How many GM's draft better than Hurney?

[Cpt slay a ho]

5 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

Obviously you cant just fill through the draft, but good teams find key players there they can get on the cheap.

They also find guys to replace ridiculously overpriced free agents. Hate him all you want, but Gettleman was right not to pay Norman. 3 years in Washington proves it. He drafted JB to replace him and freed up that cap space to make some FA moves. 

The draft is more than selecting a good player. It's about selecting the right one. 

The handling of the Josh Norman debacle was reason enough for him to be fired. Very few if any wanted to sign Norman long term. The fact he rescinded the tag was dumb enough but to do so that late into free agency was asinine, followed by spamming cb picks 3 picks in a row to replace 1 position, while the first rounder was spent on a position that was already stacked....that was a bad example to use for dg, he did a good job in 2013 filling the roster 

[panthers55]

6 hours ago, thefuzz said:

They also tend to draft at the back end of the 1st, which surely hurts, similar to the Pats...their 1st rounders don't usually look so hot, but they are also always outside the top 26.

Actually that logic makes little sense. If you can't find talent at number 30 for example, how do you suddenly get better drafting a 5th rounder at 160. Seems it would be easier across the board in the early rounds.

[Mr. Scot]

57 minutes ago, MasterAwesome said:

Everyone just keep in mind that Mr. Scot actually unironically posted this in another thread recently when defending reporters and their errant speculation.  Meanwhile he's on here furiously posting 17,000 times every day season after season about how terrible our coaches and GM are, and now questioning the new owner's judgment when deciding who the right people are to run his business.  Yes, he's insinuating our multi-billionaire owner has terrible judgment and has no idea what he's doing in running his new business.  Even though he hasn't had experience heading a football team, it seems like putting the right people in the right positions is kinda right in the ballpark for the man who built and developed a multi-billion dollar business, no?  Besides, Mr. Scot spent countless threads after threads after posts after posts speculating about what Tepper would do with the Panthers based on his experience with a successful organization like the Pittsburgh Steelers.  Now it seems like all that experience is conveniently flushed down the toilet and Tepper has no idea what he's doing.  Depends on the narrative I guess.

I'm sure you put a lot of thought into that. Congratulations. It's cute. I didn't actually read all of it, but I can tell.

One suggestion: Google the word "paragraphs". Learning what they are will help the quality of your writing immensely.

The biggest shame though is that you didn't understand what you were reading.

The point in question was whether football teams should take fan opinions into account when they're making football decisions. They shouldn't. Mine, yours or anybody else's.

Unfortunately, that doesn't mean all those decisions are going to be good ones. If they're coming from people like Jim Haslam, Dan Snyder, Jerry Jones and/or Jerry Richardson, chances are there likely to be...not.

Mind you, that doesn't mean they should ask for fan opinions. That just means they should get somebody who's proven they know what they're doing.

And, believe it or not, that's exactly the kind of thing that can be discussed on a fan forum.

it's not really that difficult to understand, but I can see how it went over your head.

[Mr. Scot]

26 minutes ago, Cpt slay a ho said:

Giants in generally but as of late there a dumpster fire franchise...

im not trying to “make” hurney look good lol, if acknowledging he drafts well is that then something is wrong with your view of it 

He drafts well in the first round, which is the round where it's easiest to get it right, and it helps that he usually has a high draft pick because the team he built the year before was crap.

His drafts overall, as was shown by our newly renamed friend on page one, are mediocre to bad, especially in the years since 2009.

Many of us want somebody that's actually better than mediocre, somebody who can put together a winner more frequently then three seasons out of fourteen. Whereas others just want to keep the guy who's been doing a lousy job and hope that he somehow gets better.

Yeah... Good luck with that.

If you want to stick with that choice, it's your right. It's a dumb choice, but you have the right to be dumb.

Just don't abuse the privilege.

[onmyown]

2 hours ago, CPF4LIFE said:

Rivera was passed up 9 times as a HC but the panthers were the only team willing to give him a job. 3 winning seasons out of 9. We sure benefited from that.....

Just because nobody else was interested it doesnt necessarily mean it was good or bad hire.

 

GM is different from coach. No one knew Rivera as a HC, teams had 9 years on Hurney.

But it was an objective question and no one seems to have an answer.

[SmokinwithWilly]

12 minutes ago, Cpt slay a ho said:

The handling of the Josh Norman debacle was reason enough for him to be fired. Very few if any wanted to sign Norman long term. The fact he rescinded the tag was dumb enough but to do so that late into free agency was asinine, followed by spamming cb picks 3 picks in a row to replace 1 position, while the first rounder was spent on a position that was already stacked....that was a bad example to use for dg, he did a good job in 2013 filling the roster 

It was an ok example to use showing how to replace an overpriced FA using the draft. Thats actually what the Shaq and Butler picks were supposed to be. Replacing TD and Star/KK. I think it was supposed to be KK but Star didn't want to be here anymore. 

How he handled the whole Norman debacle is another thing entirely. DG poo the bed on that, but JNo did no one any favors bringing an agent with zero experience in to negotiate the biggest contract of his life. And corner was definitely a need worthy of a double dip, but not a triple. 

I dont think Worley was terrible, just asked to do too much too fast.

12 minutes ago, onmyown said:

GM is different from coach. No one knew Rivera as a HC, teams had 9 years on Hurney.

But it was an objective question and no one seems to have an answer.

I did  answer the question.

[Cpt slay a ho]

9 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

He drafts well in the first round, which is the round where it's easiest to get it right, and it helps that he usually has a high draft pick because the team he built the year before was crap.

His drafts overall, as was shown by our newly renamed friend on page one, are mediocre to bad, especially in the years since 2009.

Many of us want somebody that's actually better than mediocre, somebody who can put together a winner more frequently then three seasons out of fourteen. Whereas others just want to keep the guy who's been doing a lousy job and hope that he somehow gets better.

Yeah... Good luck with that.

If you want to stick with that choice, it's your right. It's a dumb choice, but you have the right to be dumb.

Just don't abuse the privilege.

Shifting the argument I see...we went from his drafts to bigger picture...again a separate discussion.

and it’s also been proven by another poster, Krovy on the difficulty drafting outside the 1st and hurneys success rate given the percentages.
 

And we’re multiple pages in and only one poster has made a comparison of gm’s drafts, key word drafts. His drafts stack up with the better gm’s, proof is In the pudding but let’s keep moving the goal post 

[Mr. Scot]

5 minutes ago, Cpt slay a ho said:

Shifting the argument I see...we went from his drafts to bigger picture...again a separate discussion.

and it’s also been proven by another poster, Krovy on the difficulty drafting outside the 1st and hurneys success rate given the percentages.
 

And we’re multiple pages in and only one poster has made a comparison of gm’s drafts, key word drafts. His drafts stack up with the better gm’s, proof is In the pudding but let’s keep moving the goal post 

If you think the message of his analysis was that Hurney's drafting stacks up "with the better GMs", I'm pretty sure you didn't read it 

But why should I be surprised? Granted, your argument in this thread hasn't been the complete disaster that the Adam Schefter thing was, but it's been pretty bad.

[Cpt slay a ho]

2 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

It was an ok example to use showing how to replace an overpriced FA using the draft. Thats actually what the Shaq and Butler picks were supposed to be. Replacing TD and Star/KK. I think it was supposed to be KK but Star didn't want to be here anymore. 

How he handled the whole Norman debacle is another thing entirely. DG poo the bed on that, but JNo did no one any favors bringing an agent with zero experience in to negotiate the biggest contract of his life. And corner was definitely a need worthy of a double dip, but not a triple. 

I dont think Worley was terrible, just asked to do too much too fast.

I did  answer the question.

In dg case those are bad examples since the players those picks were suppose to replace remain on the team long enough for the player they were suppose to replace, got a contract extension(kk) or the player remained on the team long enough to where the replacement player was hitting his contract year(Thomas Davis and Shaq Thompson situation). Agents act unprofessional all the time, that wasn’t reason enough for dg to blow a head gasket and wreck the offseason by rescinding they tag.

cb was a need but Not worthy of double dipping imo, honestly was one of dg biggest issues, drafting replacement too late or too early, kony ealy was another guy we should have passed on 

[Mr. Scot]

Let me try and explain what's going on here.

Say for a moment that we were talking about a wide receiver that we had on roster. Here's what we know about him:

He doesn't catch the ball very well.

In fact, he drops a lot of very catchable passes.

He's not very fast, or very big, or very strong.

He has trouble getting separation from defenders.

But with all that said, he does do one thing very well. He runs really great routes.

Now, following the logic of our resident Marty defenders, that guy should be our starter.

Sure, he might not be all that effective overall, but he does that one thing really well and that's good enough for them.

Sounds ridiculous when you put it in terms of a player, right?

Guess what? It doesn't sound any smarter when you apply it to a general manager.

But they're still trying...

[Cpt slay a ho]

1 hour ago, Mr. Scot said:

If you think the message of his analysis was that Hurney's drafting stacks up "with the better GMs", I'm pretty sure you didn't read it 

But why should I be surprised? Granted, your argument in this thread hasn't been the complete disaster that the Adam Schefter thing was, but it's been pretty bad.

Who’s, krovy’s? Because I guess you haven’t read his analysis, which again you being confused on what’s going on isn’t anything new 

lol the Adam Schefter thing where you and your boi fumbling around to dig up articles from him in oct 2019? Stop while you’re ahead, it’s like every thread you Post in you have multiple posters putting there Proverbial foot in Your ass in debates, yet you keep chugging along like Thomas the train, you got heart kid

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, Cpt slay a ho said:

Who’s krovy ? Because I guess you haven’t read his analysis, which again you being confused on what’s going on isn’t anything new 

lol the Adam Schefter thing where you and your boi fumbling around to dig up articles from him in oct 2019? Stop while you’re ahead, it’s like every thread you Post in you have multiple posters putting there Proverbial foot in Your ass in debates, yet you keep chugging along like Thomas the train, you got heart kid

Just keep telling yourself that 

[Happy Panther]

Hurney isn't dogcrap and he isn't elite. Nailing the first round almost every year is hard to do. Almost never hitting later rounds is also hard to do. But he has found a couple of gems just not consistently. And he has found talent. 

I'm ready to move on but he has been OK.

[onmyown]

I think people here forget a GMs job is to build a winning team. The draft is just a small part of it. Hurney was awful at contracts and awful and FA. He’s great for only round 1 of the draft. That’s a very small part of the overall responsibility of the GMs job.