Tepper if you do snoop this board, your thoughts on hurney are wrong

[LinvilleGorge]

39 minutes ago, carpanfan96 said:

50% of first round picks are considered successful selections, roughly half never play 3 years. 2nd round it's in the 30-40% range and after that your in the 10-20% range through the 3rd and 4th rounds. So in a typical draft a team will typically find 1-2 long term starters in a good draft. That's a good draft, most teams consider it good fortune to land 1-2 long term players. It's why the patriots build up 2nd and 3rd round selections.  Cheap and it's like throwing mud on a wall and seeing what sticks, having more throws makes it more likely you find something to stick. Nearly every gm is historically horrible from rounds 2-7, it's just the odds. 

7 NFL caliber players over four entire drafts is absolutely atrocious.

[Forty-Eight]

Hurney fuggn suck 

[LinvilleGorge]

Anyone stumping for Hurney to remain with full GM control either has amnesia or simply hasn't been a Panthers fan for long.

[Squirrel]

1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Anyone stumping for Hurney to remain with full GM control either has amnesia or simply hasn't been a Panthers fan for long.

2.0 has been alot better than 1.0. But still not good enough to keep his job. With a good GM injuries isnt a factor for the team next man up is just that plug and play. Hurney has never been good at that. 

[carpanfan96]

26 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

7 NFL caliber players over four entire drafts is absolutely atrocious.

Not really, here's a shocker for you. If the average draft produces two starters then 4 drafts would be 8 players. 53% of first round picks have career av over 5 and 60% are starters. 2nd round is around 30% Av of 5 and 40% starters. After 2nd round we are in the 20% or lower for av and roughly 25% and lower for starters of one season. 

[carpanfan96]

12 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Anyone stumping for Hurney to remain with full GM control either has amnesia or simply hasn't been a Panthers fan for long.

Not really for him staying or going, just trying to reset expectations for drafts. Everyone here has way too high of expectations for drafts based on league history

[LinvilleGorge]

24 minutes ago, carpanfan96 said:

Not really, here's a shocker for you. If the average draft produces two starters then 4 drafts would be 8 players. 53% of first round picks have career av over 5 and 60% are starters. 2nd round is around 30% Av of 5 and 40% starters. After 2nd round we are in the 20% or lower for av and roughly 25% and lower for starters of one season. 

Do the math. He had a 21% hit rate in those drafts. Atrocious.

[LinvilleGorge]

21 minutes ago, carpanfan96 said:

Not really for him staying or going, just trying to reset expectations for drafts. Everyone here has way too high of expectations for drafts based on league history

I'm not just talking about starters. Quality depth has to be drafted too. Look at those drafts. There was none of that. A few hits and the rest complete and utter whiffs.

[PantherGuy]

5 hours ago, RumHam said:

While you may argue that ron couldn't accomplish hurneys vision from his personnel choices, he isn't a great evaluator like you think he is. Just remember those were gettleman players when we peaked this decade. Our secondary shows flashes, and thats about it. Both ol and dl are atrocious. The wr got better, but samuel was a gettleman guy. Just because he agrees with everything you say doesn't mean hes good. Theres a reason no other team signed him over the course of four years.

I happen to think his thoughts on Hurney are pretty good. poo on me if you want but I think Hurney is a good GM.

[billionairemonk]

5 hours ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

The lowest.

[SmokinwithWilly]

6 hours ago, bobowilson said:

 

No matter how many great draft picks he produces, they can't get past their confirmation bias, and will continue to cling to the fact he drafted Armanti Edwards (at the 89th pick late in the third round).  Never mind the fact Armanti Edwards actually played 41 games in the NFL, which is about the exact median length of someone chosen 89th.

Edwards was drafted with the 33rd pick of the 2011 draft. That's what he actually cost, regardless of where he was drafted. 

The reason this pick is so heavily criticized is it was for a player who was going to be transitioning to a new position he had never played. He was also coming from a lesser level of college competition. He was considered a late round to udfa at the time. It was absolutely a reach pick that never even came close to panning out. The only reason he wasnt cut sooner is because of how much was spent to draft him.

[JARROD]

If Tepper reads too much of this board he would be inclined to move the team or sell it. 
 

 

[bobowilson]

57 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

Edwards was drafted with the 33rd pick of the 2011 draft. That's what he actually cost, regardless of where he was drafted. 

The reason this pick is so heavily criticized is it was for a player who was going to be transitioning to a new position he had never played. He was also coming from a lesser level of college competition. He was considered a late round to udfa at the time. It was absolutely a reach pick that never even came close to panning out. The only reason he wasnt cut sooner is because of how much was spent to draft him.

You know who we traded with for that pick.

The Patriots selected Ras-I Dowling with the 33rd pick in the draft we gave them in the Armani trade.  Dowling had even a worse career than Edwards, only playing 2 and 7 games for the Patriots over 2 years before getting cut.  Played 12 games in total over his entire NFL career (compared to 41 games for Armanti Edwards).

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/D/DowlRa00.htm

Are the Patriots incompetent for selecting Ras-I Dowling with the 2nd rounder we gave them for Armanti Edwards, or perhaps, is the draft a crapshoot after round 1?

Here are two consecutive drafts for the Patriots in which they got absolutely nothing other than 2 players in 19 picks.  Yes, out of 19 picks, only 2 were every even serviceable.  Even in Hurney's worst drafts cherrypicked over 13 years, he still picked Hall of Famers.  The Patriots only got 1 starter and 1 kicker over 10 picks (note, Mincey never played a down for the Pats).

2007	1	Brandon Meriweather	24	DB	2015	0	2	6	33	112												17	6.0	Miami (FL)
2007	4	Kareem Brown	127	DT	2007	0	0	0	0	1														Miami (FL)
2007	5	Clint Oldenburg	171	T	2007	0	0	0	0	2														Colorado St.
2007	6	Justin Rogers	180	LB	2009	0	0	0	2	32														SMU
2007	6	Mike Richardson	202	DB	2010	0	0	0	2	22														Notre Dame
2007	6	Justise Hairston	208	RB		0	0	0																Central Connecticut St.
2007	6	Corey Hilliard	209	T	2014	0	0	0	9	47														Oklahoma St.
2007	7	Oscar Lua	211	LB		0	0	0																USC
2007	7	Mike Elgin	247	G		0	0	0																Iowa
Year	Rnd	Player	Pick	Pos	To	AP1	PB	St	CarAV	G	Cmp	Att	Yds	TD	Int	Att	Yds	TD	Rec	Yds	TD	Int	Sk	College/Univ
2006	1	Laurence Maroney	21	RB	2010	0	0	0	26	49						618	2504	21	44	459	1			Minnesota
2006	2	Chad Jackson	36	WR	2008	0	0	0	2	18						4	22	0	14	171	3			Florida
2006	3	David Thomas	86	TE	2012	0	0	2	9	80									102	938	8			Texas
2006	4	Garrett Mills	106	FB	2010	0	0	0	1	16									9	110	0			Tulsa
2006	4	Stephen Gostkowski	118	K	2019	2	4	14	36	204														Memphis
2006	5	Ryan O'Callaghan	136	T	2010	0	0	1	12	51														California
2006	6	Jeremy Mincey	191	DE	2015	0	0	4	30	96												1	26.0	Florida
2006	6	Dan Stevenson	205	G		0	0	0																Notre Dame
2006	6	Le Kevin Smith	206	DT	2010	0	0	0	2	45													1.0	Nebraska
2006	7	Willie Andrews	229	DB	2007	0	0	0	3	30														Baylor

 

 

[Carolina Cajun]

I disagree, I do think hurney is a good college talent evaluator, that also doesnt mean hes a good gm, because he has sucked at financials for a while.  Fwiw, I think little will be alright, burns is a stud, daley has been more than expected and christian miller still has a lot of upside.