Tepper if you do snoop this board, your thoughts on hurney are wrong

[bobowilson]

3 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

You're only focused on a few jewels. You miss out on the fact that Hurney is an atrocious 2nd - 4th round drafter and that's where you have to build the meat of your roster.  Constantly swinging for the fences while whiffing left and right but being proud of a handful of homeruns is fool's gold.

No actually, he's an excellent 2-4th round drafter, and if you actually looked at other team's drafts, you would realize they have just as many busts in these rounds as Hurney

The difference is, they don't have nearly as many Hall of Famers or Pro Bowlers

And I'm only talking about the mid rounds here.

I've constantly been asking people to show me these mythical draft resumes for other general managers in the mid rounds that aren't filled with busts, and no one is ever daring enough to respond or show evidence of it.

[billionairemonk]

4 minutes ago, bobowilson said:

Still waiting to learn about these mythical general managers who have found more talent in the mid to late rounds than Hurney

I do think there are a handful, but it's less than 5

If you disagree, feel free to name them and then compare the guys they've found after the 1st to the list I provided on page 1

 

you're hard to follow, guy, but i get what you're saying now and i agree about hurney not being much worse in late rounds than most other GMs; and statistically it doesn't really matter.  my first post was a meme post about his first round success.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/1600451-are-late-round-draft-picks-the-key-to-success-in-the-nfl

So it's easy to magnify late-round success when a player turns into a superstar, but one would truly be going out on a limb if they said late-round draft picks were the key to a successful NFL franchise.

[pantherj]

I've never had a problem with Marty's drafting overall, and now Tepper has made his opinion know as well. I consider the matter closed. I'm not concerned at all with Marty's drafting.

[RumHam]

26 minutes ago, bobowilson said:

These guys were all acquired with first round picks

---

 

Steve Smith

Greg Olsen 

Kris Jenkins

Josh Norman

Ryan Kalil

Greg Hardy

Evan Mathis (multiple pro bowls)

Charles Johnson

 

Just go the fug away band wagon

[billionairemonk]

Just now, RumHam said:

Just go the fug away band wagon

^stop liking what i don't like

[bobowilson]

The Hurney Hysteria is all about confirmation bias, and demonstrates how powerful it is

They don't like his haircut, they don't like that he came from a non traditional journalism background.  He didn't have a background as a 'scout' like Gettleman, and doesn't carry the same braggadocious swagger.  

No matter how many great draft picks he produces, they can't get past their confirmation bias, and will continue to cling to the fact he drafted Armanti Edwards (at the 89th pick late in the third round).  Never mind the fact Armanti Edwards actually played 41 games in the NFL, which is about the exact median length of someone chosen 89th.

There's never any logic to these arguments, just people desperately trying to confirm beliefs they already hold.  The final desperation argument goes into his 'win loss record', ignoring the fact he constructed rosters that took a small market expansion team with a terrible owner to 2 separate Super Bowls (both of which we would have won if Fox and Rivera weren't such bad coaches).

 

[pantherclaw]

Tepper reading this forum, and making decisions based on what he reads here.....

That is a worse fear. 

[LinvilleGorge]

Just look at these four consecutive draft classes leading up to Hurney's firing...

2009 NFL Draft[edit]

Round #	Pick #	Overall pick #	Player	Position	College
2	11	43	Everette Brown	Defensive end	Florida State
2	27	59	Sherrod Martin	Safety	Troy
3	29	93	Corvey Irvin	Defensive tackle	Georgia
4	11	111	Mike Goodson	Running back	Texas A&M
4	28	128	Tony Fiammetta	Fullback	Syracuse
5	27	163	Duke Robinson	Tackle	Oklahoma
7	7	216	Captain Munnerlyn	Cornerback	South Carolina

2010 NFL Draft[edit]

Round #	Pick #	Overall pick #	Player	Position	College
2	16	48	Jimmy Clausen	Quarterback	Notre Dame
3	14	78	Brandon LaFell	Wide receiver	LSU
3	25	89	Armanti Edwards	Quarterback/Wide receiver	Appalachian State University
4	26	124	Eric Norwood	Linebacker	South Carolina
6	6	175	Greg Hardy	Defensive end	Mississippi
6	29	198	David Gettis	Wide receiver	Baylor
6	33	202	Jordan Pugh	Safety	Texas A&M
6	35	204	Tony Pike	Quarterback	Cincinnati
7	16	223	R.J. Stanford	Cornerback	Utah
7	42	249	Robert McClain	Cornerback	Connecticut

2011 NFL Draft[edit]

Round #	Pick #	Overall pick #	Player	Position	College
1	1	1	Cam Newton	Quarterback	Auburn
3	1	65	Terrell McClain	Defensive tackle	South Florida
3	33	97	Sione Fua	Defensive tackle	Stanford
4	1	98	Brandon Hogan	Cornerback	West Virginia
5	1	132	Kealoha Pilares	Wide receiver	Hawaii
6	1	166	Lawrence Wilson	Linebacker	Connecticut
6	38	203	Zachary Williams	Center	Washington State
7	41	244	Lee Ziemba	Tackle	Auburn

2012 NFL Draft[edit]

Round #	Pick #	Overall pick #	Player	Position	College
1	9	9	Luke Kuechly	Linebacker	Boston College
2	8	40	Amini Silatolu	Guard	Midwestern State
4	8	103	Frank Alexander	Defensive end	Oklahoma
4	9	104	Joe Adams	Wide receiver	Arkansas
5	8	143	Josh Norman	Cornerback	Coastal Carolina
6	37	207	Brad Nortman	Punter	Wisconsin
7	9	216	D.J. Campbell	Free safety	California

 

I'm counting seven quality players in four years of drafting and one of them was a punter, a position that routinely goes undrafted.

[billionairemonk]

41 minutes ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

Also dogs and bees can smell fear.

 

 

 

And the human head weighs 8 pounds.

low comedy indeed

[LinvilleGorge]

5 minutes ago, bobowilson said:

The Hurney Hysteria is all about confirmation bias, and demonstrates how powerful it is

They don't like his haircut, they don't like that he came from a non traditional journalism background.  He didn't have a background as a 'scout' like Gettleman, and doesn't carry the same braggadocious swagger.  

No matter how many great draft picks he produces, they can't get past their confirmation bias, and will continue to cling to the fact he drafted Armanti Edwards (at the 89th pick late in the third round).  Never mind the fact Armanti Edwards actually played 41 games in the NFL, which is about the exact median length of someone chosen 89th.

There's never any logic to these arguments, just people desperately trying to confirm beliefs they already hold.  The final desperation argument goes into his 'win loss record', ignoring the fact he constructed rosters that took a small market expansion team with a terrible owner to 2 separate Super Bowls (both of which we would have won if Fox and Rivera weren't such bad coaches).

 

They don't like that fact that he has failed to produce a consistently winning football team over the course of 13 seasons. They don't like the fact that he hasn't assembled a winning NFL roster since 2008. They don't like the fact that he has a losing overall career record.

Go home Marty, you're drunk. Which is what should've been said to him every single year as soon as he turned in the card for his 1st round pick.

[bobowilson]

It's funny, even in Hurney's worst drafts used to discredit him, he still chose multiple Hall of Famers and Pro Bowlers

Now here are two consecutive Patriots drafts (greatest franchise in sports history, in not only did they not come away with great players, they didn't even get any good depth.

Brandon Meriweather and a kicker are the only two players in these consecutive drafts who did anything for the Patriots.  The rest were busts.  You guys just don't understand the odds with drafts I guess.

ear	Rnd	Player	Pick	Pos	To	AP1	PB	St	CarAV	G	Cmp	Att	Yds	TD	Int	Att	Yds	TD	Rec	Yds	TD	Int	Sk	College/Univ
2007	1	Brandon Meriweather	24	DB	2015	0	2	6	33	112												17	6.0	Miami (FL)
2007	4	Kareem Brown	127	DT	2007	0	0	0	0	1														Miami (FL)
2007	5	Clint Oldenburg	171	T	2007	0	0	0	0	2														Colorado St.
2007	6	Justin Rogers	180	LB	2009	0	0	0	2	32														SMU
2007	6	Mike Richardson	202	DB	2010	0	0	0	2	22														Notre Dame
2007	6	Justise Hairston	208	RB		0	0	0																Central Connecticut St.
2007	6	Corey Hilliard	209	T	2014	0	0	0	9	47														Oklahoma St.
2007	7	Oscar Lua	211	LB		0	0	0																USC
2007	7	Mike Elgin	247	G		0	0	0																Iowa
Year	Rnd	Player	Pick	Pos	To	AP1	PB	St	CarAV	G	Cmp	Att	Yds	TD	Int	Att	Yds	TD	Rec	Yds	TD	Int	Sk	College/Univ
2006	1	Laurence Maroney	21	RB	2010	0	0	0	26	49						618	2504	21	44	459	1			Minnesota
2006	2	Chad Jackson	36	WR	2008	0	0	0	2	18						4	22	0	14	171	3			Florida
2006	3	David Thomas	86	TE	2012	0	0	2	9	80									102	938	8			Texas
2006	4	Garrett Mills	106	FB	2010	0	0	0	1	16									9	110	0			Tulsa
2006	4	Stephen Gostkowski	118	K	2019	2	4	14	36	204														Memphis
2006	5	Ryan O'Callaghan	136	T	2010	0	0	1	12	51														California
2006	6	Jeremy Mincey	191	DE	2015	0	0	4	30	96												1	26.0	Florida
2006	6	Dan Stevenson	205	G		0	0	0																Notre Dame
2006	6	Le Kevin Smith	206	DT	2010	0	0	0	2	45													1.0	Nebraska
2006	7	Willie Andrews	229	DB	2007	0	0	0	3	30														Baylor

[bobowilson]

 

8 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

They don't like that fact that he has failed to produce a consistently winning football team over the course of 13 seasons.

I wonder if Cam Newton's health and Dave Gettleman's inability to surround him with any protection had anything to do with this (or the fact Mike Shula was his offensive coordinator).

Hurney, quite easily, produced rosters that were good enough to consistently win (not just win, win Superbowls).  Everything else in our organization was a mess, from coaching, to Dave Gettleman's mediocre to terrible drafts, to Jerry Richardson's meddling

And despite all this, he constructed rosters that took us to the brink of winning 2 Super Bowls

[1of10Charnatives]

11 minutes ago, billionairemonk said:

low comedy indeed

The lowest.

[ncfan]

1. Those using Dennis Daley as an example,  are new.  Yes....he is the highest graded rookie.  But he's only played, what? 6 games.  Remember Bene Benwikere?  He was PFF's rookie leader for DBs, through all 16 games.

 

2.  Who Reallllly gets the credit for Norman?  Yes, Hurney did draft him.  But does Rivera and Sean McDermott get the credit here?   He had 2 good years here.  Then once gone and in another system, he's been trash.

 

3.  Pretty sure its know that Marty, while on the staff, didn't draft Smitty.