Why the Panthers might Draft Herbert

[Verge]

7 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I strongly disagree. TONS of single reads or half field reads.

I strongly disagree with you as well lol 
Yes he has quite a few quick screens, as the offense is designed to do, but he is very good at going through his reads when it is not designed, that is one of the dings he has is that he spends too long going through reads and fails to sense interior pressure. If all he did was single reads or half field reads, this would not be a problem. 

[MHS831]

23 minutes ago, Verge said:

I would be totally cool with Herbert, he checks most of the boxes. I do think we need to invest around Cam since he is putting it all out on the table for us this year.

So you dismiss the rumors and speculation that suggest he is going to traded?

[Moo Daeng]

I have no idea who these people are or if they know what they are talking about but most every prospect analysis on him states he is not tasked with more than one or two reads and his progressions need work.

[MHS831]

1 minute ago, Moo Daeng said:

I have no idea who these people are or if they know what they are talking about but most every prospect analysis on him states he is not tasked with more than one or two reads and his progressions need work.

Neither was Cam at Auburn.   http://smartfootball.com/quarterbacking/did-cam-newton-play-in-a-one-read-passing-offense-at-auburn

" it might not actually be inaccurate to say that Newton had only a “single read,” but it’s also a bit misleading. "   It is not really a single read, but the process is not nearly as complex as an NFL offenses.

However, there are clips of Herbert reading defenses.  He did at the Senior bowl.   You can't hold the offensive scheme against the QB--Herbert did his job--as did Cam at Auburn.

[MHS831]

Pretty dang impressive...Oregon vs. Cal

 

[LinvilleGorge]

20 minutes ago, Moo Daeng said:

I have no idea who these people are or if they know what they are talking about but most every prospect analysis on him states he is not tasked with more than one or two reads and his progressions need work.

I honestly haven't paid much attention to the "analysts" opinions on him, but I've watched plenty of his games over the past two seasons and I'd agree with this. He throws a TON of screens and single reads off of RPO. The majority of his dedicated passing plays are half field reads. When he doesn't see exactly what he wants or expects he hesitates big time. Maybe people think that's "going through his reads"? What I see is a deer in the headlights.

[Catamount]

I’m not saying that we should draft Herbert but I wonder how many people on KC boards were saying Mahomes was hot garbage, Big 12 air raid style doesn’t work in the NFL, blah blah blah. 

[Tepper's Chest Hair]

We aren't getting Herbert.  We are getting both Bridgewater AND Tua.

[LinvilleGorge]

10 minutes ago, Catamount said:

I’m not saying that we should draft Herbert but I wonder how many people on KC boards were saying Mahomes was hot garbage, Big 12 air raid style doesn’t work in the NFL, blah blah blah. 

It's a bitch trying to project QBs to the NFL. I know some people think I'm anti-Herbert. I'm really not. I'm anti what Herbert has shown at Oregon. But that very well may be a product of him playing in that offense. I don't argue against him having all the physical tools. He does. But what he's shown at Oregon just doesn't translate very well to the NFL. It's up to teams to determine through the interview process and white board work to determine if he's capable of more. What I'm not going to do is call in love with the tools and then convince myself that I haven't seen what I've watched over numerous games over the past two seasons. Routinely going through progressions? No. Sorry, I haven't seen that. It happens a few times a game and more often than not it results in deer in the headlights, but when you don't ask a QB to routinely read through a progression and don't tailor an offense to have multiple options on any given pass play, it's not really fair to expect a QB to look like Peyton Manning out there when put in that situation.

I wouldn't hate drafting Herbert if we determine he's capable of more. I think he'd be best served in a Aaron Rodgers type situation where he sits and learns for awhile. The question is, do you draft a guy at #7 to do that?

[45catfan]

I will drive to Charlotte and find Hurney if this happens.  Upon finding, him I will give him a complementary lobotomy.  Seriously FREE of charge!  I mean he obviously has brain damage, what harm could it do?

[Woodie]

7 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I honestly haven't paid much attention to the "analysts" opinions on him, but I've watched plenty of his games over the past two seasons and I'd agree with this. He throws a TON of screens and single reads off of RPO. The majority of his dedicated passing plays are half field reads. When he doesn't see exactly what he wants or expects he hesitates big time. Maybe people think that's "going through his reads"? What I see is a deer in the headlights.

I'm with you on this.  I watched most of his games this year since I figured there was a good chance we would be going QB.  And I did not see an NFL QB at all.  He has all the size, arm strength, and athleticism you want, but his play doesn't match his traits.  He doesn't handle pressure well, and when forced to make plays he becomes erratic.  I just don't see the mental makeup to be an NFL starter.  

 

[Woodie]

To follow up, in fairness to him, the Oregon offense didn't do him any favors, but even so, he never really carried that team or lifted them when they desperately needed him to...and there were a handful of times he had the opportunity to, but he usually faltered.

Some have mocked the idea of him being an introvert, but it is a real issue.  Look at virtually every team that wins championships (college or NFL) and they have a QB that is a vocal leader and very active in helping lift the teams spirits when things aren't going well, but that is not something Herbert has ever shown the ability to do.  In fact, he shrinks from it.  So, having someone not comfortable with being in the forefront is not a positive.

And for those putting weight on the senior bowl, be careful of making more of it than it was.  Yes, he practiced and played well, and he made a concerted effort to interact with his teammates (which he even acknowledged was something he has to work on).  However, the interactions were something he had to force, it just doesn't come naturally for him.  And there was no blitzing or exotic defenses designed to confuse QB's.  It was strait football, which is never played in the NFL.  Basically, it is an event designed to highlight traits and skillsets, which nobody questions about Herbert.  Just like he'll probably look good at the combine. 

For the record, from everything I have seen and heard, Herbert is well liked by pretty much everyone, and he is a team guy.  But I just don't see him ever being what some want him to be.

[DamnItJake!]

3 hours ago, mrcompletely11 said:

I would love fromm in the 2nd.  Let brady fix him. He was really good in 2018

Not a big Fromm fan but prove me wrong 

[Woodie]

25 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

It's a bitch trying to project QBs to the NFL. I know some people think I'm anti-Herbert. I'm really not. I'm anti what Herbert has shown at Oregon. 

Thank you for saying that because it's exactly how I feel.  I started watching him because I REALLY wanted to like him...heck, I still do.  I think he is a great kid, but I just didn't like what I saw from him at Oregon.  I get the offense was a big issue, but looking past that to his actual decision making and play, I just didn't see anything to give me any belief that he will be a top end NFL QB, despite his ideal physical traits.