Shi and the senior bowl.

[SBBlue]

25 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

TE usage in their passing game was still rather low. Especially compared to some of the NFL offenses with elite TE's in the NFL.

Its true that its nothing like Olson or Gronk.   I still expect Arnold and Tremble to see more passing action than Thomas.

[OldhamA]

38 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

TE usage in their passing game was still rather low. Especially compared to some of the NFL offenses with elite TE's in the NFL.

The dude had two first round picks and a second round pick at WR. Not to mention a first round pick at RB.

There's only one ball. Moss was an UDFA for a reason. 

[kungfoodude]

6 minutes ago, OldhamA said:

The dude had two first round picks and a second round pick at WR. Not to mention a first round pick at RB.

There's only one ball. Moss was an UDFA for a reason. 

Yeah, similar to here. Pretty sure that is why we have JAGS at TE. We need them to fit a role, not carry the load.

[1of10Charnatives]

7 hours ago, SBBlue said:

Barring injury, by end of season, Christiansen will be starting somewhere on that line.  

That's not a foregone conclusion. It might happen, or he might disappoint. Declaring that mid 3rd round picks will start by season's end is just trying to make your hope sound like you know something others don't.

You don't. 

Neither do I.

Nothing would make me happier than for Christensen to blossom into a long term starter and believe me when I say that I hope so every bit as fervently as you do, probably more. My ire is about the draft choices revealing that despite the change in leadership and the blatantly obvious cautionary tale of Cam's career, the Panthers are STILL content to gamble with protecting the qb, rather than make it an organizational priority.

Show me the offseason move that says otherwise.

I'll wait.

[kungfoodude]

3 minutes ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

That's not a foregone conclusion. It might happen, or he might disappoint. Declaring that mid 3rd round picks will start by season's end is just trying to make your hope sound like you know something others don't.

You don't. 

Neither do I.

Nothing would make me happier than for Christensen to blossom into a long term starter and believe me when I say that I hope so every bit as fervently as you do, probably more. My ire is about the draft choices revealing that despite the change in leadership and the blatantly obvious cautionary tale of Cam's career, the Panthers are STILL content to gamble with protecting the qb, rather than make it an organizational priority.

Show me the offseason move that says otherwise.

I'll wait.

In fairness, we also still don't have a franchise QB, so we won't be sacrificing someone of Cam's caliber. 

Still, I don't see why you trade for a guy to get pummeled in his first(and likely last) year with us.

[1of10Charnatives]

5 hours ago, OldhamA said:

That's not what the Draft is for.

They didn't even have Slater on the board at #8. Would you rather they reach for a position of need or pick a player that the think is going to be an All-Pro?

They picked up contributors all across the board and three rookie OLinemen to add to the shuffle. Added to our two ex-first round OL we picked up in FA and that's five new names on the OLine. 

They consider Christensen a 2nd round OG off the bat (they'll let him fail at LT first), many had Brown as a Day 2 pick (his discipline around his weight will make or break his career) and Moore looked like one on the better OLineman at the Senior Bowl when they moved him to C.

That's a fine haul for one off-season. Get them in the building, work out what everyone does best in TC and see where you stand come Sept.

The draft is not for addressing your needs?

I see what you're saying I guess because of how easy it is to acquire a quality starting LT in FA or via trade without giving up your first born and your left hand, your near mint copy of Incredible Hulk 181 (yes I have one, no you can't touch it) and your Honas Wagner.

Nowhere did I say we should reach, but surely it didn't escape your notice that Mr. Fitterer seemed unafraid of trading down in this draft, yet didn't do so in the first two rounds to position ourselves for an appropriate prospect whether Slater or someone else. Instead yet again the organization prioritized other positions, some of which were not exactly desperate needs (Marshall might turn out great, but take him out of this draft and tell me our WR corps doesn't still look good).

You can make positive or negative comments about any draft pick, and overall I'm excited about what we did in the draft, but no amount of spin will change the fact that we didn't make the OL a priority commensurate with the level of need. Fitterer made a lot of deals, yet stood pat with the first two picks and went elsewhere. That could come back to bite us in the arse. 

[1of10Charnatives]

12 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

In fairness, we also still don't have a franchise QB, so we won't be sacrificing someone of Cam's caliber. 

Still, I don't see why you trade for a guy to get pummeled in his first(and likely last) year with us.

My default estimate of Darnold's chances of turning things around here is higher than yours, but part and parcel of the best assessment possible on him as a prospect was to put as quality a line in front of him as possible. IMO it is less likely that Marshall as a rookie in this WR corps is a more meaningful factor in that process than the best OL prospect we could have had instead of him would be.

[mrcompletely11]

Just now, 1of10Charnatives said:

My default estimate of Darnold's chances of turning things around here is higher than yours, but part and parcel of the best assessment possible on him as a prospect was to put as quality a line in front of him as possible. IMO it is less likely that Marshall as a rookie in this WR corps is a more meaningful factor in that process than the best OL prospect we could have had instead of him would be.

The last 2 qb's that brady has worked with have had career years so yeah I am optimistic as well.

[kungfoodude]

2 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

The last 2 qb's that brady has worked with have had career years so yeah I am optimistic as well.

In fairness, that bar isn't high.

[mrcompletely11]

3 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

In fairness, that bar isn't high.

eh, I am a simple person........

[OldhamA]

52 minutes ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

The draft is not for addressing your needs?

I see what you're saying I guess because of how easy it is to acquire a quality starting LT in FA or via trade without giving up your first born and your left hand, your near mint copy of Incredible Hulk 181 (yes I have one, no you can't touch it) and your Honas Wagner.

Nowhere did I say we should reach, but surely it didn't escape your notice that Mr. Fitterer seemed unafraid of trading down in this draft, yet didn't do so in the first two rounds to position ourselves for an appropriate prospect whether Slater or someone else. Instead yet again the organization prioritized other positions, some of which were not exactly desperate needs (Marshall might turn out great, but take him out of this draft and tell me our WR corps doesn't still look good).

You can make positive or negative comments about any draft pick, and overall I'm excited about what we did in the draft, but no amount of spin will change the fact that we didn't make the OL a priority commensurate with the level of need. Fitterer made a lot of deals, yet stood pat with the first two picks and went elsewhere. That could come back to bite us in the arse. 

You can keep your comic book.

The Draft is about acquiring talent. Free Agency is about addressing needs. Sometimes the two align.

If you go into the Draft NEEDING something then 9/10 you're starting off on the wrong foot. 

As I stated in my previous comment, Fitterer and Rhule brought in two ex-first round picks for the OLine, both of whom are still in their 20s. They're both far more talented, physically, than guys we had in 2020. They then spent an old 'Day 1' pick on a guy they hope can play OT, but are certain can start at OG.

Bar ignoring their Big Board and just taking any old OLineman in the first round (we traded down in the second round - evidently we didn't fancy Teven Jenkins or Liam Eichenberg), I don't know how they could have appeased you. 

[SBBlue]

2 hours ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

That's not a foregone conclusion. It might happen, or he might disappoint. Declaring that mid 3rd round picks will start by season's end is just trying to make your hope sound like you know something others don't.

You don't. 

Neither do I.

Nothing would make me happier than for Christensen to blossom into a long term starter and believe me when I say that I hope so every bit as fervently as you do, probably more. My ire is about the draft choices revealing that despite the change in leadership and the blatantly obvious cautionary tale of Cam's career, the Panthers are STILL content to gamble with protecting the qb, rather than make it an organizational priority.

Show me the offseason move that says otherwise.

I'll wait.

You're right...and I may be too.  We'll find out.

[1of10Charnatives]

1 hour ago, OldhamA said:

You can keep your comic book.

The Draft is about acquiring talent. Free Agency is about addressing needs. Sometimes the two align.

If you go into the Draft NEEDING something then 9/10 you're starting off on the wrong foot. 

As I stated in my previous comment, Fitterer and Rhule brought in two ex-first round picks for the OLine, both of whom are still in their 20s. They're both far more talented, physically, than guys we had in 2020. They then spent an old 'Day 1' pick on a guy they hope can play OT, but are certain can start at OG.

Bar ignoring their Big Board and just taking any old OLineman in the first round (we traded down in the second round - evidently we didn't fancy Teven Jenkins or Liam Eichenberg), I don't know how they could have appeased you. 

Every team goes into the draft needing something, the difference is only a matter of degrees. Yes I'm well aware that drafting out of desperation because you HAVE to fill need X is a bad formula, so don't strawman me like you did last post and imply that's what I was advocating. As for your having no idea how they could have appeased me, I think I made it pretty clear that trading down to more appropriate spots for appropriate prospects would have been fine, or is it your contention that between Sewell and Christiansen there is no OL prospect worth pursuing? Really?

Seems like you're putting a lot more faith into Cam Erving than most would. A former first rounder on his fourth team in six years doesn't scream problem solved to me, or even solid move. It seems more like the thing you do if your heart's not into prioritizing the Oline, but you know you have to sign somebody or you really will be forced to actually draft a starter in the first two rounds.

Look, I think we got hosed when the Lions took Sewell at 7. I was stuck in some godforsaken Buffalo Wild Wings in Roanoke of all places and for a good 10 minutes I thought we were golden after the Dolphins didn't take him.  Detroit has done so much wrong for so long, why couldn't they have just drafted Barry Sanders or Megatron all over again instead of making everyone listen to me scream epithets at the Ford family and throw my wing bones at some chucklehead wearing a Brady Patriots jersey (Why? Because @#$% that guy, that's why).

But...

There were 9, count them NINE tackles taken between Sewell and Christiansen, and you're telling me that you have so much faith in New Locker of the Month Club member Cam Erving, so little regard for all nine of those prospects, and think that our WR corps would have been in shambles had we not drafted Marshall in the 2nd, that you can't conceive of the most trade happy GM of the draft making one or two more moves earlier to acquire one of those prospects, or that such a move would be ill advised and we're better off crossing our fingers and hoping yet again that what we got is good enough?

[SBBlue]

41 minutes ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

There were 9, count them NINE tackles taken between Sewell and Christiansen, and you're telling me that you have so much faith in New Locker of the Month Club member Cam Erving, so little regard for all nine of those prospects

We traded up and drafted Greg Little high in the 2nd and it appears we whiffed.  Draft position does not equal performance.  We brought in pro bowler Okung in FA and he played 7 games.  Past performance doesn't guarantee future results.

Christiansen is an excellent O-linemen.  He has the tape and athletic ability.

The Panthers Select Brady Christensen in the Third Round of the NFL Draft - BYU Cougars on Sports Illustrated: News, Analysis, and More

By trading down instead of taking someone like Jenkins, we were able to get Marshal, Tremble, Hubbard, Nixon and Taylor.

 

Edited May 31, 2021 by SBBlue