Matt Rhule on CMC (edited for added draft decision comments)

[thefuzz]

6 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Winning 4-5 games will only mean sitting and watching as Lawrence and Fields go elsewhere next year while we continue to build around Teddy to hopefully get back to six wins in '22. Mediocrity is purgatory in the NFL and despite Tepper's stated disdain for mediocrity that's exactly what we're building toward.

This is true, and sad.  I stopped really caring at this point, got many other things to excite me other than football.

Guessing my golf game is about to take the next step, and I'll be doing a lot of fishing this fall.

[steven8989]

26 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Winning 4-5 games will only mean sitting and watching as Lawrence and Fields go elsewhere next year while we continue to build around Teddy to hopefully get back to six wins in '22. Mediocrity is purgatory in the NFL and despite Tepper's stated disdain for mediocrity that's exactly what we're building toward.

We don't want to draft either one of them have you ever thought of that? Why keep complaining is it going to do anything for you?

[LinvilleGorge]

3 minutes ago, steven8989 said:

We don't want to draft either one of them have you ever thought of that? Why keep complaining is it going to do anything for you?

Meanwhile, virtually every post you make is complaining about someone else's post. LOL!

[LinvilleGorge]

24 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

This is true, and sad.  I stopped really caring at this point, got many other things to excite me other than football.

Guessing my golf game is about to take the next step, and I'll be doing a lot of fishing this fall.

Yeah, just waiting on all this snow to melt so I can break out the mountain bike. Sucks snowboarding season got cancelled right as we were going into peak season. Oh well.

[steven8989]

1 hour ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Meanwhile, virtually every post you make is complaining about someone else's post. LOL!

Yeah because u call ur self a Panthers fan but ur not. I'm not complaining about my team everytime they don't do something I won't them to do. U think they give a fug what we think? I mean just quit being miserable all the damn time.

[Mage]

5 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Winning 4-5 games will only mean sitting and watching as Lawrence and Fields go elsewhere next year while we continue to build around Teddy to hopefully get back to six wins in '22. Mediocrity is purgatory in the NFL and despite Tepper's stated disdain for mediocrity that's exactly what we're building toward.

Dude, getting the #1 overall pick is not the be all, end all.  I'm pretty sure we're the only team in the last 20 years to earn the #1 overall pick and eventually make the Super Bowl with the QB selected with that pick.  Rams traded up for Goff rather than earning the #1 pick.  So the last team to earn a #1 overall pick, before us, and eventually make the Super Bowl with the QB they picked were the Colts with Manning back in 1998.  2 teams in 22 years.  

And you wanna know why that is the case?  Because putting a young QB on a bad team doesn't work out that often.  Because then what happens is said QB gets put around bad players and makes that team mediocre or good enough to make the playoffs, but not good enough to go far.  Mahomes for example is great, but you are kidding yourself if you think he'd have done as good on a crappy team.

Hell even with us, it was a unique situation.  This team was way more talented than the 2-14 record we got in 2010, but Clausen was just that bad.  

No offense but your take is just flat-out ridiculous. There is absolutely nothing wrong with acquiring good players to put around your starting QB for the upcoming season, and it astonishes me that you would actually try to argue in support of that.  You are smarter than that, I know it.

I'd love Trevor Lawrence, I really would.  But people on this site need to stop acting like he'll be this savior.  We saw what happened with Andrew Luck when the Colts tanked for him - he made them good, but they were never good enough to be a Super Bowl team.  And he got hurt because they didn't think to put good players around him.  Some of you thinking we should purge this team, get the #1 pick, and everything will be okay, are fooling yourselves.  This team needs to get talented, young players here.  Then if Bridgewater still fails, a QB will be coming to a great situation (ala Mahomes with the Chiefs, Wilson with the Seahawks, Watson with the Texans... well other than the offensive line)

[LinvilleGorge]

4 minutes ago, Mage said:

Dude, getting the #1 overall pick is not the be all, end all.  I'm pretty sure we're the only team in the last 20 years to earn the #1 overall pick and eventually make the Super Bowl with the QB selected with that pick.  Rams traded up for Goff rather than earning the #1 pick.  So the last team to earn a #1 overall pick, before us, and eventually make the Super Bowl with the QB they picked were the Colts with Manning back in 1998.

And you wanna know why that is the case?  Because putting a young QB on a bad team doesn't work out that often.  Because then what happens is said QB gets put around bad players and makes that team mediocre or good enough to make the playoffs, but not good enough to go far.  Mahomes for example is great, but you are kidding yourself if you think he'd have done as good on a crappy team.

Hell even with us, it was a unique situation.  This team was way more talented than the 2-14 record we got in 2010, but Clausen was just that bad.  

No offense but your take is just flat-out ridiculous. There is absolutely nothing wrong with acquiring good players to put around your starting QB for the upcoming season, and it astonishes me that you would actually try to argue in support of that.  I've seen you post on this forum.  You are better than that.  I'd expect that opinion from some other posters on this site.

I would agree if we were acquiring good players. And long-terms. We signed Bridgewater to a three year contract. He's a mediocre bandaid. We signed Robby Anderson to a two year contract. We traded a 26 year old OG for a 31 year old LT on the last year of his contract. The entire off-season thus far outside of re-signing CMC has been about short-term bandaids, not long-term success.

[Mage]

On 4/15/2020 at 5:11 PM, LinvilleGorge said:

I would agree if we were acquiring good players. And long-terms. We signed Bridgewater to a three year contract. He's a mediocre bandaid. We signed Robby Anderson to a two year contract. We traded a 26 year old OG for a 31 year old LT on the last year of his contract. The entire off-season thus far outside of re-signing CMC has been about short-term bandaids, not long-term success.

Except this is just you changing your point now.

Your problem isn't us trying to make sure Bridgewater has good players around him, it is that you just don't like the players we have acquired so far.  Fair, but didn't have anything to do with what Rhule was saying.  His point was that he wanted to have as many weapons around Bridgewater as possible.  He's gonna have McCaffrey, Moore, Anderson, Samuel, Thomas if he improves.  And the draft hasn't even happened yet.  Offseason isn't even finished yet.  

It is fair if you haven't liked the moves we have made thus far (although I'm not sure what the issue with Anderson is; he's a damn good receiver, especially when paired with a #1 like Moore).  But I don't think it is fair to act like what Rhule said is outlandish.  It is perfectly in line for a head coach to want to put as many weapons around his starter as possible.  To imply otherwise is, like I said, ridiculous.

[Growl]

On 4/15/2020 at 5:04 PM, Mage said:

Dude, getting the #1 overall pick is not the be all, end all.  I'm pretty sure we're the only team in the last 20 years to earn the #1 overall pick and eventually make the Super Bowl with the QB selected with that pick.  Rams traded up for Goff rather than earning the #1 pick.  So the last team to earn a #1 overall pick, before us, and eventually make the Super Bowl with the QB they picked were the Colts with Manning back in 1998.  2 teams in 22 years.  

And you wanna know why that is the case?  Because putting a young QB on a bad team doesn't work out that often.  Because then what happens is said QB gets put around bad players and makes that team mediocre or good enough to make the playoffs, but not good enough to go far.  Mahomes for example is great, but you are kidding yourself if you think he'd have done as good on a crappy team.

Hell even with us, it was a unique situation.  This team was way more talented than the 2-14 record we got in 2010, but Clausen was just that bad.  

No offense but your take is just flat-out ridiculous. There is absolutely nothing wrong with acquiring good players to put around your starting QB for the upcoming season, and it astonishes me that you would actually try to argue in support of that.  You are smarter than that, I know it.

I'd love Trevor Lawrence, I really would.  But people on this site need to stop acting like he'll be this savior.  We saw what happened with Andrew Luck when the Colts tanked for him - he made them good, but they were never good enough to be a Super Bowl team.  And he got hurt because they didn't think to put good players around him.  Some of you thinking we should purge this team, get the #1 pick, and everything will be okay, are fooling yourselves.  This team needs to get talented, young players here.  Then if Bridgewater still fails, a QB will be coming to a great situation (ala Mahomes with the Chiefs, Wilson with the Seahawks, Watson with the Texans... well other than the offensive line)

This such bad revisionist history. It's just the super silly and hilariously flawed "you don't just draft a quarterback, you have to build an elite roster then use a top 10 draft pick on one."  The entire sentiment is a laugher.

 

Deshaun Watson and Patrick mahomes didn't "walk into great situations," both of those teams were bad, frankly neither team as a whole is anything remarkable either.

 

The NFL has changed. The super bowl was the quintessential litmus test of jt.Having one good player at one position means more than having all the good ole boy spots squared away.

The Panthers will either embrace this reality and address the only position that really matters while the getting is good or they will flounder at 7-9 and panther fans will gleefully get excited about the possibility of getting a (pointless) wild card spot every other season.

[Mage]

2 hours ago, Growl said:

This such bad revisionist history. It's just the super silly and hilariously flawed "you don't just draft a quarterback, you have to build an elite roster then use a top 10 draft pick on one."  The entire sentiment is a laugher.

 

Deshaun Watson and Patrick mahomes didn't "walk into great situations," both of those teams were bad, frankly neither team as a whole is anything remarkable either.

How is it revisionist history?  It is literally a fact that only two teams in recent memory have earned the #1 overall pick and went on to the Super Bowl down the road with said QB, the 1998 Colts with Peyton and 2011 Panthers with Cam.  

And the Chiefs were bad?  What the heck are you talking about lol?  2017 Chiefs, Mahomes' rookie year he didn't play, they went 10-6 and Alex Smith had an excellent year.  The year before, before they drafted Mahomes, they were 12-4.  Please explain to me how that is a bad team.

Texans were 9-7 in 2016 with Brock Osweiler and had made the playoffs the 2 years before they drafted Watson despite shoddy QBs.  Please explain to me how that is a bad team.  

Both were good situations and both teams were far from being bad.  Chiefs had Andy Reid as HC, Texans had a top notch defense and good playmakers at receiver ala Hopkins.  But yeah, I'm the one with "revisionist history."  I mean you do realize there is a reason both teams had to trade up for those QBs right?

History has shown earning the #1 overall pick, or even a top five pick, means very little if you aren't building your team correctly.  Relying on your team sucking by not bringing in good players is a terrible strategy.

Do research before you accuse anyone of having revisionist history.

[Mage]

Also, I never said you don't draft a QB.  You ALWAYS draft a QB when you have the opportunity to, if you think highly enough of said QB.  My point was you don't intentionally tank your team for the chance to draft a QB #1 overall.  A big difference.