Seriously, it's time to give Walker an honest look

[Mr. Scot]

30 minutes ago, Proudiddy said:

It's purely logic, Scot.  

If you're coach, not if you're Rhule, but if you're the head coach - you, do you think Teddy at this point is a franchise QB?

I don't.

Has his decisions and play led to more losses than wins?  Yes.

So we know what we have with him.  The other guy is 1-0 and flashed some impressive tools in his one start despite limited reps during the year and far less starting experience.  

Then I ask myself, if the end result 8 times has been losses under Teddy despite the offense having the chance to win or tie on the last drive almost every game outside of Tampa two weeks ago, can the next guy do any worse?  Probably not.

So, I see what the other guys in PJ, and Grier as well, have moving forward.  I think the danger isn't doing worse, the danger is realizing they committed 60+ million to a guy who would be outplayed or equaled by his backups.

Teddy not being a franchise QB doesn't make him worse than PJ Walker, that is unless you want to argue with me that PJ Walker is a franchise QB.

Again, I'm all for seeing what the other guys have once we're out of the race. To do so sooner than that is the kind of thing bad teams with losing cultures do.

[hepcat]

4 minutes ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

*points at the five years remaining on Rhule's six year deal and Tepper's words about needing patience and winning taking time.* They may very well have decided Bridgewater is not the long term solution. I tend to agree that his crunch time performance is tending to show this pretty starkly. His protection has at times been bad. There was nothing wrong with it on that throw. IMO that still does not mean that the best course of action is to yank him for PJ straightaway.

Teddy had plenty of time to throw today. Okung had a great game. Teams dare the Panthers to throw deep every game and Bridgewater just doesn’t have the physical tools to do it. He has had wide open receivers running deep every single game and he just can’t hit them. 

[1of10Charnatives]

6 minutes ago, Shotgun said:

It sends a worse message to keep playing Teddy. I dont care what you get paid, if you suck take a seat on the bench. I hope our coaches don't let their egos get in the way. They made a terrible decision signing Teddy and they need to correct it.  

There's a right way to do that and a wrong way. Doing it midseason when you don't know you have a better option available is usually the wrong way. Kyle Allen looked pretty good for the first few games he played last year, then the wheels fell off. PJ may get his chance anyway if Teddy's injury is significant, but I don't know that just throwing him out there sends the message to your locker room. The coaches have already demonstrated a willingness to sit players based on bad play that they brought in with Whitehead. I'm not particularly worried about their egos getting in the way in that regard.

[Proudiddy]

4 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Nowhere did I say you did.

I have, however, had other posters suggest that the fact he wasn't on an NFL roster just meant teams were missing how good he obviously was. Even had Kurt Warner thrown in as a comparison.

That's just silly.

And Jake Delhomme.  It wasn't a comparison, it was an example to counter your assertion that because all 32 NFL teams passed PJ up initially then there is absolutely no way he is better than Teddy.

But, if framing it as if I was saying PJ was Kurt Warner waiting in the wings makes you feel better about your stance, have at it lol.

[Shotgun]

1 minute ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

There's a right way to do that and a wrong way. Doing it midseason when you don't know you have a better option available is usually the wrong way. Kyle Allen looked pretty good for the first few games he played last year, then the wheels fell off. PJ may get his chance anyway if Teddy's injury is significant, but I don't know that just throwing him out there sends the message to your locker room. The coaches have already demonstrated a willingness to sit players based on bad play that they brought in with Whitehead. I'm not particularly worried about their egos getting in the way in that regard.

Teddy seems pretty wheeless at this point.

[raleigh-panther]

5 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Teddy not being a franchise QB doesn't make him worse than PJ Walker, that is unless you want to argue with me that PJ Walker is a franchise QB.

again, I'm all for seeing what the other guys have once we're out of the race. To do so sooner than that is the kind of thing bad teams with losing cultures do

I’m not arguing with you other than to say bridgewater is never going to be a franchise qb.  Not even close 

against the Vikings. Number 27 against the run and number 23 against the run, with defense giving him 14 points, he totally poo  the bed 

he can’t be gone soon enough 

[Mr. Scot]

38 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

There's nothing emotional about benching an underperforming player. I'd argue that it would be more emotional to stick with him. I think Rhule stuck with Whitehead for as long as he did out of largely emotional reasons.

If you think Rhule is capable of making those kinds of decisions, then who's to say he didn't choose PJ over Grier based on sentiment?

There's a lot we don't know about Rhule yet, but based on what I've seen, I don't believe for a minute that he makes sentimental decisions. Whitehead's snaps have been declining for weeks until he was finally benched. Likewise, Greg Little was benched without any regard to his being a high pick.

[kungfoodude]

6 minutes ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

*points at the five years remaining on Rhule's six year deal and Tepper's words about needing patience and winning taking time.* They may very well have decided Bridgewater is not the long term solution. I tend to agree that his crunch time performance is tending to show this pretty starkly. His protection has at times been bad. There was nothing wrong with it on that throw. IMO that still does not mean that the best course of action is to yank him for PJ straightaway.

His protection was quite good in that game. 0 sacks and 3 QB Hits. Yet somehow he managed to have one of his worst outings as a Panther. 

He has thrown for 13 TD's in 11 games. Kyle Allen threw for 17 TD's in 12 games. In fact, he's on pace for the lowest passing TD total for a Panthers starting QB since Pickles in 2010. That's pretty rough. 

I get that he has a crazy completion percentage. That's awesome. I get that early on he was one of the top guys in the NFL in passing yardage. Well, now he is barely in the top 15. 

He just isn't the guy, plain and simple. So, since we can't win with him what does it matter if we play someone else? He isn't in our future plans. He isn't our franchise QB.

[1of10Charnatives]

6 minutes ago, hepcat said:

Teddy had plenty of time to throw today. Okung had a great game. Teams dare the Panthers to throw deep every game and Bridgewater just doesn’t have the physical tools to do it. He has had wide open receivers running deep every single game and he just can’t hit them. 

I agree that the more complete impression I'm getting is that even when getting time to throw, his performance on deep balls doesn't go up meaningfully nor his crunch time performance. It's starting to look increasingly like he's a high floor low ceiling guy who doesn't tend to go out and lose you games you should win, but also doesn't shine when it matters in the close ones. Lack of offseason and first year on a new team with receivers he's still developing chemistry with could be a factor on deep balls, but shouldn't matter when it comes to crunch time play falling off.

[Brooklyn 3.0]

We're not getting a QB in the Draft that will be better than TB. Just a fact. And the jury is out on if PJ is as good as TB. Remember Kyle Allen? If you really think PJ is the answer or could be the answer ... wow.

[kungfoodude]

8 minutes ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

There's a right way to do that and a wrong way. Doing it midseason when you don't know you have a better option available is usually the wrong way. Kyle Allen looked pretty good for the first few games he played last year, then the wheels fell off. PJ may get his chance anyway if Teddy's injury is significant, but I don't know that just throwing him out there sends the message to your locker room. The coaches have already demonstrated a willingness to sit players based on bad play that they brought in with Whitehead. I'm not particularly worried about their egos getting in the way in that regard.

It isn't midseason. We are 75% through the season and basically all but mathematically eliminated.

[LinvilleGorge]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

If you think Rhule is capable of making those kinds of decisions, then who's to say he didn't choose PJ over Grier based on sentiment?

There's a lot we don't know about Rhule yet, but based on what I've seen, I don't believe for a minute that he makes sentimental decisions. Whitehead's snaps have been declining for weeks until he was finally benched. Likewise, Greg Little was benched without any regard to his being a high pick.

It's possible he did. But based on how Walker looked in his lone appearance this year and how Grier looked last year, I'd say Walker > Grier is likely the right call.

[Mr. Scot]

54 minutes ago, Proudiddy said:

All we heard last week was how we should discount what PJ did because it was against the Lions and how Teddy would do the same thing or better.  Teddy comes back and blows the game against the 26th ranked scoring defense while putting up a whopping 10 points and leaving at least 11 potential points on the field in the redzone and missed a surefire 7 points by throwing Robbie out of bounds on a wide open streak. 

So, should we say Teddy's performance doesn't count either?

Who said it didn't?

[TheCasillas]

2 minutes ago, Brooklyn 3.0 said:

We're not getting a QB in the Draft that will be better than TB. Just a fact. And the jury is out on if PJ is as good as TB. Remember Kyle Allen? If you really think PJ is the answer or could be the answer ... wow.

How is this a fact? Since this is a future consideration, isn’t it always an assumption? Therefor never a “fact”