It's Derrick Brown, right?

[*FreeFua*]

This board sh!t all over Ron for never changing his ways yet everyone here is still screaming “stop da run!”. 

Kansas City was ranked just behind Carolina in rush yards allowed and it seemed to work out just fine for them. 

 

[4Corners]

4 minutes ago, CaliPanthers said:

Yea because they have Patrick Mahomes. Without Mahomes KC isnt the same team. 

You’re kidding 

[LinvilleGorge]

1 hour ago, *FreeFua* said:

This board sh!t all over Ron for never changing his ways yet everyone here is still screaming “stop da run!”. 

Kansas City was ranked just behind Carolina in rush yards allowed and it seemed to work out just fine for them. 

 

There was a HUGE difference in the red zone though. We gave up 31 TDs on the ground vs. their 14. We gave up 8 more TDs on the ground than the next worst team in that category. Our run D overall was historically terrible. You have to go all the way back to 2008 to find another team that gave up 31 rushing TDs. That was the 3-12-1 Detroit Lions.

[*FreeFua*]

2 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

There was a HUGE difference in the red zone though. We gave up 31 TDs on the ground vs. their 14. We gave up 8 more TDs on the ground than the next worst team in that category. Our run D overall was historically terrible. You have to go all the way back to 2008 to find another team that gave up 31 rushing TDs. That was the 3-12-1 Detroit Lions.

I’m not saying DT isn’t a need or doesn’t need to be addressed because it does. I’m saying I’d prefer to go a different route in addressing it rather than use the 7th overall pick on it.

I think I saw someone already mention Jonathon Allen as a comp for Brown and that would be my comp too. Washington was the 2nd worse team in rush yards allowed only behind the Bengals. 

Like a few others in this thread I’m not as high on Brown as you and some others are. If Simmons is available he’d be my pick and then we’d address DT in another round if the board falls that way. 

This thread is 22 pages so it’s definitely one of those things people see differently in terms of priority/value with the pick/value with the position. I don’t think anyone is arguing that it isn’t a need. Basically a agree to disagree thing.

But in my perfect scenario if Simmons is gone I’d LOVE to trade back and get two 1st’s for pick 7. Gettleman’s “I rather have 1 dime instead of two nickels” saying doesn’t really apply to this draft after the very few first guys come off the board. This draft is deeeeep and we have so many holes that more picks in the early rounds would be a lot more valuable imo.

 

[AU-panther]

People look at this all wrong.  These decisions don't happen in a vacuum, you have to look at the entire picture.

The question isn't where he is going to be a great player, its what player helps you the most.  Specifically what combination of player.

What helps the team win more?

Brown at 7 and a CB in the second or  A CB in the first and a DT in the second?

Brown at 7 and one of the OTs we have or an OT at 7 and a FA DT?

Brown at 7 + 3rd LB or Simmons at 7 +3rd DT?

You can do this all day long.

I think we at times get In our head that we have to address our biggest perceived need in the first round, when in reality we should be looking to use the draft and FA to improve our entire team.

I want the player, and combination of players that helps us win the most games because that is really all that matters.  Finding a hall of famer is useless if it doesn't translate into wins.

 

 

[WOW!!]

2 hours ago, *FreeFua* said:

This board sh!t all over Ron for never changing his ways yet everyone here is still screaming “stop da run!”. 

Kansas City was ranked just behind Carolina in rush yards allowed and it seemed to work out just fine for them. 

 

Then they got Chris Jones back for their playoff run and their run defense improved...

Plus the little fact they got Pat Mahomes...

[Toomers]

43 minutes ago, *FreeFua* said:

I’m not saying DT isn’t a need or doesn’t need to be addressed because it does. I’m saying I’d prefer to go a different route in addressing it rather than use the 7th overall pick on it.

I think I saw someone already mention Jonathon Allen as a comp for Brown and that would be my comp too. Washington was the 2nd worse team in rush yards allowed only behind the Bengals. 

Like a few others in this thread I’m not as high on Brown as you and some others are. If Simmons is available he’d be my pick and then we’d address DT in another round if the board falls that way. 

This thread is 22 pages so it’s definitely one of those things people see differently in terms of priority/value with the pick/value with the position. I don’t think anyone is arguing that it isn’t a need. Basically a agree to disagree thing.

But in my perfect scenario if Simmons is gone I’d LOVE to trade back and get two 1st’s for pick 7. Gettleman’s “I rather have 1 dime instead of two nickels” saying doesn’t really apply to this draft after the very few first guys come off the board. This draft is deeeeep and we have so many holes that more picks in the early rounds would be a lot more valuable imo.

 

Did you just compare a 6-2/286  Jonathan Allen with Brown as a run-stuffer?. I’m assuming you just threw some levity out there in the middle of all that. 

[LinvilleGorge]

40 minutes ago, AU-panther said:

People look at this all wrong.  These decisions don't happen in a vacuum, you have to look at the entire picture.

The question isn't where he is going to be a great player, its what player helps you the most.  Specifically what combination of player.

What helps the team win more?

Brown at 7 and a CB in the second or  A CB in the first and a DT in the second?

Brown at 7 and one of the OTs we have or an OT at 7 and a FA DT?

Brown at 7 + 3rd LB or Simmons at 7 +3rd DT?

You can do this all day long.

I think we at times get In our head that we have to address our biggest perceived need in the first round, when in reality we should be looking to use the draft and FA to improve our entire team.

I want the player, and combination of players that helps us win the most games because that is really all that matters.  Finding a hall of famer is useless if it doesn't translate into wins.

 

 

I think we need to be drafting with the next five years in mind. I don't think any draft class is going to matter much in terms of fielding a winner this coming season. Honestly, I think you should always be drafting with the next five years in mind. When you look to the draft as an immediate roster bandaid, it usually ends up bad. 

[AU-panther]

4 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I think we need to be drafting with the next five years in mind. I don't think any draft class is going to matter much in terms of fielding a winner this coming season. Honestly, I think you should always be drafting with the next five years in mind. When you look to the draft as an immediate roster bandaid, it usually ends up bad. 

I totally agree, and that is part of the reason I'm starting to really like the idea of going OT.

How often do you really get a chance to draft a quality OT without having to reach.  Think about past drafts, outside of QBs, OTs might be the most over drafted positions and honestly DTs might be one of the most under drafted. 

I'm not saying I can find a Derrick Brown type of talent later in this draft, or even next year, but I feel a lot better about finding a quality DT later then a quality OT.

Also unless TB really impresses there is a good chance we are going to be grooming a young QB here soon, what better player to help him develop?

[WOW!!]

8 minutes ago, AU-panther said:

I totally agree, and that is part of the reason I'm starting to really like the idea of going OT.

How often do you really get a chance to draft a quality OT without having to reach.  Think about past drafts, outside of QBs, OTs might be the most over drafted positions and honestly DTs might be one of the most under drafted. 

I'm not saying I can find a Derrick Brown type of talent later in this draft, or even next year, but I feel a lot better about finding a quality DT later then a quality OT.

Also unless TB really impresses there is a good chance we are going to be grooming a young QB here soon, what better player to help him develop?

But you might have quality OT already on the roster if we give them more then 4 games of development to see...

[LinvilleGorge]

4 minutes ago, WOW!! said:

But you might have quality OT already on the roster if we give them more then 4 games of development to see...

If Little was in this draft class he'd be a 3rd rounder at best IMO. I don't even know if he'd go that high.

[WOW!!]

1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

If Little was in this draft class he'd be a 3rd rounder at best IMO. I don't even know if he'd go that high.

Okay so what... He's not in this class.. He's already on the team and you don't have to give up a chance to get a defensive foundation piece to get him.. Like you have to do to get one of the OT in this draft... And all of it's still a gamble.. JMO.. I'd rather not give up on the assets already acquire after 4  game in a injury riddle rookie season...

[LinvilleGorge]

4 minutes ago, WOW!! said:

Okay so what... He's not in this class.. He's already on the team and you don't have to give up a chance to get a defensive foundation piece to get him.. Like you have to do to get one of the OT in this draft... And all of it's still a gamble.. JMO.. I'd rather not give up on the assets already acquire after 4  game in a injury riddle rookie season...

He looked like trash and then he got multiple concussions. We're already talking about moving him to OG. I think we've already given up on him at LT.

[WOW!!]

19 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

He looked like trash and then he got multiple concussions. We're already talking about moving him to OG. I think we've already given up on him at LT.

Alot of LT look like trash their rookie season.. Because it's not a position that the transition is easy to do... That's why you should really never throw them out there at that position their rookie season... Just like Jordan Gross they should have worked him at a different position for a year .. Especially adding into the fact that neither him nor Daley had got many reps in TC or the preseason... Again those 4 games shouldn't be used as a final judgment due to the context of the situation... 

We heard reports about them trying him at OG this season.. (Not a bad idea).. But we also heard from the horses mouth this week.. That Okung is here to help with their development as well.. Meaning they haven't given up on either of them...