Carolina Panthers Training Camp - Sunday Thread

[SBBlue]

9 hours ago, stbugs said:

This is not true at all. That’s what we heard about Little as well and I posted all of the day 2 picks that year that got significant starts their rookie years. Saying that rookie OL that excel is the exception isn’t correct. There were tons of starters in the 2019 day 2 picks. In 2020, there were 7 day two picks (I ignored comp picks and the guy who opted out for COVID) since BC was an early 3rd. 3 of the 7 were drafted before BC’s slot and 4 of the 7 after.

5 of the 7 were considered starters and started a minimum of 9 games. One non-starter was a raw T and the other was drafted as a backup on Atlanta whose OL starters were already set. Considering BC has below average OL in front of him, he’s got a great chance to start if he’s really good. Again, it’s not rare for OL rookie starters unless you are talking about day 4/UDFA players.

I agree with the premise that it is not rare for day-2 olineman to start games.  But mixing C, G and OT muddies the water a little bit, and not sure why exclude comp-picks.   There were no day-1 guards last year, meaning a day-2 guard was the best in the draft.

Looking specifically at tackles in 2020, there were 4  in day 2.  Here are the number of games started in 2020:

Ezra Cleveland:9
Josh Jones:0
Lucas Niang :0
Matt Peart :1


 

Edited August 9, 2021 by SBBlue

[SBBlue]

9 hours ago, stbugs said:

If BC is a solid player, he should start most of our games. If he doesn’t with Elflein and Miller in front of him, that’s a bad sign considering that a majority of recent day 2 picks start as rookie. I can’t imagine more opportune scenarios for a rookie than our OL outside of Moton. Kind of like Little not being able to beat out the crap in front of him at LT in 2019.

Oline starts are often dictated by injury in addition to merit.

Moton barely played his rookie year, let a lone start.  The next year he started every game at RT.  

I've heard BC is taking reps behind Moton.  Has BC taken reps at guard?  If not, I don't think we should expect him to take Miller or Elflein spots.
 
 

[Pup McBarky]

2 minutes ago, stbugs said:

If BC was regarded as a 2nd round G by us, that’s a top G in the draft since Gs don’t usually go round 1. A G with a 2nd round grade should be expected to beat out Elflein or Miller. They aren’t exactly studs. It would be disappointing if he’s not starting by mid-season even without injuries.

I agree with this. If instead of drafting Marshall, we had picked Wyatt Davis, for example, we'd expect him to start at G without question. 

[SBBlue]

6 minutes ago, stbugs said:

Rhule said they graded him as a 2nd round G and a 3rd round T. I believe he’s gotten reps at both. I’m not spending the time to go through injuries but day 1/day 2 OL, especially IOL are expected to win jobs and start and many do start from day 1 and are successful. In the 5 of 7 2020 rookie starters I mentioned, 3 were 16 game starters.

If BC was regarded as a 2nd round G by us, that’s a top G in the draft since Gs don’t usually go round 1. A G with a 2nd round grade should be expected to beat out Elflein or Miller. They aren’t exactly studs. It would be disappointing if he’s not starting by mid-season even without injuries.

Also, don’t get me wrong that I’m already down on him. Sure, it would be awesome to hear he was ripping up camp, but I’m just saying that if he doesn’t get it by mid-season then I’d be very worried he won’t ever because he is 24 and he doesn’t have good players. Atlanta drafted Hennessy at C let in round 3 in 2020 (after BC’s slot) and I wouldn’t have said the same about him because there was only one slot (Carpenter’s) where he even had a shot to start. He wasn’t beating our Mack or Lindstrom. If BC was 

Also, to address your Moton didn’t start note. He was great as the e

Rhule said last week he really sees him as a tackle and right now BC is taking reps on the right, which means he's behind Moton.    I guess we'll see how much and where he starts.     

[SBBlue]

11 minutes ago, SBBlue said:

Rhule said last week he really sees him as a tackle and right now BC is taking reps on the right, which means he's behind Moton.    I guess we'll see how much and where he starts.     

Apparently it wasn't last week.  Sorry about that.  It was in June, so who knows where he'll end up.

[shaqattaq]

21 hours ago, Captain Morgan said:

 

 

 

 

Well, I guess you can take Monteiro off the list vying for RT too, lol.

[shaqattaq]

21 hours ago, Captain Morgan said:

Bill Voth

 

@PanthersBill

·

1h

 

Sam Darnold to Ian Thomas in back of EZ during red zone drill. Came shortly after Darnold connected with Dan Arnold. Obviously, more TE production this year would be ideal.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Bill Voth

 

@PanthersBill

·

1h

 

Sean Chandler stuffs run. Defense celebrates. Don’t know yet how likely it is he makes roster, but he’s made plays this camp.

 

 

My eyes are going bad. That was Ivey, and not Moton, that Reddick smoked, right?

[shaqattaq]

21 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Might be the best use of a decently skilled but seemingly fragile player.

that statement could apply to Daley, Erving, Elflien...

[SBBlue]

24 minutes ago, stbugs said:

It would be good to know where they stand because during the draft show they were clear that they graded him as a 2nd round G and a 3rd round tackle. If they get to a point where they don’t think he’s a guard that would be disappointing because as we saw, it’s easier to start on the interior and often that can be step 1 as the rookie learns/gets better at tackle. It would also say that we aren’t very good at grading OL and if Slater excels at LT there will be more upset people in here. 

So many people are upset over everything from QB to the oline....oh well.   Some wanted us to pick oline the first 3 rounds.   Horn, Marshal and the picks we gained from trading down, may all ball out and they will still be upset.

Apparently Pat Meyer, Rhule and Fit think we are all underestimating Erving and Elflein.   They coached up Scott, so I guess we'll see. 

 

[frankw]

5 minutes ago, SBBlue said:

So many people are upset over everything from QB to the oline....oh well.

Some of it is reasonable some not. But in total fairness it is highly relevant as it has been a thorn in our sides going back a decade and has already cost us one franchise quarterback.

[kungfoodude]

1 hour ago, SBBlue said:

Apparently it wasn't last week.  Sorry about that.  It was in June, so who knows where he'll end up.

That is another rather concerning thing about BC. The staff seems to have a less than clear idea about what they want to do with him. I know they seem very attached to the idea of versatility, which I don't disagree with for depth OL, but I would like to think they had SOME idea of what he was before they drafted him. It seems more like they just like him as an athlete and expected to plug him in wherever they could.

That isn't a strategy that will works as easily in the NFL as it does college(where it is rather common). 

[shaqattaq]

18 hours ago, MHS831 said:

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.

Seriously--a philosophy major?  I was English Lit. 

Me too. That explains all the grammar corrections.

[shaqattaq]

17 hours ago, saX man said:

So the OL has actualized a bit more this camp.  Barring signings or injuries it’s looking like:

Erving-Elflein-Paradis-Miller-Moton

Swing backups: 6-Daley (T/G), 7-Scott (T/G), 8-Brady (G), 9-Deonte (G)
backup center: Tecklenberg?

Sounds like Daley v Miller and Scott v Erving are the battles remaining for LT and RG.

Don’t love that Elflein signing but we’ll see what shakes out.

Tecklenberg? That can't be right. My guess would be that Elfein is the back up center, although I haven't heard anything about him taking snaps there in camp. He is mysteriously listed on the roster as OL.

[saX man]

1 minute ago, shaqattaq said:

Tecklenberg? That can't be right. My guess would be that Elfein is the back up center, although I haven't heard anything about him taking snaps there in camp. He is mysteriously listed on the roster as OL.

Yeah I'm just curious who the go to is in case of Paradis getting roughed up at some point.  Was looking through things and haven't heard who the C is in the second team drills.