Is this accurate?

[TheCasillas]

10 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

again a competent LT is 20x more valuable than a competent corner

 

 

20x is egregious. The ranking of value by position is 

1. QB

2. DE

3. OT

4. CB

5. WR

 

they are back to back on the value charts. You can tell by contract structures, and draft priorities. This you can Google easily, and here is a good deep dive breakdown.

http://www.footballperspective.com/analyzing-position-values-in-the-nfl/

[4Corners]

Not sure why Okung wasn’t brought back

[AU-panther]

37 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

A competent starting left tackle is light years more valuable than a competent starting corner.  Its not even in the same discussion.  And this is coming from someone that loves Horn but if Slater turns out to be an above average LT then we done fuged up in not picking him for some stupid reason that his arms were a quarter inch too short. 

Based on what exactly?

there has actually been some analytics that has tried to quantify such, much like baseball with the idea of WAR rating.  The numbers are closer than you would think.

 

[Jon Snow]

37 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

A competent starting left tackle is light years more valuable than a competent starting corner.  Its not even in the same discussion.  And this is coming from someone that loves Horn but if Slater turns out to be an above average LT then we done fuged up in not picking him for some stupid reason that his arms were a quarter inch too short. 

We weren't the only team that passed on him.  You can play that what if game with every prospect.   The cards don't always fall you way so you play the hand you're dealt.  I'm not complaining about how it turned out.  

[Double Trouble]

2 minutes ago, AU-panther said:

Based on what exactly?

there has actually been some analytics that has tried to quantify such, much like baseball with the idea of WAR rating.  The numbers are closer than you would think.

 

Based on Super Bowl 50   (and SB 55, go Remmers!)

[ForJimmy]

Erving played better than I thought he would. Hopefully Miller will be back and Paradis can play like he did in stretches last year. Elf will be our weakness until our staff brings in the young guns.

[AU-panther]

2 minutes ago, Double Trouble said:

Based on Super Bowl 50   (and SB 55, go Remmers!)

I’m not sure 2 games counts as statistically compelling.

Even with all of the pressure that Tampa bay got on Mahomes  he was still often able to buy time and get good passes off, just so happened his receivers were still covered.

 

[Double Trouble]

21 minutes ago, AU-panther said:

I’m not sure 2 games counts as statistically compelling.

Even with all of the pressure that Tampa bay got on Mahomes  he was still often able to buy time and get good passes off, just so happened his receivers were still covered.

 

I was more lamenting than trying to give you a "statistical compelling" case. We should probably consider drafting a LT in the first round for the first time post Jordan Gross retirement however.  Pretty discouraging that we haven't made a real attempt at addressing the position when it single handedly lost us a super bowl. 

And given the state of our roster, I'd rather spend a top 10 pick on a LT for a young QB than spend it on a corner when we have a great pass rush.  Horn should be a great player and CB is no doubt important with that said.

Edited September 14, 2021 by Double Trouble

[jayboogieman]

1 hour ago, CRA said:

this is Rhule’s 2nd year.  And inherited his only legit lineman in Moton.    He bears some responsibility for the present day starting OL still just being Moton and garbage. 

 

Yep. He's had two drafts and two free agent periods to add more talent to the OL. Granted, we don't know everyone they targeted, so they may have just struck out on who they really wanted.

[jayboogieman]

1 hour ago, pantherclaw said:

Ya don't reach. 

Period. 

Slater wouldn't have been a reach. By most accounts he was 1B to Sewell's 1A in the draft and considered on a higher level than the other OT prospects.

[jayboogieman]

1 hour ago, KillerKat said:

Incorrect.

Imagine our CB depth now without Horn. In a passing league, especially in our division, it's good to have a shut down corner on your team. 

A good front four on defense can mask CB play. The Panthers have done that for years. That said, CB was almost as big a need as LT and had been ignored for as long if not longer while the prior regimes kept investing in the front four. Also, there are no shutdown corners anymore. The rules have seen to that. And even if you want to say there are shutdown corners, it's way too early in Horn's career to claim he is one. One good performance against a first year rebuilding team with a rookie QB doesn't mean it's time to crown him.

And since I never get tired of this, 

 

[pantherj]

Going into the draft most Huddlers thought we were going to take Slater. This was kind of a no brainer given our o-line situation. Stunningly we took Horn with only a few Huddlers thinking that was going to happen.

I'm an o-line is more important than CB guy.

Rhule has a plan for the o-line, but I'm not crazy about it. CMC has been told to keep an eye on the A and B gaps on passing key passing downs and pick up anyone busting through wearing the wrong color. On the pass play to Robby for a TD CMC did as he was told and blocked an enormous JETS pass rusher to give Darnold time. Rhule was beaming afterwards and kept repeating to anyone who would listen that it was CMC's best play of the game.

The problem with using CMC beside Darnold for pass protecting is that he ends up getting beat up fighting for dear life against monstrous pass rushers. This could lead to a CMC injury, but we're running out of options for what to do to help the o-line.

Edited September 14, 2021 by pantherj

[Jon Snow]

14 minutes ago, jayboogieman said:

Yep. He's had two drafts and two free agent periods to add more talent to the OL. Granted, we don't know everyone they targeted, so they may have just struck out on who they really wanted.

This^ It doesn't matter who you target its who you end up with.  If your coaching is worth a damn you will make do.

I always laugh at those that say they've ignored the o-line and more specifically the LT.  They haven't ignored it, they are throwing whoever they can find worth a damn at it since Rhule got here.  But you see the problem is this team needed so much more than the LT position addressed.

I would love to see a list of these players that are out there just dying on the vine everyone laments about. Those folks act like its raining All-Pro LT's and our front office is standing outside with an umbrella. 

As for the draft, it just didn't fall our way on that front.  We are too depleted of talent to give up more picks for a chance on just one position.  We didn’t have that luxury this year.   We still need more draft picks for the upcoming draft by the way. 

So fo the TL/dr crowed, we are not where you think we are in this rebuild.

[Proudiddy]

I think he is overconfident in his ability to develop players.  Some guys just are who they are, and Irving and Elflein are those type of guys.