2019 Draft, an "all time dud"?

[Mr. Scot]

11 minutes ago, panther4life said:

Little over Ford has proven to be a huge mistake. Reached for a need and passed on a handful of starting left Guards. From what I can tell there was no tackles taken that panned out at tackle. 

Obligatory Bills War Room video...

It doesn't hurt as much as it used to now that Marty's gone and we got Dan Morgan.

[hepcat]

6 minutes ago, TheCasillas said:

2009.. yes. However, not 2010. LaFell and Hardy alone gets it out of the horrible draft territory.  2010 and 2011 were more alike.  We didnt get anything outside of Brown in the 2019 draft. 

I think you mean Burns. But yea, 2019 is also looking very, very bad. 

2009 is by far the worst draft in Panthers history. Captain Munnerlyn saved it from being a total and complete bust.

I'd say 2010 and 2019 are a tossup as of now because there's still time for 2019 to redeem itself, although it's a long shot. Without Hardy's 1 great season though, it's an awful draft class. LaFell was a total JAG.

[TheCasillas]

1 minute ago, hepcat said:

I think you mean Burns. But yea, 2019 is also looking very, very bad. 

2009 is by far the worst draft in Panthers history. Captain Munnerlyn saved it from being a total and complete bust.

I'd say 2010 and 2019 are a tossup as of now because there's still time for 2019 to redeem itself, although it's a long shot. Without Hardy's 1 great season though, it's an awful draft class. LaFell was a total JAG.

you are correct. Thanks. 

LaFell is still better than anything we got from the 2019 draft outside of Burns at this point. Which is why I am ranking it higher than the 2019 draft.

Edited May 19, 2021 by TheCasillas

[Mage]

30 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Yeah, well...

Is it "all time" bad, though?

I mean, you've got potential guys like Miller and Daley, but it could be argued that they're zeroed out by the huge misses with Little and Grier.

In what context?  All-time bad as in, every NFL team included?  Probably not.  We still came away with Brian Burns.  I'm sure there are drafts out there that came with 0 contributors.  

All-time bad in just Panthers history?  I mean, it's terrible, but I think these drafts were worse:

2016 (Gettleman): We had 5 picks and spent 3 of them on CBs.  Our 1st round pick was spent on a DT, which we did not need in the 1st.  Bradberry turned out to be solid, but this might be our worst draft.  At least 2019 has potentially given us good depth guys like Daley and Miller.  Gettleman didn't make any effort to accumulate more picks.

2015 (Gettleman): Another draft with only 5 picks.  Another draft where the 1st round pick was spent on a position we did not need (linebacker).  Spent a 2nd round pick on Devin Funchess, which again was considered terrible at the time and in hindsight.  Yes Shaq turned into a solid contributor and Williams had a solid season or two, but I'd take Brian Burns over both of them combined.  

Gettleman sucked so much it amazes me how people will still try and defend him lol 

2014 (Gettleman): 6 picks. Drafted Kelvin Benjamin in the 1st round, even though he clearly wasn't that good of a prospect.  We did end up with Trai Turner and Tre Boston, who was decent enough at safety, but once again I'll take Brian Burns over both of them.

Honestly the 2013 draft was bad too, but I won't list it because we ended up with Star and Short.  But only 5 picks again?  And 3 of the guys don't do anything here (Klein was a MLB and we had already drafted Kuechly... you can't make picks like that when you only have 5 of them)

Then of course the 2009-2011 drafts.  All easily worse IMO - I'm not gonna give Hurney credit for making the obvious pick at #1 in 2011.  

But this draft (2019) definitely sucked too.  Hurney and Gettleman both sucked.  I'm very optimistic about Fitterer after this past draft, if only for the simple fact he's not wasting 1st round picks on positions we either don't need or aren't important, and because he's trying to accumulate picks, not stick with a total of 5 throughout the draft.

[Mr. Scot]

For anyone wondering, the other guys on the roster bubble list were Trenton Cannon, Brandon Zylstra, Bravvion Roy, Troy Pride Jr and Stantley Thomas-Oliver.

The reasons behind each one are pretty much the same; a number of new faces acquired at their positions could put them in danger.

[TheoJay10]

Terrible draft surprisingly worse than the draft we got Bradberry in. Vernon Butler was nothing short of a disappointment. But at least Bradbury in the second made up for most of it. Looking back we have had some pretty bad classes the last 5 years. 

[Mage]

5 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

For anyone wondering, the other guys on the roster bubble list were Trenton Cannon, Brandon Zylstra, Bravvion Roy, Troy Pride Jr and Stantley Thomas-Oliver.

The reasons behind each one are pretty much the same; a number of new faces acquired at their positions could put them in danger.

I'd be really surprised if Roy and/or Pride were let go.  All things considered, Pride played well last year relative to his draft position.  Plus, Bouye will miss the first 2 games.  I think he'll at the very least be active until Bouye's return.  

We finished the year with 4 DTs and 9 overall defensive lineman.  Brown and Jones are a lock.  Nixon probably is too.  But who would be the other DT who beats out Roy?  And assuming Burns/YGM/Haynes/Fox/Miller stick, that would leave us with 9 DL.  So I think Roy stays barring another person being signed.  

[Mr. Scot]

28 minutes ago, OldhamA said:

It's too early to write some of those players off, especially with COVID opt outs. 

That said I never have high hopes for a Hurney Draft.

We'll know for sure this year.

I haven't looked at a draft and immediately thought "wow, this could be good" since 2017. Last year did give me some hope.

It's nice to be able to feel hopeful about drafts again rather than just going into them thinking "man I hope this doesn't suck".

[LinvilleGorge]

I think Roy makes it. Not so sure about Pride.

[IceUpSon2001]

Usually Hurney's best pick is the first round pick. Most teams do well with that pick. It's 2nd round and later we need our scouts and GM to be great. We were always picking high because we miss the playoffs a lot.

[IceUpSon2001]

1 hour ago, Mr. Scot said:

Round 3 - Pick 100: QB Will Grier

Another oft discussed topic, including the mention that Marty had Grier rated above some of the top quarterbacks in the draft. To his credit, Grier has been working on improving, but the outlook still isn't optimistic.

Why didn't they just roll with Will last year? We would have won 1 maybe 2 games in my opinion and been in the Trevor sweepstakes. Or...you find out Grier is good. I am thinking he is not but, you drafted him, find out.

[Mr. Scot]

5 minutes ago, IceUpSon2001 said:

Why didn't they just roll with Will last year? We would have won 1 maybe 2 games in my opinion and been in the Trevor sweepstakes. Or...you find out Grier is good. I am thinking he is not but, you drafted him, find out.

It's been reported by multiple sources that Marty wasn't on board with the rebuild last year, for obvious reasons (saving his own ass).

Edited May 19, 2021 by Mr. Scot

[BrianS]

44 minutes ago, panther4life said:

Little over Ford has proven to be a huge mistake. Reached for a need and passed on a handful of starting left Guards. From what I can tell there was no tackles taken that panned out at tackle. 

Revisionist history is fraught with peril.  Don't go there.  Treacherous waters.

Making arguments like that leads you to things like "McCaffrey over Mahomes has proven to be a huge mistake".  Basically, you can analyze nearly any draft pick by any club through the 20/20 hindsight we all have and say things like "We should have chosen _________ instead".

Six months from now, we may be looking at JC Horn, Terrace Marshall, Brady Christianson or Tommy Tremble and saying the same thing.  The only sure thing in the NFL draft is that there isn't a sure thing.

[Mr. Scot]

3 minutes ago, BrianS said:

Revisionist history is fraught with peril.  Don't go there.  Treacherous waters.

Making arguments like that leads you to things like "McCaffrey over Mahomes has proven to be a huge mistake".  Basically, you can analyze nearly any draft pick by any club through the 20/20 hindsight we all have and say things like "We should have chosen _________ instead".

Six months from now, we may be looking at JC Horn, Terrace Marshall, Brady Christianson or Tommy Tremble and saying the same thing.  The only sure thing in the NFL draft is that there isn't a sure thing.

That's kind of apples to oranges.

Comparing two players at the same position taken at about the same spot is perfectly valid.