Curtis Samuel is not killing drives

[PhillyB]

20 minutes ago, Snake said:

In reality that tells you all you need to know about how bad the Oline is. We need new trenches on both sides. I think Samuels problem is more understanding the game than catching the ball. He runs way to many sloppy routes and doesn't understand where to be too much. Moore on the other hand has done really well with that. 

i think his problem is named kyle allen

[Khyber53]

37 minutes ago, Forty-Eight said:

Just wait until we draft a Jerry Jeudy, CeeDee Lamb, Henry Ruggs, or Tee Higgins in the 1st or 2nd. Samuel will then be the 4th WR behind Wright. Y’all can love him or suck him all y’all really want. The fact is Samuel won’t be getting a second contract from this team. 

I thought you've been crowing about Tua and his crutches being our first rounder.

Man, you've got to keep your trolling straight.

[imminent rogaine]

2 hours ago, Bronn said:

Curtis Samuel is one of the softest WRs on the field on game day. That is his biggest problem.

I don't care all that much for Kyle Allen, and like the things that Shaq, Bradberry, and Reid (national hero) do most of the time, and I'd still say what I said in the original sentence to Curtis' face.

He shies away from contact 99% of the time, body catches and gets alligator arms when balls are catchable, and his biggest asset is his speed, which does very little for him in this offense.

He needs to toughen up, take some hits, and not look to hug the sideline any time he gets the ball near him.

I think he is just a smaller Devin Funchess. Same issues. Same soft approach. They are both even pretty good with hooks and come-back type routes. Neither fights for the ball. They both would much rather make their catches with their body than with their hands. 

[WarHeel]

2 hours ago, Icege said:

The next time somebody tries to tell you that Curtis Samuel is part of the problem, do a little post history browsing. If you see them propping up Kyle Allen and/or whining about Shaq/Reid/Bradberry, just put that user on ignore. They're not interested in facts.

What’s the drop rate on catchable balls though?

[mav1234]

Curtis Samuel is tied for 4th worst in the league in catch % at 50.56%.  He is tied for fifth worst in the league with 7 drops.  He has been targeted 89 times.

For comparison, DJ Moore's catch % is ~65%, and he has only 4 drops.  He has been targeted 121 times.

Samuel is a dynamic playmaker with the ball in his hands.  The issue is getting the  ball in his hands reliably.  That issue is both a Samuel problem, and an Allen problem.  Samuel is not trash, but he is also not a particularly good receiver.  Kyle Allen is not a particularly good quarterback, but Samuel is contributing his own poor play to the mix that is killing drives.

[raz]

he's on our team and you want to love him.  cool.   he's not a good wr.  he's a gadget player.  he's got no body control, he's not tough, and he doesn't have good hands.   we need better.   we need to start with the line, figure out the qb, and get to replacing him when we can, and using him for the type of player he is.   

[GOOGLE JIM BOB COOTER]

samuel’s value is in torching his man and catching 70 yard bombs. tough time doing that with a guy like allen. samuel would seem a lot more valuable with even mediocre quarterback play. beyond that, he’s been scapegoated by people who went just a little too hard for allen and now need an excuse to justify it. you can score a lot of points with a receiving corps headed up by moore and samuel. the fact that we haven’t is telling.

[mav1234]

14 minutes ago, GOOGLE JIM BOB COOTER said:

samuel’s value is in torching his man and catching 70 yard bombs. tough time doing that with a guy like allen. samuel would seem a lot more valuable with even mediocre quarterback play. beyond that, he’s been scapegoated by people who went just a little too hard for allen and now need an excuse to justify it. you can score a lot of points with a receiving corps headed up by moore and samuel. the fact that we haven’t is telling.

I would like to believe Samuel would see more value with a better QB, but he has played 23 games with Cam Newton and 12 with Kyle Allen... In his first 2 years as a starting WR he has basically the same YPC (12.7 last year to 12.6 this year)... And Kyle Allen has thrown him his top 3 longest completions... 54, 44, and 33 yards... nobody has completed a 70 yard bomb to him.  some day tho, hopefully.

and ofc we all know Cam has basically been injured for some time, so it is hard to really evaluate any WRs he was throwing to.

I don't think Samuel is trash, but he isn't a particularly talented receiver.  He is very much like Ginn... an important part of the offense since he can blow the top off of a defense, whether the QB connects with him or not, since the D must always respect that potential.  But I consider those guys to be dynamic players that we need to get the ball to in other ways too.  This is even more true of Samuel than Ginn, because Samuel is really electric with the ball in his hands.

I would like to see Samuel with someone other than Kyle Allen at some point tho, heh.

[Navy_football]

55 minutes ago, imminent rogaine said:

I think he is just a smaller Devin Funchess. Same issues. Same soft approach. They are both even pretty good with hooks and come-back type routes. Neither fights for the ball. They both would much rather make their catches with their body than with their hands. 

Devin Funchess is one of the slowest #1 receivers to play in the NFL - only to be outdone by his previous teammate Kelvin Benjamin. 

Comparing Samuel to him is just INACCURATE. Ted Ginn is probably a better comparison. Though Samuel isn't as likely to drop wide open TDs that hit him in the hands as he's streaking 10 yards in front of the nearest defender. So, I'd say a more reliable Ted Ginn could be his floor. A strong-armed QB could make that work big time. 

[raz]

Just now, Navy_football said:

Devin Funchess is one of the slowest #1 receivers to play in the NFL - only to be outdone by his previous teammate Kelvin Benjamin. 

Comparing Samuel to him is just INACCURATE. Ted Ginn is probably a better comparison. Though Samuel isn't as likely to drop wide open TDs that hit him in the hands as he's streaking 10 yards in front of the nearest defender. So, I'd say a more reliable Ted Ginn could be his floor. A strong-armed QB could make that work big time. 

but he's got bad hands, bad body control, and not a lot of skill running under the ball.  personally he just looks fast.   i don't think he's trash as a player.  i feel like a good coordinator could make him very effective, just not as a #1 or #2

[kungfoodude]

Samuels wasn't a WR in the first place. He's a gadget player. Typical Panthers, though. Let's beat this square peg into the round hole we have.

 

Samuels will be fine for us once we stop trying to make him something he isn't. 

[Jeremy Igo]

Cherry picking plays to show is fun. Now let me make one with a dozen horrible effort plays 

[Proudiddy]

I think a lot of people's frustration is rooted in the fact that he excels at getting deep but can't because we don't have an active QB who can accurately get it to him in that capacity.  It's not Samuel's fault.  I'm not giving up on him.

[MasterAwesome]

Curtis Samuel being bad and Kyle Allen being bad are not mutually exclusive, FYI.