So, The Panthers might have gotten a franchise safety/LB, a franchise DT, and a franchise DE in the same draft.

[panthers55]

Hurney gets credit for getting Rhule the guys he wanted. Rhule gets credit for doing a great coaching job and instilling a winning culture. Tepper gets credit for installing a process and not meddling too.much.  

[MasterAwesome]

3 hours ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

Rhule is quite obviously Tepper's hire. How you could watch the comments by Tepper and not be convinced of that would be hard to fathom. To be fair it's a hire that seems endorsed by Hurney. With regards to Hurney as the gm for Fox and Rivera, Richardson clearly both believed in minimal coaching turnover and at least claimed to espouse an owner's hands off approach, so on paper it's Hurney's call to remove them if needed.  While I doubt that Hurney ever made such a case to his owner in either instance, I'll also grant it seem unlikely Richardson would have approved such a move based on what we know of him, so i'm willing to meet you halfway on that point.

However one thing we do know about Hurney as a gm that HC is pretty much irrelevant to is his contract negotiation skill set, and that not only was terrible, but has shown zero signs of improvement with Hurney 2.0. 

I am inclined to give Rhule more credit for the draft/offseason than Hurney based on the rather simple logic that it appears a vast improvement over past drafts/offseasons and Rhule is the variable that changed, not Hurney. Occam's Razor would suggest he is the most likely cause of the change.

Man...I genuinely like you as a poster and I think you're a good, fair, objective voice on the Huddle, but I generally find it disingenuous to selectively apply criteria, especially when it comes to someone's role within the organization.  I'll grant you the benefit of the doubt and say maybe I'm just misinterpreting something here.  You brought up the fact that it's the GM's responsibility to hire/fire coaches so the previous coaches' failures were on him...but Rhule?  Not in that case...that was all Tepper.  I find these kinds of proclamations to be pretty weak and empty considering we don't know what goes on behind the scenes.  That's why we often defer to the clear-cut established roles that are outlined because ultimately those are their responsibilities.  You say "how you could watch the comments by Tepper and not be convinced of that would be hard to fathom" and yet you say with a straight face that Richardson "claimed to espouse an owner's hands off approach, so on paper it's Hurney's call to remove them if needed"...despite the mountain of evidence that suggests Richardson was indeed quite a meddling owner (and more fundamentally, a control freak) - namely everything that went down during the lockout coupled with things like telling Cam Newton he can't have any tattoos.  Those are the markings of a hands-off owner to you?

Besides, it's already been reported that Hurney had a role in the Rhule hire, beyond simply an endorsement.

Quote

At some point Monday afternoon, between helping Matt Rhule and his wife unload luggage from the car after their vacation to Mexico and eating 20 meatballs during their conversation, Carolina Panthers general manager Marty Hurney became convinced the Baylor coach was “the guy."

Owner David Tepper and communications director Steven Drummond already had that feeling, but getting the skeptical Hurney on board was key.

“Once Marty moved over that way, we were just like, ‘We’re there,’" Tepper said.

https://www.espn.com/blog/carolina-panthers/post/_/id/33206/meatball-hero-why-matt-rhule-felt-right-for-the-panthers

The last line is a QUOTE from Tepper...clearly he values Hurney's input whether people can rationalize it or not.  If you're an owner and you intend on unilaterally making a decision about who you want your head coach to be, you don't bring along your GM to the interviews.  Do I think Tepper would have still hired Rhule if Hurney wasn't on board?  Almost certainly...but clearly that was a joint decision.

Your point about Hurney's contract negotiation skills is irrelevant to this thread - this isn't a thread discussing broadly if Hurney is a good GM or not.  It's about whether to credit Hurney or Rhule with the draft selections.

But back to that point: let's be extremely charitable and say Rhule gets all the credit for the draft and was behind every selection, even though it has at LEAST been reported that Rhule wanted to trade down in the draft while Hurney wanted Brown at #7.  If Rhule hit it out of the park with this draft and is presumed to have an incredible eye for talent at selecting players that he can then utilize to tremendous success, do you really want to risk bringing in an egotistical Gettleman 2.0 type GM to overrhule him on draft selections?  Would you agree that a GM/head coach synergistic relationship is of utmost importance to an organization's success?  Clearly Hurney and Rhule have an excellent working relationship if the first quarter of the season is any indication...why threaten that?  I would hate to run into a scenario where the GM and head coach are butting heads and there's an internal struggle for power.

Sorry for the long post...I'm even too worn out now to provide an obligatory TL/DR summary.

[MechaZain]

4 hours ago, panthers55 said:

Hurney gets credit for getting Rhule the guys he wanted. Rhule gets credit for doing a great coaching job and instilling a winning culture. Tepper gets credit for installing a process and not meddling too.much.  

100%. Under Richardson it was the GM's roster to build and the coaches job to make it work. Tepper deserves credit for flipping that dynamic. Rhule deserves credit for executing the plan. Hurney deserves credit for successfully adapting.

[Mr. Scot]

Just a tad early...

[nctarheelreincarnated]

6 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Just a tad early...

Said it was early, and said might in the title. 

[PantherOnTheProwl1523]

1 hour ago, nctarheelreincarnated said:

Said it was early, and said might in the title. 

[1of10Charnatives]

10 hours ago, MasterAwesome said:

Man...I genuinely like you as a poster and I think you're a good, fair, objective voice on the Huddle, but I generally find it disingenuous to selectively apply criteria, especially when it comes to someone's role within the organization.  I'll grant you the benefit of the doubt and say maybe I'm just misinterpreting something here.  You brought up the fact that it's the GM's responsibility to hire/fire coaches so the previous coaches' failures were on him...but Rhule?  Not in that case...that was all Tepper.  I find these kinds of proclamations to be pretty weak and empty considering we don't know what goes on behind the scenes.  That's why we often defer to the clear-cut established roles that are outlined because ultimately those are their responsibilities.  You say "how you could watch the comments by Tepper and not be convinced of that would be hard to fathom" and yet you say with a straight face that Richardson "claimed to espouse an owner's hands off approach, so on paper it's Hurney's call to remove them if needed"...despite the mountain of evidence that suggests Richardson was indeed quite a meddling owner (and more fundamentally, a control freak) - namely everything that went down during the lockout coupled with things like telling Cam Newton he can't have any tattoos.  Those are the markings of a hands-off owner to you?

Besides, it's already been reported that Hurney had a role in the Rhule hire, beyond simply an endorsement.

https://www.espn.com/blog/carolina-panthers/post/_/id/33206/meatball-hero-why-matt-rhule-felt-right-for-the-panthers

The last line is a QUOTE from Tepper...clearly he values Hurney's input whether people can rationalize it or not.  If you're an owner and you intend on unilaterally making a decision about who you want your head coach to be, you don't bring along your GM to the interviews.  Do I think Tepper would have still hired Rhule if Hurney wasn't on board?  Almost certainly...but clearly that was a joint decision.

Your point about Hurney's contract negotiation skills is irrelevant to this thread - this isn't a thread discussing broadly if Hurney is a good GM or not.  It's about whether to credit Hurney or Rhule with the draft selections.

But back to that point: let's be extremely charitable and say Rhule gets all the credit for the draft and was behind every selection, even though it has at LEAST been reported that Rhule wanted to trade down in the draft while Hurney wanted Brown at #7.  If Rhule hit it out of the park with this draft and is presumed to have an incredible eye for talent at selecting players that he can then utilize to tremendous success, do you really want to risk bringing in an egotistical Gettleman 2.0 type GM to overrhule him on draft selections?  Would you agree that a GM/head coach synergistic relationship is of utmost importance to an organization's success?  Clearly Hurney and Rhule have an excellent working relationship if the first quarter of the season is any indication...why threaten that?  I would hate to run into a scenario where the GM and head coach are butting heads and there's an internal struggle for power.

Sorry for the long post...I'm even too worn out now to provide an obligatory TL/DR summary.

I promise I'll give you a response to this but it will take a little bit of time. Short atm.