Most 1st Team All-Pros Drafted Since 2000

[Mr. Scot]

2 minutes ago, Jon Snow said:

He wasn't hired as a GM.  So another "it's everyone's fault but Marty's".

GM? He didn't even get a sniff as a personnel guy or a consultant, not even  so much as a low level scout.

Hell, even Ryan Grigson has a job again.

[jfra78]

3 minutes ago, Jon Snow said:

He wasn't hired as a GM.  So another "it's everyone's fault but Marty's".

And your take is "it's nobody's fault but Hurney's".  Just not true.  I believe Marty gave Rivera and Fox talented enough teams to be succesful and they just weren't.  Sounds like a coaching problem to me.  

[Madwolf]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and tell you guys that Hurney isn't as influential as a cog as so many seem to think. He's a guy whose generally agreeable and just brought in to manage personalities in a room. He's not the guy making the absolute call on any one pick at most times. He likely leaves a lot of it to the coaches and staffs and puts the input in as needed. 

The reason we have had such success with drafting All Pros is because we have trusted the entire team of guys in the room.

Outside of draft day is where we screw up.

[panthers55]

2 minutes ago, onmyown said:

Why do you think there was not any interest from other teams in hiring him for a GM position after a decade of experience in the field?

Actually it isn't that frequently that GMs get a second or third chance. Here is the article.

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/nfl-general-managers-second-chances-marty-hurney-belichick/yf417wiskv3tzhhnsoh5607l

 

[Madwolf]

1 minute ago, jfra78 said:

And your take is "it's nobody's fault but Hurney's".  Just not true.  I believe Marty gave Rivera and Fox talented enough teams to be succesful and they just weren't.  Sounds like a coaching problem to me.  

You're focusing too much on one area of the Franchise. Sure, our coaching may not have been the best at times, but it's hard to say it was always bad either. 

The simpler explanation wasn't that we screwed it up on game-day, but that we screwed up at all levels of the organization.

There is a ton of evidence for this. I mean as much as people were irritated with some on the field stuff, how many people get upset about our contract and money management issues? How often did than, and other poor choices lead us to letting good players walk or not being able to sign a good, economic free agent?

There is more to the failures the Panthers have experienced than just Xs and Os.

[Basbear]

34 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

GM? He didn't even get a sniff as a personnel guy or a consultant, not even  so much as a low level scout.

Hell, even Ryan Grigson has a job again.

I heard he did get offers, just passed on them. Just didnt like the role or org or didnt want to move. Not saying I believe the reports, one of the sources was Darin Gantt.  

[Peon Awesome]

31 minutes ago, panthers55 said:

Actually it isn't that frequently that GMs get a second or third chance. Here is the article.

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/nfl-general-managers-second-chances-marty-hurney-belichick/yf417wiskv3tzhhnsoh5607l

 

Thank you for this. I was honestly wondering how often GMs have gotten 2nd gigs because it seems like they all too commonly face a 1 strike and you're out policy. Good to know I wasn't just making that up. Kind of puts it into perspective for those people thumping their chests asking why Hurney wasn't hired again. Also many of those same people also come up with excuses on why Rivera was the only fired coach in 2020 to get another head coaching gig. Funny how easy it is to make any narrative fit your argument.

[Yaboychris28]

We’re a below average organization. Just the facts. All that talent and no hardware. Dang, shame..

[Mr. Scot]

8 minutes ago, Basbear said:

I heard he did get offers, just passed on them. Just didnt like the role or org or didnt want to move. Not saying I believe the reports, one of the sources was Darin Gantt.  

Nope, and Hurney himself confirmed it in more than one place. He told both Sports Illustrated and the Charlotte Observer that he actively looked for another chance to get back in the football business, but none came.

The closest he got was being a commentator on ESPN's NFL Insiders for a while before he bought a local radio station.

[Basbear]

If only the NFL was measured and only played by all-pros. 

Ive said this before in the Marty vs Dave debate.

Players 1-8 marty wins

Players 9-24 close,  edge to Dave

Players 25-53 Dave wins

Practice Squad Dave destroys Marty.

Very simply if no players get hurt, Martys teams would win over the season. That never happens, Dave is much better at team building and adding quality depth.  It also is a build in excuse for marty when a top end starter is lost due to injury, that should have never happened. NFL is not like MLB/NHL where one pitcher/goalie can win the game. This is 11 vs 11 and each one makes a difference. Many times you do not get your best 11 on the field, so you need to have quality depth too. 

[Basbear]

2 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Nope, and Hurney himself confirmed it in more than one place. He told both Sports Illustrated and the Charlotte Observer that he actively looked for another chance to get back in the football business, but none came.

The closest he got was being a commentator on ESPN's NFL Insiders for a while before he bought a local radio station.

Do you have any of the articles handy where Marty confirmed this?

[Mr. Scot]

11 minutes ago, Peon Awesome said:

Thank you for this. I was honestly wondering how often GMs have gotten 2nd gigs because it seems like they all too commonly face a 1 strike and you're out policy. Good to know I wasn't just making that up. Kind of puts it into perspective for those people thumping their chests asking why Hurney wasn't hired again. Also many of those same people also come up with excuses on why Rivera was the only fired coach in 2020 to get another head coaching gig. Funny how easy it is to make any narrative fit your argument.

Not an entirely accurate interpretation...

While it's true that very few fired GMs get a chance to be in that particular role again, it's not accurate to say they all remain unemployed. Many of them wind up as personnel guys, scouting directors or in other football related jobs.

it's not that different from a head coach who goes back to being a coordinator or position coach and tries to rebuild his resumé to get back into head coaching again. There's just a much lower success rate.

(unless you worked for Jerry Richardson)

[MasterAwesome]

9 minutes ago, Peon Awesome said:

Thank you for this. I was honestly wondering how often GMs have gotten 2nd gigs because it seems like they all too commonly face a 1 strike and you're out policy. Good to know I wasn't just making that up. Kind of puts it into perspective for those people thumping their chests asking why Hurney wasn't hired again. Also many of those same people also come up with excuses on why Rivera was the only fired coach in 2020 to get another head coaching gig. Funny how easy it is to make any narrative fit your argument.

And why Mike Shula was immediately hired as OC of the Giants after getting fired here.  Those people who use the league's lack of interest in Hurney as ammunition against him must also hold the belief that Rivera was a great coach and Shula was a great offensive coordinator due to them being swept up immediately by another team after their firing.  Or...like you said...that there's a bad-faith narrative at play.

[Mr. Scot]

12 minutes ago, Basbear said:

Do you have any of the articles handy where Marty confirmed this?

Marty Hurney gets full time job

When the Panthers got off to a 1-5 start in 2012, Hurney and Richardson mutually agreed to part ways, a move that might have saved Rivera’s job – and certainly saved the job of one or more of Rivera’s assistants.

While Carolina became a perennial playoff team under Rivera and Gettleman, the Panthers did so behind the contributions of many of the players Hurney drafted (Cam Newton, Ryan Kalil, Jonathan Stewart, Luke Kuechly, Thomas Davis, Josh Norman).

Meanwhile, Hurney bought a sports talk station in Charlotte, got remarried, started a new family and hoped for chance to get back in the business.

That opportunity came in July, a week before the Panthers reported to Spartanburg.

Marty Hurney's unusual path and unique story

Hurney said he “resigned” to probably not getting another GM chance after five years out. I think it’s obvious that one of the things he did well in his absence is keep a very low profile. He never criticized Gettleman. He never took too much (or any) praise for drafting Julius Peppers, Newton or Kuechly. When the Panthers got to the Super Bowl 25 months ago, you didn’t see stories with Hurney taking a bow for anything.

That fits well in the Panthers’ understated organization. And so it was easy for Richardson to reach back into his past after five years and ask Hurney to be his caretaker last July. That’s probably the biggest reason why Hurney is back, and back in power: He never burned a bridge, and was dutifully quiet in his time out of football. He knew, whether it be in Carolina or somewhere else, one thing owners hate is credit-taking.

“I’m fortunate to have another shot to be doing what I love,” Hurney said. “One thing Joe Gibbs always said was, ‘Don’t worry about the things you can’t control.’ I controlled what I could, and things worked out.”