The Athletic reports that Marty Hurney will stay on as GM, and is negotiating contracts for Bradberry and Boston

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, Cracka McNasty said:

"Say what you will about Chad being a dingus but he talked to that girl for 5 hours then went home with blue balls. Dude is a STUD".

I laughed.

[LinvilleGorge]

The only factor that matters with a GM with a 13 season track record is wins and losses. Your job is to assemble rosters and oversee an organization TO WIN FOOTBALL GAMES. Hurney is a failure of a GM.

[bobowilson]

4 minutes ago, Cracka McNasty said:

 

The first round pick is worth more but a second round pick that's Michael Thomas or a third round pick that's Russell Wilson is more valuable than a Ryan Tannehill or a Sammy Watkins. 

What you're not understanding is that Michael Thomas is a 1 in a 1000 circumstance, which is why the trade value chart reflects the values of that individual picks.

For every Michael Thomas, there's 999 guys who are either mediocre or won't even make your roster.

If the math is too abstract, ask yourself how many fringe rotation guys you might pick in the mid rounds you would need to accept for a trade for a prime Luke.   10, 15, 20?   Would you have traded a prime Luke for 5 fringe 4th round guys?

Fringe rotation guys aren't that valuable because they're not 'above replacement level', and you can sign guys like that in free agency for veteran minimum contracts.  The main use of the draft is to lock up high end talent on cheap rookie deals, and these type of guys are inordinately found in the 1st round (for all general managers, not just Hurney).

[bobowilson]

1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

The only factor that matters with a GM with a 13 season track record is wins and losses. Your job is to assemble rosters and oversee an organization TO WIN FOOTBALL GAMES. Hurney is a failure of a GM.

Judging quarterbacks, coaches, general managers, or anyone by a reductionist 'win loss' metric, is first order thinking, and Tepper would have washed out of Goldman Sachs within his first weeks if he processed information in such a binary manner.

I understand why your average fan thinks in this manner (we evolved to be results oriented primates), but you have to think beyond this if you want to succeed or make good decisions in any cognitively demanding enterprise.

 

[bobowilson]

8 minutes ago, Harbingers said:

No, it’s not called GM speak. It’s where he was on the literal board. You know the big board with names on it?

link

[LinvilleGorge]

2 minutes ago, bobowilson said:

Judging quarterbacks, coaches, general managers, or anyone by a reductionist 'win loss' metric, is first order thinking, and Tepper would have washed out of Goldman Sachs within his first weeks if he processed information in such a binary manner.

I understand why your average fan thinks in this manner (we evolved to be results oriented primates), but you have to think beyond this if you want to succeed or make good decisions in any cognitively demanding enterprise.

 

Or ya know, you can sit around and analyze it to death and try to stack the deck to produce the result of your choosing and ultimately convince yourself that Marty Hurney is a competent NFL GM. Either way.

Successful NFL organizations aren't hedge funds. All of these NFL owners have been very successful in other business ventures. A lot of them are really terrible at building winning football organizations, if they're even trying.

[Harbingers]

3 minutes ago, bobowilson said:

Judging quarterbacks, coaches, general managers, or anyone by a reductionist 'win loss' metric, is first order thinking, and Tepper would have washed out of Goldman Sachs within his first weeks if he processed information in such a binary manner.

I understand why your average fan thinks in this manner (we evolved to be results oriented primates), but you have to think beyond this if you want to succeed or make good decisions in any cognitively demanding enterprise.

 

It’s abundantly clear you don’t care about wins and losses, the one thing that matters. Now your trying to do some mental gymnastics to say wins don’t matter. Get the fug out of here.

[LinvilleGorge]

11 minutes ago, Cracka McNasty said:

"Say what you will about Chad being a dingus but he talked to that girl for 5 hours then went home with blue balls. Dude is a STUD".

Honestly, this is the only sane approach. Make a mockery of it. Attempts at intelligent debate of incomprehensible viewpoints is just hapless.

[Tbe]

8 minutes ago, bobowilson said:

What you're not understanding is that Michael Thomas is a 1 in a 1000 circumstance, which is why the trade value chart reflects the values of that individual picks.

For every Michael Thomas, there's 999 guys who are either mediocre or won't even make your roster.

If the math is too abstract, ask yourself how many fringe rotation guys you might pick in the mid rounds you would need to accept for a trade for a prime Luke.   10, 15, 20?   Would you have traded a prime Luke for 5 fringe 4th round guys?

Fringe rotation guys aren't that valuable because they're not 'above replacement level', and you can sign guys like that in free agency for veteran minimum contracts.  The main use of the draft is to lock up high end talent on cheap rookie deals, and these type of guys are inordinately found in the 1st round (for all general managers, not just Hurney).

How do you explain what the patriots have been doing then? How many top 1st round picks (or 1st round picks period) have they had? 
 

Football is the ultimate team sport. 3-5 high value guys surrounded by C and D level players will not produce a winner. A GM needs to be able to do more than that. A consistently winning org needs people who can find talent where all other orgs see scrubs. 

[Mr. Scot]

3 minutes ago, bobowilson said:

Judging quarterbacks, coaches, general managers, or anyone by a reductionist 'win loss' metric, is first order thinking, and Tepper would have washed out of Goldman Sachs within his first weeks if he processed information in such a binary manner.

I understand why your average fan thinks in this manner (we evolved to be results oriented primates), but you have to think beyond this if you want to succeed or make good decisions in any cognitively demanding enterprise.

Seriously, dude...

The NFL doesn't give out style points. You don't get a gold star for attendance, nobody gets a participation trophy and you don't get an 'A' for effort.

You win, or you get fired. And teams that hang on to coaches and GMs that don't win continue to not win.

Winning is the only thing that matters.

 

[LinvilleGorge]

4 minutes ago, Harbingers said:

It’s abundantly clear you don’t care about wins and losses, the one thing that matters. Now your trying to do some mental gymnastics to say wins don’t matter. Get the fug out of here.

I'm sure Tepper would've had infinite patience with one of his hedge fund managers who made mistake after mistake while doing nothing but lose money. One of the best investment evaluators there is.

[bobowilson]

2 minutes ago, Tbe said:

How do you explain what the patriots have been doing then? How many top 1st round picks (or 1st round picks period) have they had? 
 

Football is the ultimate team sport. 3-5 high value guys surrounded by C and D level players will not produce a winner. A GM needs to be able to do more than that. A consistently winning org needs people who can find talent where all other orgs see scrubs. 

Greatest franchise of all time, with the greatest coach in NFL history, and greatest QB in NFL history.  Nothing and no one can ever be compared to them, nor can you imitate their methods.

With all that said, I believe in a decade or two, we'll be more aware that Spygate was only the tip of a titanic iceberg of stealth and clandestine operations the Patriots engaged in, that either circumvented the rules, or skated along them in ways other teams would never have the courage to attempt.  More than anything, I've always believed this to be at the heart of their unrivaled success.

 

[Mr. Scot]

2 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I'm sure Tepper would've had infinite patience with one of his hedge fund managers who made mistake after mistake while doing nothing but lose money. One of the best investment evaluators there is.

[Harbingers]

Just now, LinvilleGorge said:

I'm sure Tepper would've had infinite patience with one of his hedge fund managers who made mistake after mistake while doing nothing but lose money. One of the best investment evaluators there is.

That’s why I don’t like this whole comparison to money managers these pro Hurney people try to make.  

Money managers actually lose a lot. But they ALWAYS meet the goal on return. 1% 2% 5%, what ever the number that was set is. That in football equivalent is making the playoffs every season. If they don’t they lose that account. 

Hurney hasn't made the return 10 out of 13 times. 

If he was a money manager he’d be out of the business plain and simple. He’s fuging other people out of their money.