2021 mock draft

[Growl]

3 minutes ago, Madwolf said:

You realize your mother didn't name you "Denial" because it was a was a river in Africa right?

at this point I would've just stopped posting and acted like i got caught up in something, bad call man.

[Madwolf]

Just now, Growl said:

at this point I would've just stopped posting and acted like i got caught up in something, bad call man.

The only person on your side is you right now.

[Madwolf]

I'm also not sure if you noticed, but all 4 of the Tackles are 1st and 2nd Round picks, and 2 of them are top 10.

[Growl]

4 minutes ago, Madwolf said:

The only person on your side is you right now.

am I on the "wrong side of history" too?what other phantom arguments should I be concerned about?

[Madwolf]

1 minute ago, Growl said:

am I on the "wrong side of history" too?what other phantom arguments should I be concerned about?

Do you want to know how many 1st round tackles were in the Super Bowl in the last 10 years?

[Growl]

17 minutes ago, Madwolf said:

I'm also not sure if you noticed, but all 4 of the Tackles are 1st and 2nd Round picks, and 2 of them are top 10.

oh I have no doubt that bad decision makers make bad decisions, my question is why did you back down from your original argument?

You've made it clear you did some digging (again) and combed through the depth charts of recent super bowl champions?

Why don't you share those results with us? I wanna see how many Franchise Defining Left Tackles were drafted in the Top 10 and changed the fortunes of some downtrodden organization by hoisting them on their shoulders and claiming a Lombardi. Careful now, I've no interest in seeing players who flamed out horribly/ waddled their way to another squad and got to enjoy the ride because the team that drafted them decreed they weren't worth it,  I wanna hear about these Culture Changers who anchored super bowl runs for the team that drafted them.

[Madwolf]

11 minutes ago, Growl said:

oh I have no doubt that bad decision makers make bad decisions, my question is why did you back down from your original argument?

You've made it clear you did some digging (again) and combed through the depth charts of recent super bowl champions?

Why don't you share those results with us? I wanna see how many Franchise Defining Left Tackles were drafted in the Top 10 and changed the fortunes of some downtrodden organization by hoisting them on their shoulders and claiming a Lombardi. Careful now, I've no interest in seeing players who flamed out horribly/ waddled their way to another squad and got to enjoy the ride because the team that drafted them decreed they weren't worth it,  I wanna hear about these Culture Changers who anchored super bowl runs for the team that drafted them.

In the last 10 Super Bowls, 15 of the tackles starting for either team were taken in the 1st round.

[Growl]

PREDICTION

madwolfs next post will feature

-offensive lines featuring a massive assortment of middle to late round picks, peppered with the occasional late first rounder that he tries to build up as the bedrock of his point despite them not meeting his original criteria

-players that were drafted high, then flamed out horribly, got picked up in free agency and happened to be on the roster when the new team they were JAGing on won the big game, perhaps an attempt at arguing that some guy like Greg Robinson is "actually a really solid player."

-a really boring insult, probably some silly gif that he tries to use as his claim of ultimate victory, hoping I simply won't respond and point out the above.

[Growl]

8 minutes ago, Madwolf said:

In the last 10 Super Bowls, 15 of the tackles starting for either team were taken in the 1st round.

Why dont you list those players for us?

Let's keep your own standard in mind! 1st round isn't good enough, were talking about the value of using a Top 10 pick on one.

We're also talking about players who were drafted by the team they ended up "leading" to the super bowl, but I'll be nice and broaden it up a bit and say that as long as they were a great player on the roster they won it all with, we can include them.

Let's really see how many of these 15 out of 40 eligible players were worth a top 10 pick.

[Panthero]

2 hours ago, Growl said:

6/10 is just over half, offering no real disparity between the first round & those taken later, and assuming madwolf had the right players listed last time he got sucked into this, the number is more or less prone to treading water or dipping, especially if you start including players who weren't playing for the team that drafted them when they managed to ride somebody's coattails to the super bowl, as madwolf was so gracious enough to accidentally point out last time 

 

of course im not even saying that offensive lineman aren't worth 2nd rounders or even 1st rounders-im saying they don't elevate your team in a way that other marquee positions found in the top 10 can. The assertion that I'm proclaiming all linemen should be claimed out of UDFA is fabricated because the evidence against my real point is scant.

 

 

 

I appreciate all that you said except the first sentence. Statistically, half in one(two) rounds is significant. Its the same thing with college star rankings. Half of the non-five star guys end up in the NFL, but youd still be a better guesser  by only going five star if its 6/10. Its 50-50 ish but one of those comes from a much smaller sample size, indicating a better hit rate. 

[Madwolf]

5 minutes ago, Growl said:

Why dont you list those players for us?

Let's keep your own standard in mind! 1st round isn't good enough, were talking about the value of using a Top 10 pick on one.

We're also talking about players who were drafted by the team they ended up "leading" to the super bowl, but I'll be nice and broaden it up a bit and say that as long as they were a great player on the roster they won it all with, we can include them.

Let's really see how many of these 15 out of 40 eligible players were worth a top 10 pick.

Look Mr. Scarf, it's very obvious you have a nice pile of data you'd like drawn out for you, but I don't work for free. So how about you paint your own little painting here for us, with all the details, and let us validate the credibility of your argument here.

First we were talking about tackles worth using a 1st round pick on.

Then it became a Top 10 pick, and may be even Top 5.

Then we're talking about if they were TRULY worth a Top 10 pick.

Then we wanted them re-ranked in their draft class according to value. And in that value, are we factoring in team fit?

And then you wanted them by how much they carried their team? And if we're going in that direction, how much does the team around them matter that they walked into? And how do we measure their impact? Are we looking at their peak seasons, or just the ones they went to the Super Bowl in? And if we're only looking at the ones they went to the Super Bowl in, are we not just then only evaluating them based on that single year?

And if we're going to talk about the whole picture, should we not discuss how the guys that got drafted after the Top10, or 1st round, or whatever, selection and instead got picked up in the 2nd and beyond should have been 1st round or Top 10 picks? And if that's the case, aren't we really arguing that they were mis-evaluated? And if they were mis-evaluated, does that mean they were more valuable and we're actually arguing for a Top10 tackle if they were picked correclty? And then doesn't the call the entire draft process into question?

So go ahead, dance for me puppet.

[Growl]

18 minutes ago, Madwolf said:

Look Mr. Scarf, it's very obvious you have a nice pile of data you'd like drawn out for you, but I don't work for free. So how about you paint your own little painting here for us, with all the details, and let us validate the credibility of your argument here.

First we were talking about tackles worth using a 1st round pick on.

Then it became a Top 10 pick, and may be even Top 5.

Then we're talking about if they were TRULY worth a Top 10 pick.

Then we wanted them re-ranked in their draft class according to value. And in that value, are we factoring in team fit?

And then you wanted them by how much they carried their team? And if we're going in that direction, how much does the team around them matter that they walked into? And how do we measure their impact? Are we looking at their peak seasons, or just the ones they went to the Super Bowl in? And if we're only looking at the ones they went to the Super Bowl in, are we not just then only evaluating them based on that single year?

And if we're going to talk about the whole picture, should we not discuss how the guys that got drafted after the Top10, or 1st round, or whatever, selection and instead got picked up in the 2nd and beyond should have been 1st round or Top 10 picks? And if that's the case, aren't we really arguing that they were mis-evaluated? And if they were mis-evaluated, does that mean they were more valuable and we're actually arguing for a Top10 tackle if they were picked correclty? And then doesn't the call the entire draft process into question?

So go ahead, dance for me puppet.

I'm gonna cut you off right there. If you trace back through this thread, you will find me saying , very plainly, that offensive tackles aren't worth a top 5 pick. 

I expanded the criteria to Top 10, against my own interests, expanding past even beyond my own convictions, for your benefit. There is a much bigger window for your to pull from here now, and yet you've still refused to lay out the names. 

 And we both know why.

 The only other criteria has been the obvious assertion

A)  that the players are actually good

B) and the since dropped, again, to your benefit, standard that they were playing for the team that drafted them when they won, which I could've fairly held on to given that a quality team picking up a player in free agency is no commentary on the value of drafting certain positions where.

The argument hasn't changed. The bar is low, and yet you still refuse to post the names. 

And we both know why.

 

[mrcompletely11]

3 minutes ago, Growl said:

I'm gonna cut you off right there. If you trace back through this thread, you will find me saying , very plainly, that offensive tackles aren't worth a top 5 pick. 

I expanded the criteria to Top 10, against my own interests, for your benefit. There is a much bigger window for your to pull from here now, and yet you've still refused to lay out the names. 

 And we both know why.

 The only other criteria has been the obvious assertion

A)  that the players are actually good

B) and the since dropped, again, to your benefit, standard that they were playing for the team that drafted them when they won, which I could've fairly held on to given that a quality team picking up a player in free agency is no commentary on the value of drafting certain positions where.

The argument hasn't changed. The bar is low, and yet you still refuse to post the names. 

And we both know why.

 

Nobody can actually be this stupid

[Growl]

2 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

Nobody can actually be this stupid

go back to the team reddit little fella, rote clichés like this don't stir any pots here