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kindergarten up in here.

[panthers55]

36 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

If you cut a player within 2 years of drafting him, it's a bad pick no matter what the circumstances are.

For that team and that system perhaps but you assume that players will function equally in all systems and if they are a bad fit in one system they will automatically be bad in any system. Obviously anyone who pays attention would know that isn't true and there has to be a good fit between the players skills and how they are being used. To me Gaulden was a deficit in coverage  and should be used as a strong safety who plays primarily in the box which is not the way our system works or how he was used. But carry on with your absolutes and black and white logic. 

[Shotgun]

2 hours ago, joeyxfresco said:

I think everyone knows Hurney shouldn’t be GM. What’s the arguments? Dude makes some good moves and then some awful ones. Dudes better suited as an advisor of some sort 

For the saints.

[mc52beast]

3 hours ago, The Huddler said:

hes pretty spot on in the 1st round. 

 

id take a homerun 1st rounder that lives up to the hype but have the rest of the draft botched, every..  damn..  year..

You have got to be kidding... and never apply for a GM opening in the NFL

[Waldo]

17 minutes ago, WOW!! said:

Examples of differences please?? Not defending Marty but he did just cut Galuden and he cut Otah...

Galuden lost his poo and got thrown off the team, which is funny because it wasn't due to his play which was enough reason. Otah injured himself out of the luege, if i remember he couldnt pass a physical (been forever). Butler should have been moved on from and we could have used the roster spot to help the thin Dline (even though he is playing better he still gets abused more often than not and still isnt a good option as a backup).

What about the non-bust that he still messes up their values? How about messing with KKs contract when every indication was we were already overpaying for his play and should have been moving towards keeping our options open. Resigning Shaq when letting him walk at that price and uncertainty of coaching & scheme. 

I mean, he brought back Williams to play LT,  not RT. After blowing out his knee.  As a penciled in starter.

[Jeremy Igo]

Hurney is good when he listens to his scouts. 

 

Hurney is dog poo when he goes with his gut.

 

It's that easy. The scouts hated Gaulden, but Hurndog had a good feeling about him. Rinse, repeat.

[WOW!!]

21 minutes ago, panthers55 said:

For that team and that system perhaps but you assume that players will function equally in all systems and if they are a bad fit in one system they will automatically be bad in any system. Obviously anyone who pays attention would know that isn't true and there has to be a good fit between the players skills and how they are being used. To me Gaulden was a deficit in coverage  and should be used as a strong safety who plays primarily in the box which is not the way our system works or how he was used. But carry on with your absolutes and black and white logic. 

He doesn't understand that a player not working out in your system doesn't mean he's a bad player or a bad pick.. It's not the GM fault when he picks groceries and the coach can't cook..

[Toomers]

Just now, WOW!! said:

He doesn't understand that a player not working out in your system doesn't mean he's a bad player or a bad pick.. It's not the GM fault when he picks groceries and the coach can't cook..

So do coaches get all the credit when players are good? How’s that work?  Why aren’t you drafting for the system you are playing? 

 

[SmokinwithWilly]

Regardless of how he drafts, Hurney is not good at building a team. It doesnt matter if he has 11 all pros because he needs 42 other guys for the team to be a success. His teams look good on paper but his "gut" picks almost never pan out. He isnt good enough to be a total control GM.

Gettleman didnt draft the core of this team, but he built decently around them. That's not a celebration of him, just an admonishment of what he did. He drafted ok, reached for a few guys he shouldnt have, but filled in with some late round talent and udfa. He shouldnt be a total control GM either. 

Records speak for themselves and 3 winning seasons in 12 isnt good by any standard. This team, this fanbase, deserves better than either one of these guys.

[BrianS]

1 hour ago, Forty-Eight said:

Dumbass Hurney did not draft HOF Agent 89! Get that crap right. Witherspoon and Ricky Manning were good picks but never got a second contract from Hurney. Evan Mathis never succeeded until toward the end of his career in Philly. James Anderson was overrated as hell. Made a bunch of tackles that didn’t make any difference. Connor was a complete bust. When have Panthers fans decided that Lafell and Godfrey are now good? Charles Johnson is the only great pick out of that list. 

Whether a player got a second contract or here does not detract from the fact that they were solid players, which is the entire point of the thread:  Identifying college talent.

You don't get "great" players in the third round regularly.  This is the problem so many people miss out on.  Third rounders turn into solid starters 12% of the time!  Not great, just solid starters.  If only 12% of third rounders turn into solid starters, consider how many would actually qualify as "great" players league wide.  1%?  Is that too high?  Maybe.

And frankly, the opinions of us as fans is quite irrelevant to a player being considered a success.  If a player starts 50 games, that player has had a successful career.  How many players come through and never start a game, never make a roster?  Consider LaFell.

LaFell has a ring.  He caught a game winning touchdown in the playoffs en route to that ring.  Frankly, LaFell was not appreciated here because we were trying to compare him to 89 and Moose.  Well, no, he wasn't 89 or Moose, but he was a good receiver.  I don't think any of us knew just how good we had it at the time when 89 and Moose were here . . . now we know.

 

[WOW!!]

6 minutes ago, Waldo said:

Galuden lost his poo and got thrown off the team, which is funny because it wasn't due to his play which was enough reason. Otah injured himself out of the luege, if i remember he couldnt pass a physical (been forever). Butler should have been moved on from and we could have used the roster spot to help the thin Dline (even though he is playing better he still gets abused more often than not and still isnt a good option as a backup).

What about the non-bust that he still messes up their values? How about messing with KKs contract when every indication was we were already overpaying for his play and should have been moving towards keeping our options open. Resigning Shaq when letting him walk at that price and uncertainty of coaching & scheme. 

I mean, he brought back Williams to play LT,  not RT. After blowing out his knee.  As a penciled in starter.

Wrong these 2 big Paragraph have no objection to them.. And you have made up narratives to fit your argument based on no facts..

1. You made a caveat to your cutting players Theory.. At 1st getting off bust players is what you said.. Now you say the reason he got off that players wasn't good enough for you?? It has to be a specific reason for you to count it??

2. Actual Butler has had a nice season and with the injuries has been needed.. I still wouldn't give him a contract.. But it definitely wasn't a mistake to have him on the roster.. And would it had count in your scenario anyway.. He was a Gman pick not a Hurney.. Wouldn't it have to be his players he needs to come off to fit your narrative??

3. When did Hurney become the Oline coach, The OC or head coach??

He doesn't have anything to do with where Rivera, Norv, and Masko decided to play a player and if they play the player at all..

If so why did we cut CJ anderson?? I'm pretty sure Hurney would have wanted to keep Anderson on the roster since he was a name recognition signing and he didn't save any money by not keeping him and playing him..

[WOW!!]

10 minutes ago, Toomers said:

So do coaches get all the credit when players are good? How’s that work?  Why aren’t you drafting for the system you are playing? 

 

No .. But a GM job is to draft talented players not develop them or place and train them in a system.. Thsts the coaches job.... If the player shows to be talented somewhere else later in his career.. How is that the GM fault??

[SmokinwithWilly]

Just now, WOW!! said:

No .. But a GM job is to draft talented players not develop them or place and train them in a system.. Thsts the coaches job.... If the player shows to be talented somewhere else later in his career.. How is that the GM fault??

If you have a coach that has been consistently terrible at doing that very thing but do nothing about it as GM, it's your fault.

[WOW!!]

12 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

Regardless of how he drafts, Hurney is not good at building a team. It doesnt matter if he has 11 all pros because he needs 42 other guys for the team to be a success. His teams look good on paper but his "gut" picks almost never pan out. He isnt good enough to be a total control GM.

Gettleman didnt draft the core of this team, but he built decently around them. That's not a celebration of him, just an admonishment of what he did. He drafted ok, reached for a few guys he shouldnt have, but filled in with some late round talent and udfa. He shouldnt be a total control GM either. 

Records speak for themselves and 3 winning seasons in 12 isnt good by any standard. This team, this fanbase, deserves better than either one of these guys.

Record was also the benefit of having 2 of the best players in the league carrying the offense and defense to success.. Without Cam being super Cam Gman doesn't get that record..