Long-time, Hurney hater here. but...

[stbugs]

4 hours ago, Car123 said:

2014-2016 drafts were awful.

2014 wasn't bad IMHO, I'd say it was better than average. Turner, Boston and Norwell all are still starters in the NFL 7 years later. Benjamin was a multi-year starter and Ealy and Bene were depth for a few years. Overall, there are 20 starter years in that draft class. In a couple years, they'll have more starter years than almost every draft class since 2000. The only ones with more starter years are the ones with TD, Peppers and Smith because those 3 guys have 12-16 starter years by themselves. Anyway, our drafts from 2013-2017 were better overall the 6 years around them until this year. I really like the draft this year, no idea if it will work out, but there aren't all the question marks. In 2018 and 2019, I liked Moore (man, we need WRs) and Thomas and last year I loved Burns and that's it. I liked the first 3 picks as much as the entire 2018/2019 drafts. Either way, Ron and Marty wasn't a good thing at all.

[stbugs]

1 hour ago, jfra78 said:

Also Grier was a Turner pick

That's been the problem with Marty. There's not disagreement. For as good a judge of college talent, he's either a complete yes man and thus useless or he agreed with Little and Grier being worth a 2nd rounder and 2 3rd rounders. Neither is a good thing. DJ Moore was a Turner pick as well. Norv probably got some slobber on Moore they way he was doting on him at the pro-day.

[Car123]

11 minutes ago, stbugs said:

2014 wasn't bad IMHO, I'd say it was better than average. Turner, Boston and Norwell all are still starters in the NFL 7 years later. Benjamin was a multi-year starter and Ealy and Bene were depth for a few years. Overall, there are 20 starter years in that draft class. In a couple years, they'll have more starter years than almost every draft class since 2000. The only ones with more starter years are the ones with TD, Peppers and Smith because those 3 guys have 12-16 starter years by themselves. Anyway, our drafts from 2013-2017 were better overall the 6 years around them until this year. I really like the draft this year, no idea if it will work out, but there aren't all the question marks. In 2018 and 2019, I liked Moore (man, we need WRs) and Thomas and last year I loved Burns and that's it. I liked the first 3 picks as much as the entire 2018/2019 drafts. Either way, Ron and Marty wasn't a good thing at all.

Norwell wasn’t drafted. Benjamin was a bust. We had no choice but to start him because we didn’t have anyone better. Ealy had one good game.  Bene was average in 2014 then went down hill after.

[KatsAzz]

6 hours ago, MHS831 said:

Yes, but we are going to have to make decision now- we can't wait for these kids to bust or boom--I cover that point in my post--Rhule said he'd pick Marty as his GM 10 out of 10 times.  You are the owner that just gave him a 7-year contract.  You let Hurney go now?

 

It is the GM's responsibility to get the HC the players he desires, so as long as Hurney stays in Rhule's and Tepper's good graces that will be how  long he will remain the Panthers GM, regardless of what a bunch of critical fans may thank. It is the old "Golden Rule", The one who holds the Gold Rules or in this case Rhules.

[KatsAzz]

2 hours ago, RASTAN66 said:

Hurndog is the GM in name only...

...he has no autonomous decision making power and hasn't since Tepper bought the team.

The Firm is now running the organization.

Hurndog is a cog in the wheel but he doesn't have his own set of keys.

Thank you. Finally someone who gets it.

[Ricky Spanish]

No.

No no.

No no no no no no no no no no no no no no.

No.

No.

• 102-122 record as GM.
• Has not put together a winning roster since 2008.
• Bruce fuging Allen had more recent success than Marty fuging Hurney.

1 draft does not change the literal DECADES of mediocrity. Put someone else in as GM and put Hurney out to pasture. You fuging people and your short term memories, Jesus Christ. 

[pantherclaw]

As long as Hurney has had GM decisions, the draft choices always had input from the head coach. Yes, Hurney had the finial say, but he's always worked well with the coaches. 

At the end of his first term? I was ready to see him gone.  I truly feel he has changed with his time away from the team.  At first, while I was giving him a chance, I had my doubts.  I was honestly surprised he was retained a year ago.  The fact he has build such a good working relationship with Tepper, and now, Rhule, says a lot to me. 

This was a very good draft from the, it just happened, and it's way to early to judge, perspective.   Once again, it's not just Hurney. 

As far as contracts, they have been what market dictates except when the decision has come down from ownership.  

As for wins and loses, I bet every GM could have more control over that. There is simply way to many other variables.  

IMO, he's doing his job as well as that is expected of him.  Pretty sure he doesn't have all the responsibilities that he use to have. If he, Tepper, and Rhule are working so well together, and this franchise continues to project upwards, then there would be no reason to fire him. 

Holding him hostage over old busts is silly. Every GM has a long list of busts.

[FuFuLamePoo]

This is some of the most insane fuging poo I have ever read. Marty Hurney has compiled a record of like 102-122 as the man leading this ship, absolutely fuging abysmal. You really want to extend him because ONE draft looks OKAY on paper? I agree the draft looks good overall even though I didn't like the Brown pick too much. But we have not seen a single one of these players play, and you think it's time to extend him? This fuging snake that has a proven record of losing?

Marty is a terrible GM. It was proven the first go around and it's happening again. Tepper wanting to embrace an "analytics" approach was clearly a heaping pile of hot fuging garbage. If you "embrace" analytics you take Tampa Bay's 2021 first, don't spend a top 10 pick on a run stuffer, and you don't let so many quality young players walk for nothing. Do you guys realize we have a top 5 RT on our hands, and his contract expires in a year? There should be an extension delivered to Taylor Moton tomorrow morning, he is one of the most valuable players this team has right now.  But I have zero fuging doubts that Hurney will never come to this conclusion, instead he'll let him walk.

We've seen Curtis Samuel just run right past people for well over a year now. Other (smart) teams clearly realize he's a special talent and were trying to get him during the draft. I'm glad we kept him because I realize he can be great, but it won't matter. This new offensive system couldn't be a worse fit for him, he'll walk after a 600-700 yard season this year and then thrive somewhere else like Kansas City or Philadelphia. Meanwhile we could have gotten a third round pick for him.

This guy does not plan for the future at all. He doesn't fuging understand it. Don't even get me started on the CMC extension. I do agree CMC offers more value than a standard running back, but I'm still afraid this deal will blow up in our faces. 

This is just the start. I really don't know what more you people need to see. Marty Hurney is a bad GM, he always has been and he always will be. He isn't going to change and our ceiling is severely limited  as long as he has any power here.

[RASTAN66]

Those of you who hate the idea of Marty as the GM...

...R-E-L-A-X...

...Marty is NOT THE GM!

Sure, his business card says "GM" on it but Marty is not functioning as a real GM akin to Lynch or Beane or Belichick.

I'm surprised at how many fans cannot grasp this fact

Hurndog has a seat at the table and his job is to gather, organize and present information --- said info is then used as The Firm goes through a collaborative process in order to make good decsions.

Due to his seat at the table Hurn is able to make his voice heard and he can give an opinion, but he has NO SOLO DECISION MAKING AUTHORITY....AT ALL.

Got it?!?

 

[1of10Charnatives]

16 hours ago, MHS831 said:

can you be mad at him after that draft?  Of course, his job involves many other duties than drafting players---but most Hurney haters (myself included) loath MH for everything he has done after round 1 of the draft.  A few contracts and extensions, but 80% of my loathing was based on the draft.

Sure, maybe the difference was Rhule and his staff.  But whatever it was, whatever combination they used, it seemed to work.   If credit goes to Rhule, credit goes to Marty for listening.  If credit goes to Marty for finding the right players (as we seem to have done), credit goes to Rhule for his communication.  The bottom line--it seems to have worked.  While other teams were mucking through the later rounds in a predictable fashion, the Panthers went WVU/XFL (21 year old S) and found a 335lb NT who can run a 4.8 40.  The grabbed an undrafted WR with 1600 yards and 17 TDs in college--who does that?

I am not a Hurney fan, but how do you not extend his deal after what we saw?  Maybe he was a good boy knowing he was on double-secret probation, or maybe he and Rhule are a good team.  Of course, it is easy when these guys have  never played a down and the coach's W-L record is 0-0.  Still, I think the force to reel Marty into the fold has arrived.  Now we can benefit from his experience and restrain his impulsive tendencies on draft day--maybe.

Are there any haters who are thinking, "Maybe, just maybe..."?

Listen not for nothing, but do you know the story of the Zen Master and the little boy?

We'll see.

[Car123]

7 hours ago, RASTAN66 said:

Those of you who hate the idea of Marty as the GM...

...R-E-L-A-X...

...Marty is NOT THE GM!

Sure, his business card says "GM" on it but Marty is not functioning as a real GM akin to Lynch or Beane or Belichick.

I'm surprised at how many fans cannot grasp this fact

Hurndog has a seat at the table and his job is to gather, organize and present information --- said info is then used as The Firm goes through a collaborative process in order to make good decsions.

Due to his seat at the table Hurn is able to make his voice heard and he can give an opinion, but he has NO SOLO DECISION MAKING AUTHORITY....AT ALL.

Got it?!?

 

You must have a role with Carolina since you know everything about everyone’s role. I’m impressed.

[Khyber53]

17 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

It's not. Neither is all the players being happy.

The whole "okay, maybe we aren't winning but hey, at least everybody is happy" thing was the standard Jerry Richardson set, and he got exactly the results that kind of atmosphere gets you.

If that's your standard for "good", then by all means we can go on another 50 years just like the last 25 and all just be happy that we're in the NFL.

I said that is the hallmark of decent management. Not great. I went on to say that winning consistently is much tougher, and therefore a much more important measuring stick. I also pointed out how incredibly difficult that is in the NFL, a system that has a dizzying array of moving parts to keep track of and plan for. Hurney has not proven himself to be any better at doing that than the average GM in the league. That doesn't make him terrible, but it doesn't make him good, either -- just decent, middle of the pack, but with a few high spots.

I think you might have quit reading my post after you found your talking point.

[Mr. Scot]

21 minutes ago, Khyber53 said:

I said that is the hallmark of decent management. Not great. I went on to say that winning consistently is much tougher, and therefore a much more important measuring stick. I also pointed out how incredibly difficult that is in the NFL, a system that has a dizzying array of moving parts to keep track of and plan for. Hurney has not proven himself to be any better at doing that than the average GM in the league. That doesn't make him terrible, but it doesn't make him good, either -- just decent, middle of the pack, but with a few high spots.

I think you might have quit reading my post after you found your talking point.

Nah. I read the whole thing and responded to the general tone.

The bottom line is you're okay with him being average because the job is hard.

I'm not. I want somebody who's actually good. But as long as Panther fans continue to settle for "well, he's okay so I guess that's good enough", that's what we'll continue to get.

[ickmule]

Once again, be careful what you wish for.