Cam Newton says he “intimidated” Panthers...

[Catsfan69]

1 hour ago, DFive said:

I also think that Tepper may see things much the way we (as fans) do. After that hit from Watt on Cam in PIT, we all saw the sharp decline he took. Ron, being Ron, refused to adjust and admit what we all saw, and Tepper likely realized as well, Cam’s magic was gone. So, had that hit never happened and Cam continued to play at that MVP type of level, I think Cam may still be here and we’re having different conversations this off-season. 

He hasn't played at an MVP level since 2015.

[kungfoodude]

20 minutes ago, DFive said:

Or maybe, just MAYBE, Josh Allen is better than Cam Newton. 
 

**Ducks head**

don’t kill me!

They are pretty comparable through their first three years. 

Cam: 11299 passing yards, 64 passing TD's, 1447 rushing yards, 22 rushing TD's

Josh Allen: 9707 passing yards, 67 passing TD's, 1562 rushing yards, 25 rushing TD's

The truth is, however, Allen accumulated a very large chunk of his passing stats this past season(37 of his 67 TD passes, 4544 of his 9707 passing yards). Cam was much more consistent early in his career than Allen was. So we will see if that was a Wentz-like aberration or if he has ascended to elite status. 

[CRA]

Just now, kungfoodude said:

The Pass Block Win Rate tells some more of that story. Let's also be completely honest, Cam is always going to tend to get sacked more because he tends to try to make bigger plays. That does force the OL to block for longer(reference his 27th ranked Time To Throw). 

That is also a criticism you can throw at quite a few of these modern scramblers(Russell Wilson comes to mind). 

but that wasn't Cam in NE.  Cam was dinking and dunking in NE.   Painful to watch that offense after he came back from COVID.    

[Fox007]

2 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

They are pretty comparable through their first three years. 

Cam: 11299 passing yards, 64 passing TD's, 1447 rushing yards, 22 rushing TD's

Josh Allen: 9707 passing yards, 67 passing TD's, 1562 rushing yards, 25 rushing TD's

The truth is, however, Allen accumulated a very large chunk of his passing stats this past season(37 of his 67 TD passes, 4544 of his 9707 passing yards). Cam was much more consistent early in his career than Allen was. So we will see if that was a Wentz-like aberration or if he has ascended to elite status. 

Yea some people take time to develop obviously and I like what I hear from Rhule and Co. They clearly coach and want to coach and develop players. I feel like so many players with potential are just cast out if they dont' produce literally right away and don't even get the coaching or development that any professional needs.

[Mr. Scot]

3 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

They are pretty comparable through their first three years. 

Cam: 11299 passing yards, 64 passing TD's, 1447 rushing yards, 22 rushing TD's

Josh Allen: 9707 passing yards, 67 passing TD's, 1562 rushing yards, 25 rushing TD's

The truth is, however, Allen accumulated a very large chunk of his passing stats this past season(37 of his 67 TD passes, 4544 of his 9707 passing yards). Cam was much more consistent early in his career than Allen was. So we will see if that was a Wentz-like aberration or if he has ascended to elite status. 

It's also fair to point out that Allen is on a team with significantly better coaching and personnel management than Newton was.

Allen has McDermott and Beane. Newton has Rivera and Hurney.

[kungfoodude]

4 minutes ago, CRA said:

but that wasn't Cam in NE.  Cam was dinking and dunking in NE.   Painful to watch that offense after he came back from COVID.    

Well he wasn't dinking and dunking enough to get rid of the ball very quickly. Admittedly that may have had more to do with supporting cast. The stats don't lie, however, he did hold on to the ball for a while. 

[Tr3ach]

Cam was great, when he was great.  I dont think any realistic fan thought his game was going to age well.  He needed to run and be mobile to play at his best, enter the ankle injuries.  He relied on his deep ball and velocity while showing bad throwing motion from time to time which made him use his shoulder more and his lower body less.  Enter shoulder injuries.   I'm not sure how anyone didnt see the rapid aging of Cam coming years ago.  Then factor in the oline he played with and the situation was always clear.

[t96]

53 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Nah, style of play is a big factor in both of those guys. Wilson is pretty good at avoiding big hits, Cam relished the opportunity to truck you. 

The way Cam played the game did contribute to his injuries. But, it's also what made him such a spectacle and one of the most dangerous offensive weapons in NFL history. 

Like I said play style was a contributing factor, but many of the blows to the shoulder that Cam took after the initial injury were when he was in the pocket, and the initial injury was on a fluky play where he ran down a CB after a pick. Wilson is good at avoiding hits when he scrambles, yes, but he's also just been incredibly lucky to avoid injuries this long. Cam wasn't.

[t96]

41 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Tepper was making non-committal comments regarding Cam from the moment he bought the team.

So? That hardly means he would've moved on from Cam if he had played at a high level without missing time in 2018 and 2019. His recent "obsession" with getting a true franchise QB further supports the idea that if Cam was still a top QB and healthy, Tepper would be 100% behind keeping him and paying him big money.

[CRA]

7 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Well he wasn't dinking and dunking enough to get rid of the ball very quickly. Admittedly that may have had more to do with supporting cast. The stats don't lie, however, he did hold on to the ball for a while. 

all I know is what was going on in New England most of the year wasn't modern day football.   I don't care what stats are pulled, I just don't think you can compare the stats of that offense vs. what Joe Brady was doing and for it to mean anything. 

[LinvilleGorge]

10 minutes ago, t96 said:

So? That hardly means he would've moved on from Cam if he had played at a high level without missing time in 2018 and 2019. His recent "obsession" with getting a true franchise QB further supports the idea that if Cam was still a top QB and healthy, Tepper would be 100% behind keeping him and paying him big money.

Never felt that way to me.

[kungfoodude]

15 minutes ago, t96 said:

Like I said play style was a contributing factor, but many of the blows to the shoulder that Cam took after the initial injury were when he was in the pocket, and the initial injury was on a fluky play where he ran down a CB after a pick. Wilson is good at avoiding hits when he scrambles, yes, but he's also just been incredibly lucky to avoid injuries this long. Cam wasn't.

I think that largely comes down to the difference between a "running" QB and a "scrambling/mobile" QB. Most of those scrambling/mobile QB's tend to be pretty good at avoiding contact, whereas your running QB's tend to get obliterated(Allen, Vick, Jackson, etc). 

[kungfoodude]

12 minutes ago, CRA said:

all I know is what was going on in New England most of the year wasn't modern day football.   I don't care what stats are pulled, I just don't think you can compare the stats of that offense vs. what Joe Brady was doing and for it to mean anything. 

Well that probably had to do with the NFL's worst receivers and a diminished Cam. 

[MHS831]

2 hours ago, Mr Mojo Risin said:

I mean is this a joke? He was released well into FA when most teams had already committed to their Qb for the year. Most teams don't wait until the end of May or even June to get their starting Qb. Why do people act like this was a "normal" situation Cam was put into this year? I mean look at the offense he played in Damiere Byrd was his #1 Wr. If the Pat's had a bonafide #1 and a healthy Edleman Cam's stats would look A LOT better. 

Its just funny to me that people use that season to determine if Cam can still be a starting QB in the NFL or not. He had a month to learn his offense and was throwing to a bunch of UDFA ST players And he still won more games than the Carolina Panthers with a MUCH MUCH WEAKER supporting cast. If Cam Newton is done then Matt Rhule doesn't deserve to coach another down of football if he couldn't even win more games than a bum Cam Newton with a month to learn a new system with dogsh*t weapons.

Relax.  You fuse fact with opinion---in a league starved for QBs, you want to explain why 31 other teams did not sign him when he was released?  If his supporting cast was the problem, then other NFL teams would agree and sign him, right?  Right now, half the league is looking to change starting QBs---and he is not even in the conversation.  Period.  He wanted a contract here (commitment) and the Panthers were unwilling to gamble on him.  It was a smart move, and the New England experiment proved it. 

About your comparison with the Panthers.  The Panthers had one of the worst rosters if not THE worst roster.  They had 25% of the cap in dead money.  Lost their starting TE, MLB, QB, etc.  several other key players.  And you say New England's roster was worse-as if that was even a valid point.

QUESTION For you--yes or no is all I need: 

Would you have given Cam the contract he was seeking (commitment) to stay here for 4 more seasons?  A bargain contract would have been $130m with about $80 guaranteed.  Nobody else did it, but you would have?

 

 

Edited February 22, 2021 by MHS831