Sounds like Olsen wants no part of a total rebuild

[Mr. Scot]

6 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

It was his way or the highway for DG.  His way or he would retire and go into the booth.

Love Olsen, but he's no saint, and shouldn't be considered so.  As has been said many times....football is a business.

And it ain't good business to bring Olsen back, unfortunately.

I suspect he's one of those guys who's got a very different work persona than he does in private.

Friend of mine who worked at the Levine Children's Hospital met him and his wife and said he was nice as he could be. In a football environment though, I get the sense he can be a self-centered, demanding, know-it-all / knows-he's-smarter-than-you sort of prick.

And to be fair, a lot of star players are like that. It's also true that realistically, he probably is smarter than most.

[thefuzz]

5 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

Agreed the cap figure is high, but as I stated before, I don't Ian Thomas is ready or really ever will be.  Unless we go out in FA and pay another #1 caliber TE starting money, then Greg can't be replaced next year.  If you think we are in full rebuild mode, then yes, blow the whole thing up and free up as much cap space as possible.  Me, on the other hand, think it's more of a retooling and a strategic reshuffling of the roster over the next couple of seasons which can yield a quick rebound.  

I don't think that we are in a full rebuild, I know we are.  That's why we are having a non ending conversation about Cam Newton and his being here or not moving forward.

Greg doesn't need to be replaced, Ian needs to do his job.  We need to lose games and get young players more playing time, we need higher draft picks, and likely need to cut or sell of some of our aging vets to acquire more draft capitol.

I'm not trying to win a single game next season if we move on from Cam Newton.

[punkpanther]

48 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

I totally get what you are saying, but I've always thought of Greg as a stand up guy.  This is a chicken sh-t ploy and if the team still needs/wants his services next season, the Greg I know (obviously not personally) would oblige.  That kind of behavior is not something a 2x time Walter Peyton Man of the Year finalist would do.  And yes, I would think a heck of lot less of Greg Olsen. I know your retort, he could care less about what the fans think.  To that I would say he's a fake, a fraud and the good guy act was all a front.

This is exactly the type of sentimental b.s that gets teams in trouble . I’m a Greg fan for sure but he’s on the wrong side of 30 and can’t stay healthy. Time to move along.if he can get a deal on another team for a few more years more power to him. Why would you think differently of him because of that ?

[45catfan]

5 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

I don't think that we are in a full rebuild, I know we are.  That's why we are having a non ending conversation about Cam Newton and his being here or not moving forward.

Greg doesn't need to be replaced, Ian needs to do his job.  We need to lose games and get young players more playing time, we need higher draft picks, and likely need to cut or sell of some of our aging vets to acquire more draft capitol.

I'm not trying to win a single game next season if we move on from Cam Newton.

We are seeing things differently then.  2020 is going to suck either way we go, but I think with two good drafts and two good FA off seasons, 2021 could be a very good year. If we scrap the whole thing, It will take another year or two longer to bare fruit, IMO because rookies don't fully realize their potential typically until years 3 or 4.

[thefuzz]

Just now, 45catfan said:

We are seeing things differently then.  2020 is going to suck either way we go, but I think with two good drafts and two good FA off seasons, 2021 could be a very good year. If we scrap the whole thing, It will take another year or two longer to bare fruit, IMO because rookies don't fully realize their potential typically until years 3 or 4.

2 good drafts when we haven't had a good one in some time.  2 more seasons that Olsen wants no part of.

We need draft picks, we need young players starting, we need to get younger all over this team, Olsen absolutely does not fit with either of those things.  We also need to roll over cap space to prepare for coming out of the rebuild....another knock on him.

This team is a MESS, but I have been calling for this for over a year now.

[45catfan]

9 minutes ago, punkpanther said:

This is exactly the type of sentimental b.s that gets teams in trouble . I’m a Greg fan for sure but he’s on the wrong side of 30 and can’t stay healthy. Time to move along.if he can get a deal on another team for a few more years more power to him. Why would you think differently of him because of that ?

He can't be replaced next year unless you get a starting TE in FA.  At that point, you are not saving a boat-lode of cap space.  Ask the Cleveland Browns what $100 million in cap space got them.  (Hint: last place)  Lastly, I'm not wanting an extension, a restructuring or anything like that.  What I want is the team to FINALLY find his replacement and give that guy a year with this team to get his feet wet and learn from one of the all-time best TEs.

[45catfan]

5 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

2 good drafts when we haven't had a good one in some time.  2 more seasons that Olsen wants no part of.

We need draft picks, we need young players starting, we need to get younger all over this team, Olsen absolutely does not fit with either of those things.  We also need to roll over cap space to prepare for coming out of the rebuild....another knock on him.

This team is a MESS, but I have been calling for this for over a year now.

Sorry, but building exclusively via the draft and wanting tons cap space doesn't compute.  If you want to blow it up (apparently you do) and have one of the youngest teams in the League, then huge amounts cap space means little.  Cap space is primarily for signing free agents...rookie deals barely dent the cap.  We wouldn't need tons of cap room for 4 or 5 years down the road when these first 'rebuild' classes reach the end of their rookie deals.

[Mr. Scot]

3 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

Sorry, but building exclusively via the draft and wanting tons cap space doesn't compute.  If you want to blow it up (apparently you do) and have one of the youngest teams in the League, then huge amounts cap space means little.  Cap space is primarily for signing free agents...rookie deals barely dent the cap.  We wouldn't need tons of cap room for 4 or 5 years down the road when these first 'rebuild' classes reach the end of their rookie deals.

Depends on what you're building for.

I'll take sustained success over quick success all day any day.

[thefuzz]

1 minute ago, 45catfan said:

Sorry, but building exclusively via the draft and wanting tons cap space doesn't compute.  If you want to blow it up (apparently you do) and have one of the youngest teams in the League, then huge amounts cap space means little.  Cap space is primarily for signing free agents...rookie deals barely dent the cap.  We wouldn't need tons of cap room for 4 or 5 years down the road when these first 'rebuild' classes reach the end of their rookie deals.

To build a consistent winner, you need to draft well, and pay your own.  That means getting as many draft picks as possible, using them wisely, and then paying the ones you will need to keep moving forward.

We need to pay Bradberry, that is going to be expensive...hence we need cap space.  Same with Moton, we cannot draft that kind of talent and let them walk out the doors as finished products.

This is a many years project...think 3+, and the cap space will be needed for extensions, and to bring in select free agents once we get close to having a playoff team again, which we are not close to now.

[45catfan]

1 minute ago, thefuzz said:

To build a consistent winner, you need to draft well, and pay your own.  That means getting as many draft picks as possible, using them wisely, and then paying the ones you will need to keep moving forward.

We need to pay Bradberry, that is going to be expensive...hence we need cap space.  Same with Moton, we cannot draft that kind of talent and let them walk out the doors as finished products.

This is a many years project...think 3+, and the cap space will be needed for extensions, and to bring in select free agents once we get close to having a playoff team again, which we are not close to now.

Who is deserving of a lucrative new deal this year other than Bradberry?  Shaq already got paid.  I agree with you about paying your own, but we've sucked so badly at drafting, there's few that are deserving presently.  I'm not seeing the cap urgency that you are.  Considering Marty is the GM, that's a surprising statement.

 

[Paa Langfart]

I cant blame Greg for not wanting to be part of a rebuild effort at this point in his career, but I also don't think it is going to be up to him anyway.  IMO he will be released.  He has close to $12 million in cap hit next year and only $3.7 million in dead cap money.  Sunday will be Olsen's last game as a Panther and I would guess likely as a player period.

[thefuzz]

Just now, 45catfan said:

Who is deserving of a lucrative new deal this year other than Bradberry?  Shaq already got paid.  I agree with you about paying your own, but we've sucked so badly at drafting, there's few that are deserving presently.  I'm not seeing the cap urgency that you are.  Considering Marty is the GM, that's a surprising statement.

 

It's not now, I'm not building this team for next year, or the year after that....more for the next 10.

I'm not a huge fan of the Shaq contract, especially if we don't know what is in store for us moving forward on the defensive side of the ball....James should have been locked up last offseason, but we have a moron in the GM's seat.

If we are going to do a full rebuild, and I think it's needed terribly, we may as well get rid of Olsen and Cam, sign Moton and James to contracts, consider moving on from Luke if the compensation is great enough, and start from scratch.

We need O Line, D Line, QB, and secondary help.  That's going to take a while.  Then what if we hit on our QB like Tua, or even better like a Russell Wilson in the later rounds, we are going to need to lock anyone drafted after the 1st round after 3 seasons....lots of cap room needed.

My point, is if you are doing a rebuild and planning for the future, it's better to have tons of cap space, than not, it just makes life easier.

As to why the cap is still OK with Marty here?  It's because we have very little locked up long term on this roster.  Like....almost no one that is an above average starter, under 30, signed with years still on their deals.  Shaq, CMC, Moore.....maybe Luke if you are still considering him young?

It's a mess out there my friend.

[45catfan]

5 minutes ago, Paa Langfart said:

I cant blame Greg for not wanting to be part of a rebuild effort at this point in his career, but I also don't think it is going to be up to him anyway.  IMO he will be released.  He has close to $12 million in cap hit next year and only $3.7 million in dead cap money.  Sunday will be Olsen's last game as a Panther and I would guess likely as a player period.

I guess he's making it easier for the team to pull the trigger then, by signaling he wants no part of a rebuild year in any fashion.  Greg is no dummy, he knows it's going to be a rough year with or without Cam.  

[Wolfcop]

Olsen is slow as molasses. I would cut him if he doesn't retire. Again, thanks for the memories and enjoy retirement.