"Panthers have the least attractive opening"

[Ivan The Awesome]

He's absolutely right. The uncertainty of Cam and his health. That line being trash. The injuries. The front office not taking shape yet. 

 

The only way is if the coach comes in and brings himself a person that he trusts as GM and that's a rare thing to happen. If they get full control over staff. Again, super rare. We all know Marty is going to be here so this makes it even more unattractive. 

[(ATL'ien)CamNewton]

With Cam we're the most attractive

Without Cam the least attractive. Pretty simple.

[DubE_4MR]

In December I agree because Cam is recovering from surgery. If Cam makes a full recovery then it's the most attractive opening. Especially for an innovative offensive minded coach.

[PantherPhann89]

1 hour ago, Davidson Deac II said:

Dline can't be fixed by coaching alone.    We were allowing big holes up front even to bad teams.  No way is that a issue with coaching only.

We switched from a 34 to 43 and our run defense suffered for it. That was mostly due to coaching and partly personnel. Yes, we do need a run stuffer in the middle, but the o-line is priority...

[Sam Mills Fan]

You guys really seem to care a lot about what Jonathan Jones, one of our former beat writers and guy with no more knowledge about this subject than your average Huddlers, seems to think.

EDIT: The correct answer is quite obviously Washington. I wish Rivera the best of course, but he just got married to Dan Snyder and is stuck with Dwayne Haskins for the foreseeable future and no one really knows how good he's going to be. And they also have some question marks in their front office considering they have no front office.

[Seltzer]

 

.

16 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

Been saying this for a year now.  We are in way worse shape than many on this board or on twitter are willing to admit.

 

Maybe... things can change so much in just a year and I've lived through that a couple of times with this team alone.

I thought our roster was somewhat crap in 2014 and then we lost KB in TC going into 2015.  Literally no one thought we would have had the best record in the league. Our secondary being good came out of nowhere.

In 2003, the Bucs were the defending SB champions, the Falcons had Vick who was as hyped as Lamar Jackson is now, and the Saints were decent. There was literally zero optimism that year by the national media for the Panthers.

We may very well be crap next year, and if Cam is gone I can't see anyway we won't.

But ultimately who knows.

We still have the best all around RB in the NFL and IMO a top 10 WR even with bad QB play.

We have to fix the interior of the offensive line, but I think Moton is a good RT. Little was really starting to look good before injuries. Of course it's an unknown but we'll see.

On defense, Luke and Shaq are still great LBs. Burns's comments about gaining weight make me thibn we are going to do the smart thing and go back to a 4-3.

We need to keep Bradberry. I haven't given up on Jackson with a new coaching staff. 

Poe was having a really good season, and KK is still a lot better than people want to give him credit for.

I certainly will have low expectations going into next season, and I think it would be foolish to not do so.

But so much of it still depends on what happens at QB. 

The Colts were favorites going into this season until Luck retired.

The Patriots are already showing cracks, and if Brady truly leaves they could easily fall.

Everyone really needs to wait until camp to have a better idea and even then you never truly know.

It was evident from reporting in camp there were issues with both our lines, especially the offensive line.

Honestly, our defense may have worked even with the fundamental problems with rush defense if we actually had an offense and we weren't always in situations like the 2nd half where the other team had the lead and could just run and burn clock.

Anyway, this year's over. The team and roster needs a lot of work.

I will start out pessimistic about next year and hope I'm proved wrong. 2003 and 2015 were the best years in franchise history for me in part bc I had such low expectations going in and was so richly surprised 

[thefuzz]

3 minutes ago, Seltzer said:

 

.

Maybe... things can change so much in just a year and I've lived through that a couple of times with this team alone.

I thought our roster was somewhat crap in 2014 and then we lost KB in TC going into 2015.  Literally no one thought we would have had the best record in the league. Our secondary being good came out of nowhere.

In 2003, the Bucs were the defending SB champions, the Falcons had Vick who was as hyped as Lamar Jackson is now, and the Saints were decent. There was literally zero optimism that year by the national media for the Panthers.

We may very well be crap next year, and if Cam is gone I can't see anyway we won't.

But ultimately who knows.

We still have the best all around RB in the NFL and IMO a top 10 WR even with bad QB play.

We have to fix the interior of the offensive line, but I think Moton is a good RT. Little was really starting to look good before injuries. Of course it's an unknown but we'll see.

On defense, Luke and Shaq are still great LBs. Burns's comments about gaining weight make me thibn we are going to do the smart thing and go back to a 4-3.

We need to keep Bradberry. I haven't given up on Jackson with a new coaching staff. 

Poe was having a really good season, and KK is still a lot better than people want to give him credit for.

I certainly will have low expectations going into next season, and I think it would be foolish to not do so.

But so much of it still depends on what happens at QB. 

The Colts were favorites going into this season until Luck retired.

The Patriots are already showing cracks, and if Brady truly leaves they could easily fall.

Everyone really needs to wait until camp to have a better idea and even then you never truly know.

It was evident from reporting in camp there were issues with both our lines, especially the offensive line.

Honestly, our defense may have worked even with the fundamental problems with rush defense if we actually had an offense and we weren't always in situations like the 2nd half where the other team had the lead and could just run and burn clock.

Anyway, this year's over. The team and roster needs a lot of work.

I will start out pessimistic about next year and hope I'm proved wrong. 2003 and 2015 were the best years in franchise history for me in part bc I had such low expectations going in and was so richly surprised 

This team has given me very little to be optimistic about in a long time.  I wish I shared your feelings, but I don't.

Our offensive line is complete trash.  Our D Line is trash, hurt, and old.  Our best corner on the roster is Jackson, and he ain't good.  Our LB core is great....but that doesn't equal wins.  We have a great RB and a good WR.  We have an injury prone 34 OLB who couldn't get onto, or stay onto the field.  We have a complete QB mystery on our hands and we won't see what's going to happen with that until the Spring likely.  

Honestly, we have a couple of players that are great, a couple that are good, and the rest is old, injured, or free agents.

[Davidson Deac II]

11 minutes ago, PantherPhann89 said:

We switched from a 34 to 43 and our run defense suffered for it. That was mostly due to coaching and partly personnel. Yes, we do need a run stuffer in the middle, but the o-line is priority...

Our run defense was bad last year as well, allowing 4.7 yards a carry.  It was exposed more this year as we spent more time behind and teams ran the ball more.  I agree that our first round pick should go to a olineman.  But imo, both lines are priorities that will need to be addressed in both free agency and the draft.    We also don't know if the new coach will want a 34 or 43.  We will probably lose Mccoy and Addison.

[BurnHurnBurn]

3 hours ago, ncfan said:

 

 

Dumb.  32 jobs.  On the whole planet.  32.

Its like being mad you only got to hook up with a Miss America semi-finalist.  The stupid hurts my brain.  Jon-boy is salty.

[KillerKat]

If someone wants to be a head coach, they're not going to be picky. With that said, releasing Rivera earlier like last year or even this year before the season would have made us look better.

[PantherPhann89]

23 minutes ago, Davidson Deac II said:

Our run defense was bad last year as well, allowing 4.7 yards a carry.  It was exposed more this year as we spent more time behind and teams ran the ball more.  I agree that our first round pick should go to a olineman.  But imo, both lines are priorities that will need to be addressed in both free agency and the draft.    We also don't know if the new coach will want a 34 or 43.  We will probably lose Mccoy and Addison.

All true, but there's only one priority and that's the o-line. Constant 3 and outs will only put a less than stellar defense back on field too quick and too often. Giving our QB time is the key,  rest will follow, with work and time of course. If we can come out of FA with a top LT and hit on draft picks, I think we'd be good

[Doc Holiday]

1 hour ago, thefuzz said:

I disagree, especially when it comes to a couple of the most important pieces.

Roster and Ownership.

Our roster is way worse, and it's quite possible that our owner is as well, we just don't know for sure yet.

12 different head coaches in 20 years.....

NFL head coaches like job security. There is none There, That fact speaks for itself.

[Seltzer]

24 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

This team has given me very little to be optimistic about in a long time.  I wish I shared your feelings, but I don't.

Our offensive line is complete trash.  Our D Line is trash, hurt, and old.  Our best corner on the roster is Jackson, and he ain't good.  Our LB core is great....but that doesn't equal wins.  We have a great RB and a good WR.  We have an injury prone 34 OLB who couldn't get onto, or stay onto the field.  We have a complete QB mystery on our hands and we won't see what's going to happen with that until the Spring likely.  

Honestly, we have a couple of players that are great, a couple that are good, and the rest is old, injured, or free agents.

When was the last time you were optimistic?

I'm being serious. Because going into 2015, we had question marks all along the offensive line, the secondary was considered to be awful (Norman was unproven, Tillman and Harper were on their last legs, Coleman washed out in KC), we lost our #1 WR in TC, and Charles Johnson was our best pass rusher even though he was past his prime.

I just think people overrate our personnel after the fact and fail to see that every year there are usually serious question marks.

I don't think you are necessarily wrong in your pessimism. I want to be clear about that.

I just don't think this team has anymore holes for the most part this year versus any other year in recent history.

Cam has been the ultimate deodorant during that time. If he comes back healthy, I don't see any reason why elevating next year's team will be any more difficult than other years. Objectively speaking, I think CMC and DJ are a much better starting point than many other years. 

I think in the cesspool that has been the 2nd halves of the last 2 seasons, it has become hard to see any positives even though they are they.

Mushin Muhammad and Damien Lewis both believe our offensive line has talent but that the horrendous play of Paradis has brought everyone down, both from his own poor play and bad protection calls.

Our defensive line was going to have to rebuilt after this year no matter what bc of all the FAs. 

I truly have no idea how any of this ends up. We could easily be looking at a 2+ year rebuild. Or we could surprise a lot of people next year. 

As bad as we looked at times, over the last month alone we should have won at New Orleans and probably would have won against Seattle if Allen wasn't throwing interceptions galore.

I don't believe this current team is hopeless. But so much in the short term depends on making the right coaching hire and getting back to having (or drafting a legit QB that can be the franchise guy)

[Davidson Deac II]

4 minutes ago, PantherPhann89 said:

All true, but there's only one priority and that's the o-line. Constant 3 and outs will only put a less than stellar defense back on field too quick and too often. Giving our QB time is the key,  rest will follow, with work and time of course. If we can come out of FA with a top LT and hit on draft picks, I think we'd be good

And constantly allowing long methodical drives to opposing offenses will orce the bad offense to throw the ball more which means more sacks and int's.  Both are critical.  If we don't fix both of them, we will continue to experience subpar seasons.