REPORT: Panthers discussed trading up to #1 for Joe Burrow

[stbugs]

2 minutes ago, PantherOnTheProwl1523 said:

https://catcrave.com/2020/04/03/carolina-panthers-nfl-draft-justin-herbert-first-round-possibility/

So, if we draft Herbert and suck so bad that we get pick 1 next year, what do we do?

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, stbugs said:

So, if we draft Herbert and suck so bad that we get pick 1 next year, what do we do?

We mirror the Cardinals taking Josh Rosen then Kyler Murray.

[Growl]

the whole "I don't want a QB because they might bust" argument is stupid stupid stupid

Indeed, they may bust, and if they do, so what, welcome to the draft. The game has changed, if they do, we'll just draft another one, we don't have to let a full contract play out.

In our case, it's preferential to have a bust rather than letting Bridgewater lead us to the middle of the draft and the team talking themselves into "well, he really just needs a few more pieces, he's such a nice guy, teddy is our man, and boy can he execute the offense with the best of them."

Conversely, the drafted player may not bust. And if a highly drafted QB pans out, our ceiling is perennial contenders for the super bowl. If the highly drafted "Can't Miss" player at an ancillary position pans out, our ceiling is sitting here talking about what a shame it is that the team wasted another great player's career.

[stbugs]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

We mirror the Cardinals taking Josh Rosen then Kyler Murray.

Well, if we take Herbert, our D will absolutely be in position to be the worst D in the league, again. We were the worst D last year from weeks 2-17. Heck I think we gave up the most sacks from weeks 2-17. If it weren’t for Miami getting destroyed by Baltimore week 1, we would have been able to celebrate the worst OL and D in 2019. We’ve add Okung, Anderson and backups and lost Turner, Van Roten, Addison, Bradberry, Butler, McCoy, Poe, Olsen, Cam, Reid, Irvin, Cockrell and maybe someone else I forgot.

How anyone in the FO thinks we’ll be competitive and is willing to risk the top pick, lose comp picks and waste $21M a year on a bridge QB, is beyond me.

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, stbugs said:

How anyone in the FO thinks we’ll be competitive and is willing to risk the top pick, lose comp picks and waste $21M a year on a bridge QB, is beyond me.

It's not that hard to understand when you remember who our general manager is.

Marty always thinks we're a player or two away from the Super Bowl, though p these days it might be as much about self-preservation is anything.

He might need us to be competitive so that he can keep full power as a GM.

[FakePlasticTrees]

12 minutes ago, PantherOnTheProwl1523 said:

With the nonsense on Joe Burrow there is this story.

https://catcrave.com/2020/04/03/carolina-panthers-nfl-draft-justin-herbert-first-round-possibility/

If the Panthers view him as a franchise QB then you pick him. Unfortunately, the signing of Bridgewater probably means that this will not happen. It may also be a sign of either of the following are true:

1. The Panthers do not view him as a franchise QB; or,

2. The Panthers do not believe he will be available when they pick.

Personally, I am intrigued with Herbert and wary of the undersized Tua coming off of a serious hip injury. The more I read, the more I will not be shocked if Tua falls. The wildcards are Love and to a lesser degree Jacob Eason. I have never seen either play.

[ForJimmy]

17 minutes ago, Rogue Panther said:

Any QB that has even 2 titles will be a HOF much less 4. 

He is quite lucky to have been apart of arguably the one of the greatest defensive units that every played the game "Steel Curtain". 

Dude average 50% completion and 1:1 TD INT ratio. 

Naw, not calling that a franchise QB. 

4x Super Bowl Champ

2x Super Bowl MVP

League MVP

2x NFL passing TD leader

NFL 1970s All-Decade Team

Steelers All-Time Team

Who would want to build a franchise around that??? This conversation is a reach beyond all means. I don’t think Franchise QB means what you think it means.... I mean what current QBs are Franchise QBs?? Just Brady and Brees?

[stbugs]

6 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

It's not that hard to understand when you remember who our general manager is.

Marty always thinks we're a player or two away from the Super Bowl, though p these days it might be as much about self-preservation is anything.

He might need us to be competitive so that he can keep full power as a GM.

Last line is absolutely true and unfortunately that’s why he’s been reaching and drafting needs since 2008. He’s been on the hot seat for a while and he can’t think long term, either because he just can’t evaluate well unless he’s deciding between 10 guys, i.e. a top 10 pick, or he feels so much pressure that all he can think about is one position like LT and Little. He’ll trade the farm (we gave up way more value) and not think to himself that interior OL is stronger so let’s fix that in 2019 and use the good tackle class of 2020 to fix LT.

Oh well, I’ve said my peace about Marty enough. Dude sucks and has been terrible since 2008 or 2009. Getting 1 starter per draft gets you 7-9 and 5-11 after being 11-5. Drafting Herbert pretty much solidifies they worst D in the league and may not solve our long term QB issue anyway.

[Growl]

You take a CANT MISS defensive player because you think you can field a competitive roster this season

 You take a franchise QB because you want to own and dominate the next era of nfc south football.

 

The team needs to decide which one they want more.

[stbugs]

7 minutes ago, Growl said:

You take a CANT MISS defensive player because you think you can field a competitive roster this season

 You take a franchise QB because you want to own and dominate the next era of nfc south football.

 

The team needs to decide which one they want more.

We could have both if we wanted to, but we appear to be trying to be competitive and get a QB in the same year. I like the 2021 QB class way better and we easily could have loaded up on talent and picks for 2021 while also limiting FAs this year to ensure a low pick and maybe the top pick next year. We are both letting our only D talent walk away and signing FAs.

[Growl]

1 minute ago, stbugs said:

We could have both if we wanted to, but we appear to be trying to be competitive and get a QB in the same year. I like the 2021 QB class way better and we easily could have loaded up on talent and picks for 2021 while also limiting FAs this year to ensure a low pick and maybe the top pick next year. We are both letting our only D talent walk away and signing FAs.

Acquiring a franchise QB is never something you should put off if you can do it now.

 

Trevor Lawrence will not be a Carolina panther. No amount of draft capital would make a trade for him possible.

[RASTAN66]

Let's think about a mythical NFL franchise we'll call the Growlers.

Well after going 5-10-1 one year the Growlers decide to draft a QB in the 1st round of the next draft.

The next season the Growlers start out 1-2 with their new rookie QB on the bench.  After that the rookie QB starts 12 games the rest of the way and goes 6-6 in his starts.  (team was 6-12-1 prior)

The rookie QB wins a Rookie of the Year award.

The next year Mr. QB is no longer a rookie and starts all 16 games.  Mr. QB leads his team to a 11-5 record and the playoffs where they lose in the 1st round.

Mr. QB makes the Pro Bowl that year.

In Growlerville at this point do Growler fans reasonably expect they have a "franchise QB" on their hands?

 

[Waldo]

17 minutes ago, RASTAN66 said:

Let's think about a mythical NFL franchise we'll call the Growlers.

Well after going 5-10-1 one year the Growlers decide to draft a QB in the 1st round of the next draft.

The next season the Growlers start out 1-2 with their new rookie QB on the bench.  After that the rookie QB starts 12 games the rest of the way and goes 6-6 in his starts.  (team was 6-12-1 prior)

The rookie QB wins a Rookie of the Year award.

The next year Mr. QB is no longer a rookie and starts all 16 games.  Mr. QB leads his team to a 11-5 record and the playoffs where they lose in the 1st round.

Mr. QB makes the Pro Bowl that year.

In Growlerville at this point do Growler fans reasonably expect they have a "franchise QB" on their hands?

 

Look at the stats from that year and the team around them, what coaches and schemes and any other pertinent information. You paint the picture you want to see and not the entire scene. In your example the QB had a good year and then magically appears on another team? IF he was a franchise QB that wouldn't have happened. So there is more to the story than you explained. Ron won 2 coach of the year awards and had 3 winning seasons out of 9. Context matters.

[stbugs]

2 hours ago, Growl said:

Acquiring a franchise QB is never something you should put off if you can do it now.

 

Trevor Lawrence will not be a Carolina panther. No amount of draft capital would make a trade for him possible.

I agree as of now but without Teddy and Anderson, we had a very good shot at him. I would have put our odds at the top. No guarantees but Herbert is not a franchise QB in my opinion. We lost Luke, Cam, Olsen, Bradberry, Addison, Turner, McCoy, Irvin, Reid, Cockrell and Van Roten from a 5-11 team. We’ve got one extra pick, a 5th rounder for Allen, in the next few drafts. We blew our chance to right this shop quickly. Having an extra 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th in 2021 along with the top pick would have been a great bounty especially if we went full BPA this year.

We are unfortunately going to limp along for three years with Teddy. We won’t get Lawrence, Fields or Howell. The top top QBs the next two years won’t be available for trade ups.