Why the Panthers might Draft Herbert

[nogoodbum]

Is there anyone on the Panthers staff [Tepper, Hurley, Rhule or other] smart enough to use the trend for QBs to be overvalued? Could Cam be worth more than a 2nd if healthy, say a 2nd & 3rd? Herbert worth a 1st-2nd & 2021 2nd or a 2020 & 2021 1st?

[kungfoodude]

14 hours ago, MHS831 said:

I see both sides, but if the offense was designed to be quick hitting and he was coached to make the read and deliver the ball, then that does not mean that he cannot.  At the SR bowl, he was not in that dink and dunk offense and was the MVP.

Yeah, I think he got a nice bump from the Senior Bowl. I like him, actually. Best potential of the current QB class, IMO.

[MHS831]

1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

Yeah, I think he got a nice bump from the Senior Bowl. I like him, actually. Best potential of the current QB class, IMO.

People have reservations about this and that, but if he has a year, he can be coached up.  He has the skill. Burrow?  the only difference is the team around each player.  LSU was so good, they could always have a balanced attack.  Both had pretty good OLs. 

So you have to look at the skill set--and Burrow has nothing on Herbert---but they are both good.  I love Herbert's height, athleticism, arm strength, etc. He also has more experience starting than Burrow. 

 

[raz]

i have no idea how herbert will turn out.  big positive is he's really smart.   side note is i've never seen a tighter spiral.

[Carl Spackler]

Unless you have the No. 1 pick, this is not the year to draft a QB. Not saying the rest will bust, but a vast majority will and it’s not worth the risk. Next year’s class is far better. 

[MHS831]

11 hours ago, DamnItJake! said:

No way we trade Cam!! If we do!! It’s obvious we will be in full tank mode for Lawrence or the Ohio State kid for QBs unless others shine that I don’t know about!! Hurts in the 3rd or 4th might be a thought for this year!! Think we sit with what we have at QB!

I think trading Cam is a very real possibility.  How can you tank for players that 31 other teams could draft?  We know what we have now at #7, and that is an opportunity to grab a QB.

Here is the deal I would make:  Trade Cam to the Chargers for a second rounder OR a third rounder and first round pick swap.  That prevents the Chargers from getting Cam and dealing their first to a team looking for a QB.  Whether you or I want Cam to stay or get traded, if you but on your business hat and think beyond 2020, you get in the business side more.

[MHS831]

7 minutes ago, Carl Spackler said:

Unless you have the No. 1 pick, this is not the year to draft a QB. Not saying the rest will bust, but a vast majority will and it’s not worth the risk. Next year’s class is far better. 

I normally agree with you, but we don't know for sure where we will be picking next year.  This is not an endorsement for Herbert as much as it is a discussion of a Panther option. If you take away the concerns and biases from Herbert, you are left with a pretty impressive skill set on a perfect QB frame.  The toy may be crap, but the packaging is awesome.

[Carl Spackler]

1) keep the pick and take Brown

2) If Brown isn’t there, trade down a few spots to someone enamored with a QB

[Carl Spackler]

1 minute ago, MHS831 said:

I normally agree with you, but we don't know for sure where we will be picking next year.  This is not an endorsement for Herbert as much as it is a discussion of a Panther option. If you take away the concerns and biases from Herbert, you are left with a pretty impressive skill set on a perfect QB frame.  The toy may be crap, but the packaging is awesome.

Herbert is a good player. I just have concerns with his scouting reports mirroring Blaine Gabbert’s in 2011. And honestly, I really would rather fortify one of our lines (preferably DL) in R1.

[MHS831]

36 minutes ago, raz said:

i have no idea how herbert will turn out.  big positive is he's really smart.   side note is i've never seen a tighter spiral.

That is a good point. I used to catch passes in college, and one thing about college is, as you climb the depth chart, you catch passes from a lot of people.  There is a difference.  I once figured (due to the drops) that Cam's passes were hard to catch, but I realize that the timing was off.  Here is what I mean.

Ever notice how WRs have their inside leg forward?  That is so the WRs can plant the correct foot--inside routes are usually 3 (slants), 5, (drags and posts) or seven (digs) step patterns, making the odd numbered step the plant foot.  Likewise, a sideline route becomes a 4-step process.  So if you think body positioning and separation, the ideal time for the ball to arrive is on an even numberered stride out of the break.  For example, if you are crossing the middle from left to right, your first step is going to be the one out of the break, shoulders and head not likely looking at the QB.  That first step is planted with the foot toward the QB--not ideal to catch a ball that soon out of the break across your body-but the next step is when the foot toward the endzone (away from the QB) is either being planted or planted--your torso opens toward the qb and the ball needs to be arriving through that window.  It is easier to see, catch, and run after the catch is more likely.  This differs by route. The back leg also helps protect the ball from a big S hit, helping the WR to hold onto the ball.  This is what I learned in college and during my year at clinics coaching HS WRs for one year. 

That is why they say getting the QB "off the mark" is so important.  It disrupts the timing and forces the QB to throw at a less ideal time for the WR.  Cam gets moved off the mark a lot, and when he does, his completion rate goes way down. The OL was not his friend.  Furthermore, if you have the cannon arm, you tend to use it to force late packages to arrive on time--causing the pass to sail because the feet are not in position. 

All that to say this--if we give this guy time and he throws a tight spiral (easier to see the nose--the part of the ball you catch), then we would all see improvements in completion percentage and yards after catch.  A tight spiral is also a sign of a confident QB, letting the ball go with purpose and when the feet are properly set--when the timing is right. 

I am not trying to sound like a know-it-all; to me, this is a fraction of what the pros know--but I like hearing others with tidbits and tips from their experiences.   This is simply the way I learned it, and I thought I would share.

[The Huddler]

22 hours ago, mrcompletely11 said:

I dont want my franchise quarterback introverted

quit quoting the whole mother fuging OP

[MHS831]

24 minutes ago, Carl Spackler said:

Herbert is a good player. I just have concerns with his scouting reports mirroring Blaine Gabbert’s in 2011. And honestly, I really would rather fortify one of our lines (preferably DL) in R1.

The thing that bothers me?  Oregon's QB hall of fame:  Names like Akili Smith, Joey Harrington, Marcus Mariota...the last success they had was probably Dan Fouts.

[(ATL'ien)CamNewton]

There is no chance we draft a QB it is a ridiculous notion at this juncture.

Say we do draft Herbert .. so that's a 3rd and a 1st on QB in the past two drafts .. so we handcuff ourselves in next years draft .. we can't take a QB in the most talented QB class in quite a while because we've already taken Grier and Herbert .. *barfs*

[CPcavedweller]

23 hours ago, mrcompletely11 said:

I dont want my franchise quarterback introverted

Like your micropenis?