]

I think we were just more confident in Horn being elite vs Slater. Lower Risk/Still High Reward and he addressed one of our biggest issues last year. Getting off the field on 3rd down.

[OldhamA]

4 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

I think we were just more confident in Horn being elite vs Slater. Lower Risk/Still High Reward and he addressed one of our biggest issues last year. Getting off the field on 3rd down.

This is why I'm always about filling holes in FA and drafting BPA in the Draft. To me there's nothing worse (besides a complete bust) than looking back at a Draft and thinking "Man, Jonathan Stewart was good, but we could have had Calais Campbell" (or DeSean Jackson or Duane Brown or... you get the idea). 

It's also why we've had a few misfires in FA under Rhule - we brought in a low priced FA, only for a better player to be available at his position in the Draft. YGM and Weatherly being the prime example.

 

[ForJimmy]

5 minutes ago, OldhamA said:

This is why I'm always about filling holes in FA and drafting BPA in the Draft. To me there's nothing worse (besides a complete bust) than looking back at a Draft and thinking "Man, Jonathan Stewart was good, but we could have had Calais Campbell" (or DeSean Jackson or Duane Brown or... you get the idea). 

It's also why we've had a few misfires in FA under Rhule - we brought in a low priced FA, only for a better player to be available at his position in the Draft. YGM and Weatherly being the prime example.

 

I have a feeling our staff thought Erving was good enough at LT. After we traded for Darnold Fitts was saying we can now draft BPA (implying our needs were somewhat met) If you are drafting in the top 10 you really don’t want a player with a higher risk. We did it last year with Brown and the year before with Burns and CMC several years ago. Lowest risk with a high reward. You have to hit on those players. Slater played G and RT at NW and didn’t play LT until his final year. There were also a few issues with his measurements when scouting. Horn looked and played like an elite CB against elite competition with an elite bloodline for several years in a row.

[OldhamA]

5 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

I have a feeling our staff thought Erving was good enough at LT. After we traded for Darnold Fitts was saying we can now draft BPA (implying our needs were somewhat met) If you are drafting in the top 10 you really don’t want a player with a higher risk. We did it last year with Brown and the year before with Burns and CMC several years ago. Lowest risk with a high reward. You have to hit on those players. Slater played G and RT at NW and didn’t play LT until his final year. There were also a few issues with his measurements when scouting. Horn looked and played like an elite CB against elite competition with an elite bloodline for several years in a row.

Slater also sat out a year and declined an invite to the Senior Bowl. 

It is what it is - I'm very happy with the Horn pick. He's a big, physical, fast CB to put on the opposition's big, physical and fast #1 WR. When you're trying to improve your pass defence that's a godsend. 

[kungfoodude]

2 hours ago, MasterAwesome said:

Yeah which is why I catered my argument to our team so we could have a bit more nuanced of a discussion rather than appealing to conventional wisdom.  We do have a pass rush so an elite CB is going to accomplish a lot.  We don't have a good interior o-line so an elite LT is not going to accomplish as much.

That's drafting for need versus BPA. Our needs are extreme so it does make more sense to draft BPA, IMO. In truth, there is no "pure" BPA drafting, because you don't want to end up with 5 straight WR's or some other goofy poo.

IMO, Slater is who I would have drafted because the need was higher and I liked him more as a prospect. We will see how that all turns out.

[jayboogieman]

5 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

That's drafting for need versus BPA. Our needs are extreme so it does make more sense to draft BPA, IMO. In truth, there is no "pure" BPA drafting, because you don't want to end up with 5 straight WR's or some other goofy poo.

IMO, Slater is who I would have drafted because the need was higher and I liked him more as a prospect. We will see how that all turns out.

The only time I can recall seeing a pure BPA drafting situation was the 76ers a few years back in the NBA draft. They took a center three years in a row with top five picks.

[TrevorLaurenceTime22]

I still like the choice, I think we are a lot closer to an elite defense.... 

[trueblade]

Might be a name to keep an eye on.

 

[run-run-pass-punt]

You can't draft everyone. All teams - even the top teams - must contend with weaknesses in their roster. You've got to scheme around the soft spots as best you are able. That will always be true.

That said, it's high time to prioritize the o-line imho. I hope we finally see some real attention given this next off-season.

[CarolinaRideorDie]

21 hours ago, Jon Snow said:

Who thought that? I've not heard the team say that one time.

Not the Panthers team, but the Huddle.