Tankathon Mock Draft. All 3 QB's go top 10. Carolina takes Kyle Pitts. Yeesh.

[Varking]

Just now, mrcompletely11 said:

No offense but Kyle Pitts is not the secret ingredient to unlocking Teddy

We all have different beliefs. I believe if Teddy is to be here long term, looking at where we are drafting, a pass catching Tight End is the best option. I change my view on what I want depending on where we draft. But that 12-15 range for a dominant pass catching TE seems like a deal to me. 

[mrcompletely11]

3 minutes ago, Varking said:

We all have different beliefs. I believe if Teddy is to be here long term, looking at where we are drafting, a pass catching Tight End is the best option. I change my view on what I want depending on where we draft. But that 12-15 range for a dominant pass catching TE seems like a deal to me. 

Who was the last tight end drafted that high that worked out?

[Varking]

Just now, mrcompletely11 said:

Who was the last tight end drafted that high that worked out?

Who was the last TE that was absolutely dominating people like he is?

[mrcompletely11]

1 minute ago, Varking said:

Who was the last TE that was absolutely dominating people like he is?

you first

[stbugs]

19 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

No offense but Kyle Pitts is not the secret ingredient to unlocking Teddy

I agree with you. It would be an awful pick IMHO. So many other needs that would be more impactful.

[stbugs]

15 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

Who was the last tight end drafted that high that worked out?

I looked at last year’s full season stats and there wasn’t a single first round TE in the top 10. Day 2 seems to be a better sweet spot. It’s like G/C, the guys taken in the first tend to be reached and 2nd round IOL tend to work out just as well or better. Spending pick 13 to make Teddy better in the red zone seems like a big stretch.

[Varking]

3 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

you first

It’s a silly argument in my eyes. That is like saying we don’t draft CMC in the top 10 because of running backs histories of recent years. 

Pitts has almost 300 yards and scored 7 TDs in 2 full games and one quarter of football. If there were other highly rated TEs who ran and caught like him many more would be drafted high. Simply put without pulling up every TEs stats... there hasn’t been a college TE as polished and productive as him in a long time. Think about this... TJH on the Lions caught 6 TDs his third year of college football the whole year. Pitts passed that without playing three full games. 
 

If you trust the Coach and OC and they want Kyle Pitts they are going to get Kyle Pitts. We won tonight, against the Lions, against Denver and against the Washington Football Team and we won’t be in a spot to draft him anyway. I

[mrcompletely11]

29 minutes ago, Varking said:

It’s a silly argument in my eyes. That is like saying we don’t draft CMC in the top 10 because of running backs histories of recent years. 

Pitts has almost 300 yards and scored 7 TDs in 2 full games and one quarter of football. If there were other highly rated TEs who ran and caught like him many more would be drafted high. Simply put without pulling up every TEs stats... there hasn’t been a college TE as polished and productive as him in a long time. Think about this... TJH on the Lions caught 6 TDs his third year of college football the whole year. Pitts passed that without playing three full games. 
 

If you trust the Coach and OC and they want Kyle Pitts they are going to get Kyle Pitts. We won tonight, against the Lions, against Denver and against the Washington Football Team and we won’t be in a spot to draft him anyway. I

You still haven't answered the question 

[Varking]

16 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

You still haven't answered the question 

There is nobody to compare Pitts to is the issue.  And I can’t help it if semi productive college tight ends get drafted high. Tony Gonzalez turned out ok and he was a top pick. TJ Hockenson, Noah Fant..Hayden Hurst... we could go down the list. They didn’t deserve first round grades as pass catchers. Passing on prospects because of the position they play because of previous players different years is a sure fire way to miss out on talent. 

Pitts Sophmore year was better than most of these guys junior and senior years. Pitts has 7 touchdowns in 9 quarters of football this year. 
 

Now, your turn to answer me. 
 

[Soul Rebel]

My apologies if this has already been asked, but how valuable is a stud TE in Brady's system? I can't tell if Thomas is just not "there" yet in maturity and learning the system, thus Teddy isn't looking his way enough. Or, could it be that Brady doesn't rely heavily on involving a TE in his offense.

Pitts would def ease the loss of one of Samuel, Moore or Robby 2-3 years from now when he's polishing his game and just entering his prime. 

[Varking]

1 hour ago, Soul Rebel said:

My apologies if this has already been asked, but how valuable is a stud TE in Brady's system? I can't tell if Thomas is just not "there" yet in maturity and learning the system, thus Teddy isn't looking his way enough. Or, could it be that Brady doesn't rely heavily on involving a TE in his offense.

Pitts would def ease the loss of one of Samuel, Moore or Robby 2-3 years from now when he's polishing his game and just entering his prime. 

I’d like to think that Brady would use a TE more if he actually had good talent at WR. His TE from last year went undrafted and Thomas is clearly not it. 

[AU-panther]

On 10/29/2020 at 4:51 PM, Varking said:

It’s a silly argument in my eyes. That is like saying we don’t draft CMC in the top 10 because of running backs histories of recent years. 

Pitts has almost 300 yards and scored 7 TDs in 2 full games and one quarter of football. If there were other highly rated TEs who ran and caught like him many more would be drafted high. Simply put without pulling up every TEs stats... there hasn’t been a college TE as polished and productive as him in a long time. Think about this... TJH on the Lions caught 6 TDs his third year of college football the whole year. Pitts passed that without playing three full games. 
 

If you trust the Coach and OC and they want Kyle Pitts they are going to get Kyle Pitts. We won tonight, against the Lions, against Denver and against the Washington Football Team and we won’t be in a spot to draft him anyway. I

I agree with the idea that adding a dynamic TE to our offense would be extremely beneficial, but the reason so many people are against the idea of it in the first round is because of the ability to find comparable production later in the draft at the TE position, more so than other positions.

You have to look at the draft as a whole, not in a vacuum at each round, although a lot of bad GMs do.

Lets assign a 1-100 grade to players to illustrate this (with 100 being the best) would you prefer? 

95(TE) in the first and 50(OT) in the fourth

or 

90(OT) in the first and 80(TE) in the fourth

(and yes I just made numbers up but it illustrates the point)

Drafting well is just about picking the best player in the first, its about drafting the best class overall.

For whatever reason, certain positions have historically been easier to find later in the draft, or at the very least their production doesn't drop off as much.   TEs, RBs, OGs, run stopping DTs, all seem a little easier to find later.  

Don't get me wrong, the idea of adding a Kelce or Kittle to this offense is very tempting, and maybe depending on where we pick he will be the smart play, but history just doesn't support it.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Varking]

1 hour ago, AU-panther said:

I agree with the idea that adding a dynamic TE to our offense would be extremely beneficial, but the reason so many people are against the idea of it in the first round is because of the ability to find comparable production later in the draft at the TE position, more so than other positions.

You have to look at the draft as a whole, not in a vacuum at each round, although a lot of bad GMs do.

Lets assign a 1-100 grade to players to illustrate this (with 100 being the best) would you prefer? 

95(TE) in the first and 50(OT) in the fourth

or 

90(OT) in the first and 80(TE) in the fourth

(and yes I just made numbers up but it illustrates the point)

Drafting well is just about picking the best player in the first, its about drafting the best class overall.

For whatever reason, certain positions have historically been easier to find later in the draft, or at the very least their production doesn't drop off as much.   TEs, RBs, OGs, run stopping DTs, all seem a little easier to find later.  

Don't get me wrong, the idea of adding a Kelce or Kittle to this offense is very tempting, and maybe depending on where we pick he will be the smart play, but history just doesn't support it.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

Completely understand this take. I just believe that Pitts is.. let’s say a 90. The next closest TE in this class or any of the previous first rounds looks like a 70 to me in comparison. Look at any of them in their best year and through three full games of play he is close or surpassing their productivity for their entire season in college. 
 

But this is why you have a big board and grades. If you feel like there is a bigger drop between offensive lineman from where you are picking and where you pick again it might be better to take the lineman there. History is good for reference. It normally you don’t draft a Mahomes when Alex Smith is giving you deep playoff runs. You don’t draft a Josh Rosen in the first round to draft a Murray in the first next year. You don’t normally draft an Aaron Hernandez and a Gronk in the same draft. But sometimes the value or potential of those players far outweighs the risk of what else you could be passing up. 
 

My ideal draft scenario has us taking Justin Fields still. There’s a lot of football left and we could dramatically shift our draft position by seasons end. 

[AU-panther]

1 hour ago, Varking said:

Completely understand this take. I just believe that Pitts is.. let’s say a 90. The next closest TE in this class or any of the previous first rounds looks like a 70 to me in comparison. Look at any of them in their best year and through three full games of play he is close or surpassing their productivity for their entire season in college. 
 

But this is why you have a big board and grades. If you feel like there is a bigger drop between offensive lineman from where you are picking and where you pick again it might be better to take the lineman there. History is good for reference. It normally you don’t draft a Mahomes when Alex Smith is giving you deep playoff runs. You don’t draft a Josh Rosen in the first round to draft a Murray in the first next year. You don’t normally draft an Aaron Hernandez and a Gronk in the same draft. But sometimes the value or potential of those players far outweighs the risk of what else you could be passing up. 
 

My ideal draft scenario has us taking Justin Fields still. There’s a lot of football left and we could dramatically shift our draft position by seasons end. 

I agree that Pitts might be the best TE prospect over the past 10 years, but both Ebon and Howard were very highly rated prospects.

I posted this earlier:

Top 5 TEs based on yardage this year:

Kelce RD2, Kittle RD5, Waller RD6, Gisicki RD2, Henry RD2

1st round TEs 2014-2019

Ebron, Howard, Engram, Njoku, Hurst, Hockenson, Fant

I get the temptation though, in today's NFL I really think you want to have at least 2 true difference makers on offense in the passing game.  With Kelce and Hill, KC has two guys that both can beat single converge consistently, you can't double everyone.

There definitely would be worst choices for us in the first round.  I wouldn't be opposed to Rondale Moore depending on where we draft, even though a lot of people think we are set at WR.  I'm not convinced we will pay Samuel.