Hurney Scks ...Got it.. How do we fix it

[Mr. Scot]

43 minutes ago, Basbear said:

Look at the players drafted. Again Ben and great cold weather D scheme covered it up. Its like me saying Bill Bliacheat has been been awful at drafting(he has), but you point to wins. You can draft poor and still win. Those two are proof and theres others. Peyton covered up for Polian during his era, he never hit on 3rd rounder in his whole career. 

Draft pick evaluation is subjective.

Winning tells the story.

[GoPanthers123]

He will be the draft advisor, someone else will take over the other duties. 

[panthers55]

4 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

That's the time when I started getting legitimately nervous about this Hurney situation. We just gave up on talking to front office candidates because we didn't want to take roster control away from Marty. Yikes.

You mean roster control from Rhule. That was one of the big issues when Rhule was hired. He wanted control of his roster. I thought Tepper agreed. 

[Snake]

9 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

Word was he was trying to get Kevin Colbert but it didn't pan out.

We are not going to get anyone with the whole assistant GM role thing. Tepper has to take the risk and fire Hurndog. Hopefully this offseason. 

[Snake]

6 hours ago, beo said:

Seriously, just demote him to somewhere within the scouting department. He's not a bad talent evaluator, so why not? But i'd rather just have him fired outright than have him remain our GM. Marty simply can not have that much power if you want to be a winning football team.

Did you really say he's not a bad talent evaluator? Look at his second round picks and how he has retained talent. 

[Call Me James]

Teddy sucks. If he was the guy he was sold as we'd be in playoff contention or better. 

 

He can't even win a game with CMC. 

[J.B.]

17 hours ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

I sit here and read this forum everyday. We sit here and argue how we are going to retain Moton and Samuel.  Two very key players on our team.  Yet  I Iook at teams like the Rams, Saints, Pittsburgh and others.  They have tons of great players and seem to always retain them.

I am not a cap guy.  I love the opinions on this forum and I want to know how do we get to that level of other franchises without gutting the whole team and starting over with a bunch of scrubs.

We've started well with Burns, Brown, Chinn, CMC, Moore and YGM plus some other hopefuls.

How do we keep them all and make this a franchise that continually competes for the playoffs. 

First, I believe we have to get rid of Hurney.  It's nothing personal but the guy continually drafts poorly.  Makes terrible decision on retaining players.  Letting the good ones walk and overpaying players on the downside of their careers. 

So we fire Hurney.  Who's the best options and how do we become a great franchise?

So Hurney “continually drafts poorly” but also drafted the 6 franchise pieces you referenced. 
 

a draft pick that sticks past the first round is a literal roll of the dice. Hurney has been money in the first round and on par with ever other GM in the league beyond that. 
 

be careful what you wish for 

[DaveThePanther2008]

27 minutes ago, J.B. said:

So Hurney “continually drafts poorly” but also drafted the 6 franchise pieces you referenced. 
 

a draft pick that sticks past the first round is a literal roll of the dice. Hurney has been money in the first round and on par with ever other GM in the league beyond that. 
 

be careful what you wish for 

CMC was Gettleman  Moore and Burns was Hurney and the remainder are Rhule picks.   No argument on 1st rounders but you are dead wrong on believing that only the first round makes a difference.  Teams that are on top hit on 1st and 2nd round consistently.  Hurney is no where consistent on round two.  Not even close. 

Not only is he a subpar drafter he issues the worst contracts.  I bet agents drool when Hurney calls.  If you remember the cap hell he put us in before he was fired the first time.  We're heading back to the same Cap hell and no better a team. 

"Be careful what you wish for"   I' take my chances. 

[J.B.]

1 hour ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

CMC was Gettleman  Moore and Burns was Hurney and the remainder are Rhule picks.   No argument on 1st rounders but you are dead wrong on believing that only the first round makes a difference.  Teams that are on top hit on 1st and 2nd round consistently.  Hurney is no where consistent on round two.  Not even close. 

Not only is he a subpar drafter he issues the worst contracts.  I bet agents drool when Hurney calls.  If you remember the cap hell he put us in before he was fired the first time.  We're heading back to the same Cap hell and no better a team. 

"Be careful what you wish for"   I' take my chances. 

Rhule isn’t a GM. He didn’t make any picks

what GM out there can you point to as successful in drafting past the first round?

[DaveThePanther2008]

2 minutes ago, J.B. said:

Rhule isn’t a GM. He didn’t make any picks

what GM out there can you point to as successful in drafting past the first round?

Rhule isn't the GM but those were his picks.  Not Hurney  It's pretty well known that Rhule made it clear that he wanted who he wanted and Hurney was only the trigger man. If it makes you happy that you give credit to Hurney.  Go for it but if you really think he can build a super bowl team.  Go right ahead.  The majority of us know better. 

New Orleans just to start.  Has consistently hit on rounds one and two.  I saw an article that pointed out three or four teams that have consistently hit on rounds one and two (and beyond). 

If you think you can win by being successful on round 1 only.   It's your turn. Name me a team that only hits on round one and are a consistent winner. 

[Car123]

15 minutes ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

Rhule isn't the GM but those were his picks.  Not Hurney  It's pretty well known that Rhule made it clear that he wanted who he wanted and Hurney was only the trigger man. If it makes you happy that you give credit to Hurney.  Go for it but if you really think he can build a super bowl team.  Go right ahead.  The majority of us know better. 

New Orleans just to start.  Has consistently hit on rounds one and two.  I saw an article that pointed out three or four teams that have consistently hit on rounds one and two (and beyond). 

If you think you can win by being successful on round 1 only.   It's your turn. Name me a team that only hits on round one and are a consistent winner. 

This was Hurney’s draft.

Quote

 

So, what happened? According to Joe Person at the Athletic, head coach Matt Rhule was much more interested in trading down for more picks but in the end general manager Marty Hurney wanted Brown and overruled him.

Here’s what Person said last week on WFNZ.

“I was told that Matt Rhule was very open and eager to trade back in the first round. He wanted to add a couple more picks if they could find that sweet spot maybe in the teens somewhere and that Marty was kind of like you know what? Derrick Brown’s our guy. We’re not moving.” 
 

 

Hurney wanted Chinn as well.
 

Quote

 

As for general manager Marty Hurney, there was no ifs, ands, or buts about it. He wanted Chinn and to do so, they had to make a move to go up and get him. Had they waited, he would've likely been off of the board by the time the Panthers were on the clock in the third round.

"He was a guy that we liked since the first time that we put eyes on him and he just impressed us more and more as the process went through," Hurney said. "We had him drafted fairly highly and we just thought that he was too good to take the chance of seeing if he could get through six more picks to get to us. We thought that we had a fair deal for both sides to go up and get him and thought that he was a player that could really help our defense grow. I think when you feel that strongly about a guy, sometimes you just don't want to take the chance to see him get there. I don't think he would've gotten to us in the third round and we started making calls and we got Seattle to make the deal."

 

 

[Toomers]

6 minutes ago, J.B. said:

Rhule isn’t a GM. He didn’t make any picks

what GM out there can you point to as successful in drafting past the first round?

Well let’s see. Just in 2019, the Saints only had pick 48 and 105 and got a very good C(McCoy) and S(CGJ), while Hurney had 6 picks before their 3rd pick and has come up with Burns and nothing else. 

  There’s a good reason no other NFL team has ever called Hurney for any job since he took over.

 And Hurneys last decision was Shaqs contract. Ruhle has final say on everything right now. Why would a team interview a replacement(Berry) and not give him final cut? It’s because the guy making 9M/yr doesn’t want to give up control. 

       

[J.B.]

12 minutes ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

Rhule isn't the GM but those were his picks.  Not Hurney  It's pretty well known that Rhule made it clear that he wanted who he wanted and Hurney was only the trigger man. If it makes you happy that you give credit to Hurney.  Go for it but if you really think he can build a super bowl team.  Go right ahead.  The majority of us know better. 

New Orleans just to start.  Has consistently hit on rounds one and two.  I saw an article that pointed out three or four teams that have consistently hit on rounds one and two (and beyond). 

If you think you can win by being successful on round 1 only.   It's your turn. Name me a team that only hits on round one and are a consistent winner. 

Nowhere was it said mid round picks are not important. I said they are a crap shoot.

the last three drafts for the saints have yielded exactly two starters from mid rounds. That would be Kamala and Williams from the 2017 draft - which loos like the Saints did well. I would argue the Panthers 2017 draft was pretty strong as well - yielding Samuel, Moton, Elder, Armah and Butler. The 2018 New Orleans draft only has one player left on their roster (back up Smith) and 2019 also has one left on the roster (role player Gardner-Johnson)

Hardly an example of excellence in mid round player selection. The Saints mid round picks are a crap shoot........just like everyone else’s 

[Toomers]

1 minute ago, Car123 said:

 

This was Hurney’s draft.

So, what happened? According to Joe Person at the Athletic, head coach Matt Rhule was much more interested in trading down for more picks but in the end general manager Marty Hurney wanted Brown and overruled him.

Here’s what Person said last week on WFNZ.

“I was told that Matt Rhule was very open and eager to trade back in the first round. He wanted to add a couple more picks if they could find that sweet spot maybe in the teens somewhere and that Marty was kind of like you know what? Derrick Brown’s our guy. We’re not moving.” 
 

 

Hurney wanted Chinn as well.
 

As for general manager Marty Hurney, there was no ifs, ands, or buts about it. He wanted Chinn and to do so, they had to make a move to go up and get him. Had they waited, he would've likely been off of the board by the time the Panthers were on the clock in the third round.

"He was a guy that we liked since the first time that we put eyes on him and he just impressed us more and more as the process went through," Hurney said. "We had him drafted fairly highly and we just thought that he was too good to take the chance of seeing if he could get through six more picks to get to us. We thought that we had a fair deal for both sides to go up and get him and thought that he was a player that could really help our defense grow. I think when you feel that strongly about a guy, sometimes you just don't want to take the chance to see him get there. I don't think he would've gotten to us in the third round and we started making calls and we got Seattle to make the deal."

You were also told by Ruhle himself that he wanted to win a SB with Cam. How did that work out for being the truth? 
 

  Believing what coaches say in press conferences and to reporters is the worst way to find out the truth in anything. 
 

   How many times already has Rhule propped up a player then cut/benched him shortly after.