We need to be wise with Cam

[Matt62881]

13 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

That's probably a good thing right now.

We finished the season 5-11, but even that's misleading. I watched every game right up to the end, and I can tell you the team that I saw on the back end of our season was so bad we'd be lucky to win three games at this point.

You can hope for the quick fix all you want. I seriously doubt it's coming.

It'd be wiser to brace for a rough road ahead 

I'm bracing but I realize neither outcome is a guarantee, we could be a winning team next year or lining up to take the top QB in the draft.

[Mr Mojo Risin]

Just now, Brooklyn 3.0 said:

Dude, we can't even manage back to back winning seasons. Other than a handful of surprising seasons, this franchise is mediocre as it gets. 15-1 really blinded a lot of you. Top team ... lol.

With Ron Rivera and Mike Shula leading the team/offense. You mean to tell me the 3/9 winning seasons we've had is all of Cam Newtons fault? Lol.

[Matt62881]

3 minutes ago, raz said:

you're like marty 1.0 to a T.  it failed

Both injured unfortunately , one was sheer stupidity and the other was bad luck.

[mrcompletely11]

Just now, Matt62881 said:

I'm bracing but I realize neither outcome is a guarantee, we could be a winning team next year or lining up to take the top QB in the draft.

Brother I love your optimism but you are not getting it?  Tepper doesnt want to continue that trend of mediocre winning.  What good is 8,9 wins (which isnt possible with this roster).  He wants to build a long term franchise with the culture of winning.  Not some "well if so and so happens" we may be good.  He has said this like 3 times already.  He and rhule are not hitching their wagon to cam to maybe have 2 winning seasons out of 4 or whatever.  He wants sustained long term success.  Something Cam simply cannot produce. 

[Matt62881]

1 minute ago, Mr Mojo Risin said:

With Ron Rivera and Mike Shula leading the team/offense. You mean to tell me the 3/9 winning seasons we've had is all of Cam Newtons fault? Lol.

And now we have Rhule and Brady, man what a difference....that's enough there for a few wins lol. From stoic and stagnant to upbeat, a whole new culture. 

[Mr. Scot]

17 minutes ago, Matt62881 said:

The browns coaching staff is putrid, is ours? Nobody knows and I want to find out sooner then later.

The Browns coaching staff doesn't exist yet. Technically neither does ours. Both are in the process of being rebuilt.

Is ours putrid? Don't know. They might be. We'll see.

But putting together a win-now strategy as a way of testing whether your coaching staff is good or not? No. That's a move that's worthy of the Browns management, and they are putrid.

[thefuzz]

31 minutes ago, Matt62881 said:

I think we need a FA slot Cb and a FA LT, I just dont see this lack of talent that you speak of. Fox the center of both trenches with the first two picks and we will be in a better position then teams that made it to the playoffs this year if they are coached correctly. Not attacking your beliefs I just think theirs more to this roster then most, a team that went on a 5 game win streak beating some pretty good teams along the way with KA at the helm. Worst case scenario we loose and get a high draft pick for a qb next year.

We have pointed it out, but you refuse to buy into it.  We get it, you are a positive person about your football team.  My guess is you just haven't been a fan of the Panthers long enough for them to beat that out of you yet?

End of the day we have zero pieces on defensive or offensive line to build a team around.  Moton is likely our best lineman, and he very well could be an average NFL right tackle.  That's it.

Counting on McCoy, Irvin, Trai, KK, Paradis, etc...is just not going to get you anywhere in this league.  We don't have a secondary at all, we are hoping that Shaq can take over for Luke and not skip a beat, and that neither Samuel or Moore miss any time....all the while hoping that Cam will both play out his contract and stay healthy.

It's unfortunately time to start over.

[Matt62881]

1 minute ago, mrcompletely11 said:

Brother I love your optimism but you are not getting it?  Tepper doesnt want to continue that trend of mediocre winning.  What good is 8,9 wins (which isnt possible with this roster).  He wants to build a long term franchise with the culture of winning.  Not some "well if so and so happens" we may be good.  He has said this like 3 times already.  He and rhule are not hitching their wagon to cam to maybe have 2 winning seasons out of 4 or whatever.  He wants sustained long term success.  Something Cam simply cannot produce. 

Imo the mediocrity was Ron and staff, we had some pretty good teams that were stuffed. Rhule impact should be instant and this team has the potential to be better then some of Ron's playoff teams. Doesnt mean it will happen, but I just dont see any of this effecting our long term success. If we are looking at a 3 to 5 year rebuild....why not trade everyone? I dont see even Tepper wanting to be down more then a year.

[Matt62881]

4 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

We have pointed it out, but you refuse to buy into it.  We get it, you are a positive person about your football team.  My guess is you just haven't been a fan of the Panthers long enough for them to beat that out of you yet?

End of the day we have zero pieces on defensive or offensive line to build a team around.  Moton is likely our best lineman, and he very well could be an average NFL right tackle.  That's it.

Counting on McCoy, Irvin, Trai, KK, Paradis, etc...is just not going to get you anywhere in this league.  We don't have a secondary at all, we are hoping that Shaq can take over for Luke and not skip a beat, and that neither Samuel or Moore miss any time....all the while hoping that Cam will both play out his contract and stay healthy.

It's unfortunately time to start over.

I've been a fan plenty long enough and still feel last year was as bad as watching pickles. But we have never had a front office like this, young and innovative. 

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, Matt62881 said:

Rhule impact should be instant and this team has the potential to be better then some of Ron's playoff teams.

Sorry, but this is just not realistic at all.

[MHS831]

1 hour ago, Mr. Scot said:

The problem with this scenario is it's one-sided. It assumes that Newton would just accept playing out the last year of his contract with no guarantees.

He doesn't have to, and it's not a given that the Panthers would force him to.

And from the team's perspective, we are not going to keep Cam and start him based on his contract status and the trade market.  If we have made the decision to move on, he gets traded or cut. This team is not going to change 2020 plans because they did not get a good trade offer for Cam.

It is this simple--Cut Cam and save $19m and get a third round comp pick in 2021

Trade Cam and save $21m and get about a second round pick in 2020.

Keep Cam and let him eat up $21m in cap space while prolonging the inevitable does not carry high degrees of probability. 

Fans need to realize that it is highly likely Cam is not in the cards and has been told so.  That explains Greg Olsen's comments, Cam's absence from the sideline during the Kyle Allen / Will Grier games, and other rather cryptic tweets and comments. The decision to fire RR was a decision to rebuild--we are not making decisions in 2020 based on what we can get for Cam.  He will be shopped and traded or cut, in all likelihood.

[Icege]

If Cam is healthy, you start him and see how the season goes. If he looks good, try to negotiate an extension that's fair to both sides. If he looks uneasy, see if starts to all come together as the season progresses. I don't think a team is going to be willing to risk the capital that we're going to demand in order to trade away the best QB in the team's history.

I'm starting to realize that last year was the last hurrah for the old core, that we went all in to try and get a title before the window closed and the wheels fell off the wagon. I would love to see Cam stay, but only if he is healthy and the system revolves around the skillsets of him and his teammates rather than a system that makes the OC feel like they're smarter than everybody else.

I would love to see Cam be allowed to use his legs again and go with uptempo when he wants to. Whether it's to allow him to truck a defender or keep a play alive so that a target can open up downfield, let the man be who he is.

[Matt62881]

7 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

The Browns coaching staff doesn't exist yet. Technically neither does ours. Both are in the process of being rebuilt.

Is ours putrid? Don't know. They might be. We'll see.

But putting together a win-now strategy as a way of testing whether your coaching staff is good or not? No. That's a move that's worthy of the Browns management, and they are putrid.

I'm not saying go all in and mortgage the future, just do what you can...wich is fix our trenches.

[mrcompletely11]

1 minute ago, MHS831 said:

And from the team's perspective, we are not going to keep Cam and start him based on his contract status and the trade market.  If we have made the decision to move on, he gets traded or cut. This team is not going to change 2020 plans because they did not get a good trade offer for Cam.

It is this simple--Cut Cam and save $19m and get a third round comp pick in 2021

Trade Cam and save $21m and get about a second round pick in 2020.

Keep Cam and let him eat up $21m in cap space while prolonging the inevitable does not carry high degrees of probability. 

Fans need to realize that it is highly likely Cam is not in the cards and has been told so.  That explains Greg Olsen's comments, Cam's absence from the sideline during the Kyle Allen / Will Grier games, and other rather cryptic tweets and comments. The decision to fire RR was a decision to rebuild--we are not making decisions in 2020 based on what we can get for Cam.  He will be shopped and traded or cut, in all likelihood.

Holy crap this is a good post.  Way more eloquent then anything I could post but these are my thoughts as well.