How different are we than last year?

[kungfoodude]

13 minutes ago, stbugs said:

How did Gettleman not see anything? That’s what I’m saying. If a GM is fired before players can be resigned you can’t say he didn’t see their worth. While I agree somewhat. Maybe Star would have been better than Poe. Instead of wasting money of Reid and Smith and Searcy we could have kept Norwell who excelled for us. Might have dumped Gano for Butker as well and kept Norwell.

It’s not about lauding DG but it’s a terrible argument saying he didn’t extend players when he was gone. We wasted a poo ton of cap the past two years because the drafts gave us 2 players. If players he selected are traded or not resigned but are playing elsewhere due to a new GM. Gettleman isn’t a great GM but the wheels fell off the bus as soon as Marty was able to put his stamp on the team. Thank god for Rhule and co. If Rivera was still here god knows we would have had another Hurney special draft and this team would be even more devoid of talent. We weren’t devoid of talent in 2017.

Dude.....come on. Try and twist my argument all you want but this speaks for itself:

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/car/draft.htm

You can be as big a fanboy as you want but you need to simply realize that Dave Gettleman was not a good GM. The fact he is even still being talked about in that way by ANYONE shows how unbelievably terrible this organization has performed in the GM category. By all means though, if he is your boy, go adopt the Giants for a season and watch that dumpster fire he created at work. You won't miss much in 2020 for the Panthers. Hell, ask Giants fans what they think of him. Probably a lot worse than most Panthers fans do. 

[Basbear]

1 hour ago, thefuzz said:

It was a partial teardown, the type that keeps you around 7-9 on good years, and 4-12 on "unlucky" years.

We started tearing it down, and got scared, so we started to build it up, but we lack talent, so now we are just hoping for the best....which is rarely good.

I've been almost 100% against the moves of this franchise for the last 3 years, and while I want the team to do well, I have lost so much faith in this organization.  The ineptitude at the top is just scary.

Where you against the draft picks too?? McCoy, williams, Paradis signing when it happened? The new practice mecca? And you didnt like Rivera getting canned either?

[thefuzz]

36 minutes ago, Basbear said:

Where you against the draft picks too?? McCoy, williams, Paradis signing when it happened? The new practice mecca? And you didnt like Rivera getting canned either?

What did firing Rivera mid season do?  Did Tepp fire Hurney with him, or did he allow the guy who hired Ron help him hire the next guy too?

Was against Williams and Paradis, go look it up.

Couldn't care less about a practice mecca, our logo at midfield, or a soccer team.

I'm not going to sit here and say that every single move was bad, that's why I use words like almost....

However, many of the moves this franchise has made since Tepper took over are questionable at best, most are terrible.  In a league where it's really really hard to win, and the margins are razor thin, we just don't make the cut, unsurprisingly.

 

[thefuzz]

1 hour ago, kungfoodude said:

Dude.....come on. Try and twist my argument all you want but this speaks for itself:

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/car/draft.htm

You can be as big a fanboy as you want but you need to simply realize that Dave Gettleman was not a good GM. The fact he is even still being talked about in that way by ANYONE shows how unbelievably terrible this organization has performed in the GM category. By all means though, if he is your boy, go adopt the Giants for a season and watch that dumpster fire he created at work. You won't miss much in 2020 for the Panthers. Hell, ask Giants fans what they think of him. Probably a lot worse than most Panthers fans do. 

What he's trying to say, is that DG didn't have enough time on the job to extend the players that he thought were good, long term players for the Panthers.  He didn't want to extend Olsen and Davis (rightly) and it got him fired.  He did extend Cam, to a really good contract at that.  I'm sure I'm missing someone, but I can't remember a holdover player from the previous regime that DG should have signed?  Especially to the deals that said players may have signed.  Norman wasn't an issue for me...but maybe there are a few more that I can't recall.?

We have not had a good GM here in over 20 years....20.  And we wonder why we yet again find ourselves as one of the least talented teams in the NFL.

[kungfoodude]

5 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

What he's trying to say, is that DG didn't have enough time on the job to extend the players that he thought were good, long term players for the Panthers.  He didn't want to extend Olsen and Davis (rightly) and it got him fired.  He did extend Cam, to a really good contract at that.  I'm sure I'm missing someone, but I can't remember a holdover player from the previous regime that DG should have signed?  Especially to the deals that said players may have signed.  Norman wasn't an issue for me...but maybe there are a few more that I can't recall.?

We have not had a good GM here in over 20 years....20.  And we wonder why we yet again find ourselves as one of the least talented teams in the NFL.

He extended Short and he may have played a role in the Turner deal, although that was technically signed three days after he was fired but the first day of Hurney being there. I guess they might both get credit/blame for that one. 

For the most part, I don't think he would have extended many of the players he drafted in 2017, perhaps Moton. I honestly doubt he would have kept CMC at the price tag and I am not sure if he would have kept Bradbury. He seems to have a track record of jettisoning high paid DB's. 

Between his poor talent evaluation, his decreasing returns on dumpster diving and signing that whale of a contract for one of the worst OT's in the NFL, he absolutely deserved to get fired. Hell, the guys he wanted to get rid of outproduced a lot of his picks to replace them. 

Either way, the last statement you made hit the nail on the head. We haven't had a good GM in a long time, if ever. If Tepper wants to send this ship in the right direction, he needs to address that. The fact that he hasn't is absolutely mind numbing. 

[Basbear]

30 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

What did firing Rivera mid season do?  Did Tepp fire Hurney with him, or did he allow the guy who hired Ron help him hire the next guy too?

Was against Williams and Paradis, go look it up.

Couldn't care less about a practice mecca, our logo at midfield, or a soccer team.

I'm not going to sit here and say that every single move was bad, that's why I use words like almost....

However, many of the moves this franchise has made since Tepper took over are questionable at best, most are terrible.  In a league where it's really really hard to win, and the margins are razor thin, we just don't make the cut, unsurprisingly.

 

I trust you and aware of your almost word. I was just curious, cause at the time liked the 2019 off-season as a whole. It didnt turn out the way anyone wanted and really bombed badly. Hell this 2020 draft is my favorite herinay one in his history. Im the rare honest person and at the time agreed with many of them. Just been wrong waaaay more than I have in past years, my sports soul has been scared being a panther fan. Was against Marty coming back in a true WTF NFL team moment, had no choice to give him another shot, liken herniay 2.2.......... not liken the results.  

[MasterAwesome]

1 hour ago, thefuzz said:

What did firing Rivera mid season do?  Did Tepp fire Hurney with him, or did he allow the guy who hired Ron help him hire the next guy too?

Was against Williams and Paradis, go look it up.

Couldn't care less about a practice mecca, our logo at midfield, or a soccer team.

I'm not going to sit here and say that every single move was bad, that's why I use words like almost....

However, many of the moves this franchise has made since Tepper took over are questionable at best, most are terrible.  In a league where it's really really hard to win, and the margins are razor thin, we just don't make the cut, unsurprisingly.

 

Then who is this impostor posting in the Matt Paradis signing thread?  He's definitely got your trademark passive-aggression nailed.

[Basbear]

13 minutes ago, MasterAwesome said:

Then who is this impostor posting in the Matt Paradis signing thread?  He's definitely got your trademark passive-aggression nailed.

 maybe @thefuzz forgot about that one..

[MasterAwesome]

23 minutes ago, Basbear said:

 maybe @thefuzz forgot about that one..

Probably a glitch in his AI. Then his programmer learned about this corrupted deviation from his coding that automates 17 anti-Hurney rants a day and then wiped it from his hard drive. So probably not his fault...he didn’t have any record of it, BUT THE INTERNET NEVER FORGETS!

[thefuzz]

13 hours ago, Basbear said:

 maybe @thefuzz forgot about that one..

I did, and I'll take back my words.  I thought I remember wanting to draft a C the year before high, and would have preferred that to Paradis, but could have been mistaken.  I was really out on Williams, unless my old age is acting up again.

Again, I have been against almost all of the moves this franchise has made since bringing back MH.

[kungfoodude]

9 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

I did, and I'll take back my words.  I thought I remember wanting to draft a C the year before high, and would have preferred that to Paradis, but could have been mistaken.  I was really out on Williams, unless my old age is acting up again.

Again, I have been against almost all of the moves this franchise has made since bringing back MH.

The bulk of the board thought Paradis was a good signing. I remember that quite clearly. 

I don't recall a single person here predicting he would be the disaster that he has been.

[stbugs]

37 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

The bulk of the board thought Paradis was a good signing. I remember that quite clearly. 

I don't recall a single person here predicting he would be the disaster that he has been.

We did. I liked the signing but the key note is that we aren’t team doctors and GMs so we have no access to that info. Clearly when Elway came out and said what he did, he was speaking the truth even though a lot of us thought it was sour grapes.

It was a good signing if we were getting pre-injury Paradis. We weren’t and Elway already knew that.

That said, I wanted McCoy so I would have been OK with a “healthy” Paradis and then Risner or even McCoy at LG/takeover for Paradis. I just didn’t want Dillard (abused as Senior Bowl) or Little (worst looking OL at combine drills).

Getting a clearly not pre-injury Paradis and Little was like a double whammy and both of those are on the GM. Hurney looked at Paradis and Little’s PFF numbers and ignore the injuries and combine and as a team we suffered.

It is not a contradiction to think that us fans could be excited at getting a premier C if he wasn’t damaged goods and that us fans are posed that the GM clearly didn’t do his homework and signed a mega deal for a clearly injured/not premier anymore C. We should also be upset that Marty clearly ignored the combine with Little and the free fall he was in thinking he’d not be there way later.

[kungfoodude]

2 minutes ago, stbugs said:

We did. I liked the signing but the key note is that we aren’t team doctors and GMs so we have no access to that info. Clearly when Elway came out and said what he did, he was speaking the truth even though a lot of us thought it was sour grapes.

It was a good signing if we were getting pre-injury Paradis. We weren’t and Elway already knew that.

That said, I wanted McCoy so I would have been OK with a “healthy” Paradis and then Risner or even McCoy at LG/takeover for Paradis. I just didn’t want Dillard (abused as Senior Bowl) or Little (worst looking OL at combine drills).

Getting a clearly not pre-injury Paradis and Little was like a double whammy and both of those are on the GM. Hurney looked at Paradis and Little’s PFF numbers and ignore the injuries and combine and as a team we suffered.

It is not a contradiction to think that us fans could be excited at getting a premier C if he wasn’t damaged goods and that us fans are posed that the GM clearly didn’t do his homework and signed a mega deal for a clearly injured/not premier anymore C. We should also be upset that Marty clearly ignored the combine with Little and the free fall he was in thinking he’d not be there way later.

Yeah, I remember how strong that draft was with interior linemen and how fuging weak it was on OT's. I fully understand that OT's have greater value but this was another classic Hurney reach on one of "his" guys. Had we spent the two picks for Little on the interior of our OL, we might not be talking about what a dumpster fire our OL is right now. Hell, we might still have a healthy Cam for that matter. 

I know this, if the interior of that OL gets blown up to the extent it did last year, there is literally zero defense for keeping that dolt Hurney around. None.

[trueblade]

17 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

Gettleman SUCKS. Hurney SUCKS.  There is no benefit to rehashing the same "sinking versus floating turd" argument again. Now that Gettleman has successfully deconstructed a successful franchise in New York and Hurney has deconstructed a not so successful franchise in Carolina, the full story has been told. They both fuging stink. 

I agree with this. The difference in the team's success can mostly be attributed to the fact that Cam was simply so great (and healthy) during one of their tenures that he could overcome their mistakes. Look at the WR crew Cam carried to SB50.