Where do the Panthers stand in re-building? Davos Observes

[davos]

I'm seeing many different opinions in the Watson threads about where our team is right now.  Unreal turnover and situation last offseason.  So, I figured to break it down with who is firmly "in-place" on our roster.  Guys that are part of the longer term picture/or at least here a bit longer, highlighting the stars.  With Hurney finally gone and a new GM in the house thought this could be cool:

Owner: Dave Tepper

Not much to say.  He bought the team a few years ago and he's finally got his own curated staff in place.  We've got the wealthiest owner in the league that wants to build a perennial powerhouse. 

Coach+: Matt Rhule

Matt is a really promising head coach and he looked quite competent for a guy (and staff) with such little NFL experience. I'm not sure he'd be a good coordinator in the NFL but he has the head coaching gene.  I'm interested to see who we groom to eventually take over for Snow which could happen in the next few years.  We do have a former DC in Al Holocomb and I thought Jason Simmons did wonders with a super inexperienced DB group.  Offense wise, Brady is getting flack but it was year one for him.  If he wants a HC future, he'll need to learn and show it next year with a new QB.

GM: Scott Fitterer

He has plenty of experience and the agreed upon guy between Rhule & Tepper.  These three are the new combo and we FINALLY feel beyond the JR-Hurney-Fox/Rivera days. 

--

TEAM:

QB: None

This is the obvious hole. TB ain't diddly

RB: McCaffrey

Rock star.  Interested to see how he looks post-injury/essentially a year off.  Maybe back with a fury/MVP level season.

WR: DJ Moore, Robby Anderson

I think we're fine even if we don't re-sign Samuel. It could make sense to grab a WR mid to late rounds

OL: Moton, Paradis, Daley, Larsen

A patchwork group with one stable member (Moton). One stable backup (Larsen).  Paradis will probably be here another year.  I'd prefer we re-sign John Miller.  He's a good guard but we need to draft younger studs and sign FAs to this group.

TE: None

For Ian--When it's not just Rivera but the new crew limiting his snaps, I think there's an issue in his development.  Brady doesn't use TEs a ton so it's not critical.  Would LOVE a balanced, capable blocking/receiving guy like maybe a Jonnu Smith.

DL: Burns, Brown, YGM, Obada, Kerr, Haynes

This could be a really awesome DL next year if we find a DT/DE I.E. Fletched Cox/Early Short type.  CLOSE

LB: Shaq, Carter Jr.

We need work here.  Shaq is really the epitome of good.  He's not bad, not great.  Just a solid guy that is unfortunately not a star level. Carter is good to have on the roster.

DBs: Jackson, Pride, Chinn, Burris, Elder

This is all of a sudden looking okay.  We still need to get a CB1 but Pride was super promising in year 1.  I'm actually quite interested to see his growth in year 2.  Could be a really solid find IMO.  Chinn is amazing and we noticeably got better when Burris returned from his midseason injury.  Also, Corn Elder was thought to be discarded and forgotten and he played quite well during the season.  Thomas-Oliver was however bad and Jackson should really be in the slot. Heck, even Sam Franklin looked good.  I applaud Jason Simmons.

--

So, overall, I don't think we're as far off as it seems.  You may calling mid-rebuild, but after seeing how we played with crap at QB, I don't think we're far from being a playoff squad.

Also--Our needs are pretty darn clear and it doesn't seem out of this world to address in one offseason.

Needs (5):

• We without a doubt need offensive linemen (minimum 4 starter/backups via FA/Draft). Just get new big men in here. 
• A star Quarterback, and we have some potential targets this year (Justin Fields, Zach Wilson, Trey Lance, Nate Sudfeld)
• A MLB to lead the defense alongside Chinn, Burns & Brown.
• A CB1.  Honestly, the guys here fine good minus Boston and all pretty young.
• A new multi-tech DT after we move on from KK.

I'd say we've got a lot more in place once you take a look.  The needs, particularly QB & MLB are huge make or brakes for a franchise so that is why we're not far, but this offseason is going to be so damn important and define our future.

My questions for the thread:

How far off are we? And who's your best guess at QB & LB in 2021 for us?

 

 

[Moo Daeng]

We need a productive draft to restock with younger cheap players given our not so great cap situation.  Igos brink of disaster cap thread doesn't jive with wanting to trade away farm to get Watson. You have to think of it wholistically. 

[davos]

We're in a middle of the pack salary situation in the league.  Trading the farm for Watson could cause a dent in the rest, but it's not as detrimental as some make it out to be.  That being said, it will be hard for us to land Watson IMO unless he really wants to come here.

[Zod]

Quality post. Many good points.

 

So excited for the defensive line next season.

[Shocker]

Nice job Davos.  

[Smithers]

26 minutes ago, davos said:

I'm seeing many different opinions in the Watson threads about where our team is right now.  Unreal turnover and situation last offseason.  So, I figured to break it down with who is firmly "in-place" on our roster.  Guys that are part of the longer term picture/or at least here a bit longer, highlighting the stars.  With Hurney finally gone and a new GM in the house thought this could be cool:

Owner: Dave Tepper

Not much to say.  He bought the team a few years ago and he's finally got his own curated staff in place.  We've got the wealthiest owner in the league that wants to build a perennial powerhouse. 

Coach+: Matt Rhule

Matt is a really promising head coach and he looked quite competent for a guy (and staff) with such little NFL experience. I'm not sure he'd be a good coordinator in the NFL but he has the head coaching gene.  I'm interested to see who we groom to eventually take over for Snow which could happen in the next few years.  We do have a former DC in Al Holocomb and I thought Jason Simmons did wonders with a super inexperienced DB group.  Offense wise, Brady is getting flack but it was year one for him.  If he wants a HC future, he'll need to learn and show it next year with a new QB.

GM: Scott Fitterer

He has plenty of experience and the agreed upon guy between Rhule & Tepper.  These three are the new combo and we FINALLY feel beyond the JR-Hurney-Fox/Rivera days. 

--

TEAM:

QB: None

This is the obvious hole. TB ain't diddly

RB: McCaffrey

Rock star.  Interested to see how he looks post-injury/essentially a year off.  Maybe back with a fury/MVP level season.

WR: DJ Moore, Robby Anderson

I think we're fine even if we don't re-sign Samuel. It could make sense to grab a WR mid to late rounds

OL: Moton, Paradis, Daley, Larsen

A patchwork group with one stable member (Moton). One stable backup (Larsen).  Paradis will probably be here another year.  I'd prefer we re-sign John Miller.  He's a good guard but we need to draft younger studs and sign FAs to this group.

TE: None

For Ian--When it's not just Rivera but the new crew limiting his snaps, I think there's an issue in his development.  Brady doesn't use TEs a ton so it's not critical.  Would LOVE a balanced, capable blocking/receiving guy like maybe a Jonnu Smith.

DL: Burns, Brown, YGM, Obada, Kerr, Haynes

This could be a really awesome DL next year if we find a DT/DE I.E. Fletched Cox/Early Short type.  CLOSE

LB: Shaq, Carter Jr.

We need work here.  Shaq is really the epitome of good.  He's not bad, not great.  Just a solid guy that is unfortunately not a star level. Carter is good to have on the roster.

DBs: Jackson, Pride, Chinn, Burris, Elder

This is all of a sudden looking okay.  We still need to get a CB1 but Pride was super promising in year 1.  I'm actually quite interested to see his growth in year 2.  Could be a really solid find IMO.  Chinn is amazing and we noticeably got better when Burris returned from his midseason injury.  Also, Corn Elder was thought to be discarded and forgotten and he played quite well during the season.  Thomas-Oliver was however bad and Jackson should really be in the slot. Heck, even Sam Franklin looked good.  I applaud Jason Simmons.

--

So, overall, I don't think we're as far off as it seems.  You may calling mid-rebuild, but after seeing how we played with crap at QB, I don't think we're far from being a playoff squad.

Also--Our needs are pretty darn clear and it doesn't seem out of this world to address in one offseason.

Needs (5):

• We without a doubt need offensive linemen (minimum 4 starter/backups via FA/Draft). Just get new big men in here. 
• A star Quarterback, and we have some potential targets this year (Justin Fields, Zach Wilson, Trey Lance, Nate Sudfeld)
• A MLB to lead the defense alongside Chinn, Burns & Brown.
• A CB1.  Honestly, the guys here fine good minus Boston and all pretty young.
• A new multi-tech DT after we move on from KK.

I'd say we've got a lot more in place once you take a look.  The needs, particularly QB & MLB are huge make or brakes for a franchise so that is why we're not far, but this offseason is going to be so damn important and define our future.

My questions for the thread:

How far off are we? And who's your best guess at QB & LB in 2021 for us?

 

 

Great work-but Nate Sudfeld is not a star QB.

[davos]

Note: I added the Nate Sudfeld bit as a nod to the saxaphone guy.

[KillerKat]

This is about how I feel also

[davos]

Also *make or break. 

[saX man]

5 minutes ago, davos said:

Note: I added the Nate Sudfeld bit as a nod to the saxaphone guy.

awww

[stbugs]

18 minutes ago, Smithers said:

Great work-but Nate Sudfeld is not a star QB.

Lol. Same thought. I mean we all watched him. Dude was dog poo.

Also, MLB is way too high on the needs list. QB, CB and OL are our huge needs. CB probably 3rd because QB is the top position and we need multiple OL not just one. Seeing as how we play Chinn as that LB/5th DB so much. No way I’d put MLB over OL and CB. Heck, I might be willing to say a DT to go with Brown would have more impact (improvement over existing players). 

[MHS831]

22 minutes ago, Zod said:

Quality post. Many good points.

 

So excited for the defensive line next season.

And he forgot ROY.  Not bad in limited snaps.

He forgot Boston--he was better in the box.

Thanks Davos.

QB

LT

MLB

C/G

TE

3 Tech DT/DE

[Basbear]

Beautiful @davos  Super Glad I didnt post my version of this before, been meaning to for weeks. You added boldness and pictures too, Im too lazy for all that. 

My needs are this

1-QB starter/future face 

2/3- TEs Ian is at best a #3 need 2 starters types

7-OL Daley and little/Paradis thats not a good base/start. Must do something with Paradis contracts

3-WRs depth mainly and spot starter

Offense needs 12-15 about half starters and half depth

 

2/3-DL Starter and depth(depends on the system) Roy and Kerr are the same player

3-LBs ''''

3-CBs ""depends on Pride and STO, could be lower

Defense needs are 8-10 depends on what Phil Snow wants

Special teams

Cooper(returner) and JJ(snapper) are FAs. You could make a case for Kicker AND Punter competition/upgrades

Needs 2-4 may have a returner on the roster, make not need a kicker/punter.

 

Overall needs 22-29 players. Half of those are starters 11-14 and 11-15 depth/spot starters/future players.

 

Fritterer and Rhule need about 2-3 years to build a stable team, IF they get lucky. 

 

[MHS831]

Let's not underestimate the Pride pick.   Rhule and Snow liked his athleticism, along with Chinn.