"Marty Hurney is one of the best recognizers of college talent in the nation. Period." A deeper dive

[Ricky Spanish]

1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

You seem hellbent on only focusing on the positives. Even Hurney's biggest detractors should admit he's made some great picks. The problem is the consistency of them. He simply didn't make enough good picks, enough good FA moves, and enough good roster decisions to consistently field a winning NFL roster. That's what a GM's job is - field winning NFL rosters. 

"Adam Dunn hits tons of Home runs guys, he's a GREAT hitter"

[LinvilleGorge]

4 minutes ago, bobowilson said:

There's a narrative that Hurney is trash outside of the 1st round, and we might as well forfeit the picks

I clearly demonstrate Marty Hurney acquired 2 Hall of Famers (Steve Smith, Olsen-trade), 5 Pro Bowlers (Jenkins, Norman, Hardy, Kalil, Mathis), and another guy that was a borderline pro bowler in Charles Johnson

Which is an incredibly impressive resume outside the 1st round, completely at odds with the lazy narrative people have invented.  Even if you only want to give him 70% credit or 50% credit for Steve Smith, it remains impressive.

 

Stop cherry picking and look at the whole picture. You have to build rosters with those mid-late round picks, not just occasionally hit a homerun. He was way too hit or miss.

[Mr. Scot]

4 minutes ago, bobowilson said:

There's a narrative that Hurney is trash outside of the 1st round, and we might as well forfeit the picks

I clearly demonstrate Marty Hurney acquired 2 Hall of Famers (Steve Smith, Olsen-trade), 5 Pro Bowlers (Jenkins, Norman, Hardy, Kalil, Mathis), and another guy that was a borderline pro bowler in Charles Johnson

Which is an incredibly impressive resume outside the 1st round, completely at odds with the lazy narrative people have invented.  Even if you only want to give him 70% credit or 50% credit for Steve Smith, it remains impressive.

Three winning seasons out of fourteen remains pathetic.

Nobody measures GM's by pro bowlers. You either build a winner or you go home.

Marty doesn't build winners.

[bobowilson]

1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

You seem hellbent on only focusing on the positives. Even Hurney's biggest detractors should admit he's made some great picks. The problem is the consistency of them. He simply didn't make enough good picks, enough good FA moves, and enough good roster decisions to consistently field a winning NFL roster. That's what a GM's job is - field winning NFL rosters. 

I'm a Panthers fan, and hellbent on not discarding one of the best recognizers of talent in the entire NFL because we have an irrational fanbase who can not think in analytical terms and put our franchise's history in context.  An irrational fanbase that fixates on Armanti Edwards and Jimmy Clausen without any awareness of how high the bust rate is for literally every manager in NFL history in the mid rounds

Thankfully, the guy worth 13 billion dollars as one of the greatest hedge fund managers over the past few decades agrees with me.

I agree he's mediocre to below average in free agency, but that's not what this discussion is about.  And I happen to think you win Superbowls through the draft (which is why this small market franchise has been to 2 Super Bowls with rosters that Hurney constructed, and would have won them both with better coaches)

[Snake]

29 minutes ago, bobowilson said:

Ignorant

In the mid to late rounds

Marty Hurney acquired 2 Hall of Famers (Steve Smith, Olsen), 5 Pro Bowlers (Jenkins, Norman, Hardy, Kalil, Mathis), and another guy that was a borderline pro bowler in Charles Johnson

if anyone else had that record, I can't imagine their irrational fan base would be crying about he's terrible outside the 1st round;  you can keep repeating the names of Clausen, Edwards, Gaulden, but it doesn't change the fact his bust rate in the mid rounds is no higher than any other general manager

And in recent years, Dennis Daley, Donte Jackson, Ian Thomas, Christian Miller, and Haynes look very promising

He's one of the 3 best drafters in the entire NFL, and not only in the 1st round

The names speak for themselves

Stopped reading after Smith. 

[Mr. Scot]

3 minutes ago, bobowilson said:

I'm a Panthers fan, and hellbent on not discarding one of the best recognizers of talent in the entire NFL because we have an irrational fanbase who can not think in analytical terms and put our franchise's history in context.  An irrational fanbase that fixates on Armanti Edwards and Jimmy Clausen without any awareness of how high the bust rate is for literally every manager in NFL history in the mid rounds

Thankfully, the guy worth 13 billion dollars as one of the greatest hedge fund managers over the past few decades agrees with me.

I agree he's mediocre to below average in free agency, but that's not what this discussion is about.  And I happen to think you win Superbowls through the draft (which is why this small market franchise has been to 2 Super Bowls with rosters that Hurney constructed, and would have won them both with better coaches)

You believe we win Super Bowls through the draft, and that Marty Hurney is a great drafter.

Yet the only time we sniffed a Super Bowl in the last ten years was three seasons after Marty Hurney was no longer in charge of drafting.

Since he's been put back in charge of drafting, we haven't even managed so much as a winning season.

Solid logic...

[Car123]

28 minutes ago, Cracka McNasty said:

Hurney didn't draft Smith, and this entire thing was only over the stretch of the past decade as this is a what have you done for me lately kind of league and we fired a coach who won the division 3 years in a row more recently than that. 

Tbf, he did scout Smith.

[bobowilson]

5 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Three winning seasons out of fourteen remains pathetic.

Nobody measures GM's by pro bowlers. You either build a winner or you go home.

Marty doesn't build winners.

2 Super Bowl appearances with Hurney constructed rosters (Gettleman added little to nothing on that 2015 team besides Turner and Short).

For an small market expansion team.

And we would have won both those Super Bowls if Fox and Rivera weren't such terrible coaches.

Hurney should not hire head coaches, but this discussion is about evaluating college talent.

 

[Untouchable]

These 1st round picks inside the top 10 aren't impressive.  Newton, Kuechly, Peppers, Gross...it's really just don't mess it up at the top of the draft.  Burns picks too cause the rest of the NFL can't be that dumb again for us to luck into a prospect like that at 16.  His best selection was probably Gamble even if he had to trade up a little to get him.  Maybe Beason for the haul he got for trading down but he also passed on Revis so probably not.

[bobowilson]

2 minutes ago, Untouchable said:

These 1st round picks inside the top 10 aren't impressive.  Newton, Kuechly, Peppers, Gross...it's really just don't mess it up at the top of the draft.  Burns picks too cause the rest of the NFL can't be that dumb again for us to luck into a prospect like that at 16.  His best selection was probably Gamble even if he had to trade up a little to get him.  Maybe Beason for the haul he got for trading down but he also passed on Revis so probably not.

Actually if you look at other GMs, even the 'good' ones, they have plenty of busts inside the top 10

Newton was an incredibly difficult and controversial choice, and 80% of the huddle didn't want to draft him and were saying he was the next JaMarcus Russell.

He literally just drafted DJ Moore at #24

DJ Moore is 22 years old and 4th in the entire NFL in receiving yards catching balls from an undrafted backup quarterback.

 

[Mr. Scot]

7 minutes ago, bobowilson said:

2 Super Bowl appearances with Hurney constructed rosters (Gettleman added little to nothing on that 2015 team besides Turner and Short).

For an small market expansion team.

And we would have won both those Super Bowls if Fox and Rivera weren't such terrible coaches.

Hurney should not hire head coaches, but this discussion is about evaluating college talent.

Okay, I can't even take you seriously anymore. This is absolutely delusional.

Heck, I was only half taking you seriously before but damn 

[thefuzz]

11 minutes ago, bobowilson said:

Actually if you look at other GMs, even the 'good' ones, they have plenty of busts inside the top 10

Newton was an incredibly difficult and controversial choice, and 80% of the huddle didn't want to draft him and were saying he was the next JaMarcus Russell.

He literally just drafted DJ Moore at #24

DJ Moore is 22 years old and 4th in the entire NFL in receiving yards catching balls from an undrafted backup quarterback.

 

Who are you?

Telling me you have less than 100 posts, most of them coming very recently, but you were a mainstay here in 2011 and were able to compile that 80% of the huddle didn't want to draft Cam?

[thefuzz]

11 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Okay, I can't even take you seriously anymore. This is absolutely delusional.

Heck, I was only half taking you seriously before but damn 

Agreed, some of his takes are pretty out there.  Trying to find out who he is so I can decide to continue to laugh, or put him on ignore.

[Shocker]

50 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Where'd KB Fan when you need her? 

I thought that Cookie chick was the only girl on here.  Ok then.