Film Study: GREAT FIT: Why Sam Darnold will be a great Quarterback for the Carolina Panthers.

[Ivan The Awesome]

4 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

I think it will more so be rather obvious if he is adjusting to the things we are doing or he is still the same guy he was in NY. Certainly, you cannot make a final judgment for a 17 game season based on a 2-3 game start, but I do think that we will have a general idea of how he is gonna work out. Remember, he is a three year NFL starter, not a rookie. I know people like to pretend he is based on age and lack of development in NY. But he is also three years into knowing what it takes in terms of preparation and being a professional football player. 

It's going to be on him to make of this what he will. We can scheme and scheme and scheme but it's on him to figure out some of this stuff. Last year we had a relatively successful scheme(definitely not perfect) offensively but Teddy Bridgewater did Teddy Bridgewater things and that is why he is not longer here. 

And I don't mean that he will be set up for complete success here, either. It remains to be seen if he has even an average level NFL line in front of him. But, elite/franchise QB's still win in less than ideal conditions. So after playing here in Carolina, whatever the ultimate result will be a reflection of Sam Darnold and not the Jets/Panthers.

 

The thing is people will always associate that 2nd rounder for him. It's literal peanuts. If he doesn't work out, the foundation is already here for a QB that will be here. A stout D, a decent line, weapons.

The thing about this coaching staff that makes me not be as apprehensive is that they realize this and are laying the groundwork to work for that Elite QB. So it could be via trade, Draft, I don't know. But the foundation is there. This is why I wish they would have taken Fields, but they are banking a lot on what they can do and Darnold's potential. This brass is literally washing their hands, it's up to Sam, as you are eluding to. Personally I'd give him a full season, set a goal, and if he meets that goal, you have a great sample size with the crew you have now and then you make the decision if he is your guy or not. He's essentially playing for his job starting now. But doesn't have the pressure of someone being behind his heels (fields if it were my choice), so it's up to him to succeed. 

[Aussie Tank]

1 hour ago, kungfoodude said:

I tend to agree with him. I think if Darnold is gonna be bad, it will be immediately apparent. 

If he’s terrible we will know but the problem is people will want all-pro out the gate because apparently Fields is already 

[kungfoodude]

1 minute ago, Ivan The Awesome said:

 

The thing is people will always associate that 2nd rounder for him. It's literal peanuts. If he doesn't work out, the foundation is already here for a QB that will be here. A stout D, a decent line, weapons.

The thing about this coaching staff that makes me not be as apprehensive is that they realize this and are laying the groundwork to work for that Elite QB. So it could be via trade, Draft, I don't know. But the foundation is there. This is why I wish they would have taken Fields, but they are banking a lot on what they can do and Darnold's potential. This brass is literally washing their hands, it's up to Sam, as you are eluding to. Personally I'd give him a full season, set a goal, and if he meets that goal, you have a great sample size with the crew you have now and then you make the decision if he is your guy or not. He's essentially playing for his job starting now. But doesn't have the pressure of someone being behind his heels (fields if it were my choice), so it's up to him to succeed. 

The second rounder will only be relevant if he is a disaster. Other than that, he'll just be an over drafted backup QB taken in the 2nd. 

I agree on taking Fields, although I can understand their apprehension if they didn't like the evaluation on him. Time will tell if that is correct or not.

It would be nice for this all to work out. Getting a franchise QB that cheaply would be fantastic. There just aren't many stories of a bust QB turning into an elite QB in NFL history. 

[kungfoodude]

4 minutes ago, Aussie Tank said:

If he’s terrible we will know but the problem is people will want all-pro out the gate because apparently Fields is already 

He will always be linked to Fields, Slater and whoever else would have been available in the 2nd next year. It just is what it is.

Bad decisions will always be compounded when they involve draft choices. Good choices will make you look like a genius.

[OldhamA]

2 hours ago, Ivan The Awesome said:

Fair enough, but this 2 game window is not ideal when you're trying to figure out if this person you just acquired is the fit for your system and can flourish. 

The other side of the coin, if he does amazing, you gonna have that 2 game window are are you going to think, nah, let's give it more time? If you mindset about Darnold is that you do not want him here or he was a waste of a 2nd round pick then it won't matter how many games he plays, that mentality will follow no matter what he does. 

It's not an objective amount of time at all to see if he is it or not. Especially learning this system. 

Things like this take a full season at least to see if he is it or not. Believe me if by game 10 he's 1-9 with a high Pick ratio, dude you can bet your ass he's gone. 2 games...I don't think so chief.

Sadly those that were desperate to draft a QB at #8 are now putting unrealistic parameters on Darnold to justify themselves. "Must show he's a franchise QB within two games or we're the Jets!"

It's tiresome. 

[weyco2000]

25 minutes ago, OldhamA said:

Sadly those that were desperate to draft a QB at #8 are now putting unrealistic parameters on Darnold to justify themselves. "Must show he's a franchise QB within two games or we're the Jets!"

It's tiresome. 

Or the Bears

[Thorrez]

So 32 seconds in the narrator "forget the numbers and watch the tape" while Darnald completes a contested catch 7 yards deep.

What the tape actually shows is the another receiver had both the safety and the corner beat deep and Sam picked up the dink and dunk yards instead. 

I love for this to work, I want us the win now!, But this did not help my fate.

Edited May 6, 2021 by Thorrez

[rayzor]

If he is going to be judged against rookies of this draft, them he needs to be given the same leeway an actual rookie would.

Expect mistakes early on, but also expect growth and steady improvement.

You won't be able to see the finished product after 2 games anymore than you would any other kid his age.

Give him the season and the benefit of the doubt.

Let this staff work with him to help overcome what 3 years of the worst coaching in the league would have done to basically the youngest kid to start at QB in week 1 ever.

He's sure to have issues and bad habits/mindsets to overcome as a result of what happened with the jets, but he's also young and smart enough to have those things coached out throughout the season.

Mistakes will be made, that's guaranteed. The real test is will he be repeating those mistakes or will he be learning from them and correcting them?

Some issues you don't know exist until you see them happen. It's those moments that real growth can happen as you identify what the real problem is in real time and address it. That's what I want to see.

I want to see if the mistakes he makes early on are improved as the season goes on. It may be painful, but any kind of growth can be. Have some faith and let it happen.

If, at the end of the season, he is still mistake prone and looks like garbage, then congrats to all of you guys who "know" he's garbage. You've got a gold star...just kidding, you get nothing.

Meanwhile the team will move on and then find another QB to put into what will have become an even more ideal situation to succeed in. 

But if he gets better and helps us start winning games then we've found ourselves a QB and we all win.

[DaveThePanther2008]

3 hours ago, Ivan The Awesome said:

 

The thing is people will always associate that 2nd rounder for him. It's literal peanuts. If he doesn't work out, the foundation is already here for a QB that will be here. A stout D, a decent line, weapons.

The thing about this coaching staff that makes me not be as apprehensive is that they realize this and are laying the groundwork to work for that Elite QB. So it could be via trade, Draft, I don't know. But the foundation is there. This is why I wish they would have taken Fields, but they are banking a lot on what they can do and Darnold's potential. This brass is literally washing their hands, it's up to Sam, as you are eluding to. Personally I'd give him a full season, set a goal, and if he meets that goal, you have a great sample size with the crew you have now and then you make the decision if he is your guy or not. He's essentially playing for his job starting now. But doesn't have the pressure of someone being behind his heels (fields if it were my choice), so it's up to him to succeed. 

Spot on.

Our staff did a good job addressing most of our needs on offense and defense during this draft.  We're building a nice core of young players that can help Darnold succeed.  

If he fails, which I don't believe he will, we will be in a position to get a franchise QB.  Who knows who is the next college star to step into the argument of franchise QB.  I think Howell and Rattler are among the favorites but there will certainly be more.   Furthermore, if Watson clears his problems we would be in the same position as we were this year to make a trade for him.  With 2020 and 2021 draft choices losing a 1st for the next couple of years won't hurt so bad. 

Had we selected Fields and he has a poor 2021 than we are stuck with having to give him another season to show it was only rookie mistakes.  It would be 2023 before we could make a move to get another QB. 

I think Darnold, based on some of the videos posted earlier, shows he can perform well in this league.  Some of his plays he had very little time from his O-line but still made plays.  I believe our O-line will be much better than the Jets ever had and Darnold has more toys to play with.

Lastly, I wish the the Huddlers that wanted Fields would let it go.  All the bitchin in the world isn't going to change the outcome of the draft.  If he is great we'll say well we could have had Fields.  Every team can say that.   In 2012 seven teams passed on Luke Kuechly, In 2017 seven teams passed on CMC. You can go on and on about who we didn't draft but it is water under the bridge.  LET IT GO.

[TheRumGone]

optimistic side:
 

A couple things that gives me a shred of hope for Sam is it seemed like he was on an ok trajectory from year 1 to year 2. He played pretty well down the stretch in year 2. Then the bottom fell out in year 3. Covid year, obvious tank job with absolutely horrendous personnel around him including a 37 year old rb, and a coach on the hot seat. It’s very hard for any young qb to succeed in that situation. I still think that some young qbs would still show more then Sam did in that situation but it’s very difficult to evaluate that year 3.

year 1 2800 yds 17tds/15 int 77 rating 1 rushing td

year 2 3000 yds  19 tds/13 int 84 rating 2 rushing tds

keep in mind he has never completed a full season. 

so pretty ok jump from year 1 to year 2. Usually we see a huge jump in year 4 or 5 for raw qb prospects like Darnold and Allen.
 

pessimist side. This dude is damaged goods. Terrible situation, terrible coaching creating a lot of very bad habits that can be very hard to break. Major processing issues. Does better outside of structure then within which is a double edged sword because while he makes plays that only top shelf qbs in the league can make he also makes super dumb decisions that you absolutely cannot make in this league. Back breaking turnovers. 
 

Just as a fan this season it’s gonna be super interesting to see how this turns out and I’m really glad we aren’t having another year of a known boring teddy bridgewater year so for that I am thankful.

 

[Jon Snow]

5 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

The second rounder will only be relevant if he is a disaster. Other than that, he'll just be an over drafted backup QB taken in the 2nd. 

I agree on taking Fields, although I can understand their apprehension if they didn't like the evaluation on him. Time will tell if that is correct or not.

It would be nice for this all to work out. Getting a franchise QB that cheaply would be fantastic. There just aren't many stories of a bust QB turning into an elite QB in NFL history. 

He doesn't have to be elite, he just has to not be bad ( or timid like Teddy) or turn the ball over a lot which puts in a position to not be able to recover.  He just has to be good enough to help us win.  That's the bar set for him.  Anything better is a bonus.

[mrcompletely11]

If our oline is just average and if Sam is just average and effective then I think we cakewalk to the playoffs.

 

I say this every year but I truly think Tom Brady falls completely off the earth this year.  I mean it has to happen.  It will happen and this is the year.  The Saints aint winning with Winston or the swiss army knife.  Our biggest competition for the division is ATL.  Their offense is going to be sick.  No two ways around it.   We will be in two shoot outs with them and I suspect the last one at the end of the year will be for all the marbles. 

 

[d-dave]

I think it's hilarious to see folks ready to string Darnold up after his first incomplete pass or interception.  Like @rayzor said, he's basically a more advanced rookie, and should be held to a similar level of patience.  That's why we picked up the 5th year, in my opinion.

I'd love it if he "hit" here and we were able to finally have the answer to our QB-post Cam question.  But if he doesn't, I'm sure Fit and Rhule will be looking for a QB until they find one.  That's the nature of the NFL.  As we also saw with the Chiefs, it doesn't matter what your record is, you can trade up in the draft for a guy you think is your franchise QB.

Again, I hoping that this is the reset he needs, and I think Rhule knows what needs to be done.  At this point in the offseason, let's all have some hope.  We have time for crushing reality later this year!

[ForJimmy]

Ok so he HAS been in the league 3 years, so he should have an advantage over any rookie. I get we treat him like a rookie, but I also don’t think he will be a 3 year project like some of these rookies will. When the year is over we should have an idea if he will work in our system or not. I think that seems more than fair. I’m not saying he has to even take us to the playoffs, just show he is getting better by year end and look better than he did on the Jets by a decent margin. Speaking of Jets, who in the hell is their C and how does he have a job in the NFL. Those highlights were awful blocking....