Panther Fans Offseason QB Trade Quick Reference

[Moo Daeng]

One should use references like these before any discussion of trades or cuts.

I've noticed very few no what dead money is.  

Edited January 29, 2021 by Moo Daeng

[MHS831]

8 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

I see a lot of theory but we need to be mindful of the actual financial impacts, as well. Like....trading CMC would absolutely nuke our cap.

It was all plagiarized.  Do not give Foo Poo. 

Joking of course.  he is one of the best on here.

Edited January 29, 2021 by MHS831

[jfra78]

The thing about Stafford is we can restructure.  Question is why would they restructure for less money?  Quick answer is guaranteed money.  They already got it from their previous teams and with a restructure they can get more

[MHS831]

Put this on a different thread.  Helps me see the deal--

thought I would share:

This demonstrates the coaching staff's confidence in building the roster with marginal, role players they find in the middle rounds.

The trade, you ask, sorta plays into their strength

If we did this deal, and you include comp picks, our draft suddenly looks like this (going from memory, so I am 80% sure this is correct):

• 3rd round  Houston early round pick (67 overall)
• 3rd round  Carolina (73 overall)
• 4th round Houston (100 overall before third round comp picks assigned)
• 4th round Panthers (104 overall before third round comp picks assigned)
• 5th round Panthers (135 overall probably around 145 after comp picks assigned)
• 5th round (comp pick around 168 or so)
• 6th round Panthers (around 190 after comp picks)
• 6th round Comp pick  (around 215 or so)

We would get out of bad contract and get a franchise QB.  We would not pick in round 1 again until 2024

[AU-panther]

3 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

The terms--would the panthers simply redo the Houston contract or do they have to honor it?  I suppose that has to be a mutual agreement, but I was curious as to what normally happens.  The reason?  The Texans got a good deal on the front end, and we would have to pay him for the "meat" of the contract. I just don't know what the norm is (thinking cap and possible extension)

If they traded for him they would have to honor it unless Watson and them decided on an extnstion.

Texans didn't get a good deal on the front end.  This year is actually the 5th year of his rookie deal.  The only new money they have paid is the signing bonus.  

They basically paid him a $27m signing bonus for a contract that hasn't really started.  Just another reason they are going to look for considerable assets in return.  

 

 

[Shocker]

41 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

I see a lot of theory but we need to be mindful of the actual financial impacts, as well. Like....trading CMC would absolutely nuke our cap.

Feels like this makes Burns very attractive to Houston.  Ugg.

[kungfoodude]

48 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

The terms--would the panthers simply redo the Houston contract or do they have to honor it?  I suppose that has to be a mutual agreement, but I was curious as to what normally happens.  The reason?  The Texans got a good deal on the front end, and we would have to pay him for the "meat" of the contract. I just don't know what the norm is (thinking cap and possible extension)

They have to honor it. We can see if he is willing to renegotiate but it is at his discretion 

[kungfoodude]

59 minutes ago, jfra78 said:

The thing about Stafford is we can restructure.  Question is why would they restructure for less money?  Quick answer is guaranteed money.  They already got it from their previous teams and with a restructure they can get more

Why would we need to restructure his deal? He's insanely cheap.

[kungfoodude]

24 minutes ago, Shocker said:

Feels like this makes Burns very attractive to Houston.  Ugg.

That is why I have been saying his name from early on. He is an elite pass rusher(premium positional value in the NFL) with three years left on a rookie deal. He is the most valuable asset on our roster, despite what people think. Moore isn't super far behind him. The rest of our assets are worth far less.

[jfra78]

16 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Why would we need to restructure his deal? He's insanely cheap.

Intended for watson

[AU-panther]

2 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

That is why I have been saying his name from early on. He is an elite pass rusher(premium positional value in the NFL) with three years left on a rookie deal. He is the most valuable asset on our roster, despite what people think. Moore isn't super far behind him. The rest of our assets are worth far less.

^this

People need to remember that you don't trade players, you trade their contracts.  A great player on a rookie contract is worth exponentially more that a great player on a huge contract.

I could actually see some teams viewing Derrick Brown close to Moore, 4 cheap years vs 2 for Moore.

The one plus of CMC is that his signing bonus is already paid, so if a team trades for him they are just on the hook for future salary and bonus. We basically gave him a $16m a year extension.  If he is traded he will end up costing the new team about $10.5m a year.

 

 

 

[kungfoodude]

2 minutes ago, jfra78 said:

Intended for watson

I gotcha.....well.....we probably would want to because our other core pieces are going to be due for deals in 2022 and 2023 and that hurts our ability to front load rather than backload the contracts. 

Perhaps we could tack some Drew Brees-esque dead money years onto the back end. I am reticent to do that, as we saw how that worked out for the Saints.

[kungfoodude]

3 minutes ago, AU-panther said:

^this

People need to remember that you don't trade players, you trade their contracts.  A great player on a rookie contract is worth exponentially more that a great player on a huge contract.

I could actually see some teams viewing Derrick Brown close to Moore, 4 cheap years vs 2 for Moore.

The one plus of CMC is that his signing bonus is already paid, so if a team trades for him they are just on the hook for future salary and bonus. We basically gave him a $16m a year extension.  If he is traded he will end up costing the new team about $10.5m a year.

 

I think the thing that makes Brown less valuable at the moment is that he didn't produce at an elite level in year one(although he had some elite flashes) and also that interior DL have less positional value than elite WR's. If Brown becomes a Aaron Donald, Chris Jones, Fletcher Cox type, he would be as valuable or more valuable than Moore. 

He's a riskier asset to trade for than Moore, at the moment. 

[AU-panther]

3 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

I think the thing that makes Brown less valuable at the moment is that he didn't produce at an elite level in year one(although he had some elite flashes) and also that interior DL have less positional value than elite WR's. If Brown becomes a Aaron Donald, Chris Jones, Fletcher Cox type, he would be as valuable or more valuable than Moore. 

He's a riskier asset to trade for than Moore, at the moment. 

True, I agree with all of that, but here again that is why I said "close".  What if a team already has an elite WR?   Also don't discount the length of time left on rookie deals, 2 yrs vs 4 yrs.  There are teams out there who wouldn't give you a 7th to pay Moore $16m a year and he is only one year away from expecting a new deal.

I'm thinking something like Burns > Moore > Brown > CMC > Chinn

CMC is hard to value, some teams have no desire to spend that much on any RB.  On the other hand he seems to sell jerseys. 

Also I think he looks a lot better for a team that is in win now mode.  If a team is in rebuild mode they would be better asking for Chinn and saving the cap.