Hurney isn't going to be demoted or limited to college scouting

[bigskypanthersguy]

They'd better fix it this time and keep it fixed.

I'm quite tired of the mediocrity, inconsistency, and bad forethought.

[panthers55]

19 minutes ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

I think it’s entirely possible that while Tepper isn’t demoting Hurney he is bringing in more people on equal footing so that Hurney isn’t the only guy with the final word on personnel beyond himself. This would decfacto be a dilution of his power but would not be a demotion.

I also think that now that a businessman like Tepper has evaluated our FO and found it undermanned, it’s possible one of the reasons Hurney’s track record in the draft has been solid 1st rounders but underwhelming beyond that is that his staff lacked enough qualified bodies to do the thousands of man hours needed to evaluate prospects beyond the top 30 or so. If that’s the case, retaining Hurney but having others focus on other aspects of gm work like contracts and adding his skills to a larger overall team could be successful.

That is exactly what he wants to do which is what he did on the business side. He doesn't want a 1 man show and wants to bring in the long term successor to Hurney given at 63, Hurney won't be here longterm. Still I don't read anything limiting Hurney so much as giving him more help so Hurney can run the football side and not have to hassle with things like contracts which is more the business side  and what Beane did here before he left for Buffalo.

[Mr. Scot]

The thing about the assistant GM position is that it isn't just that. It also has the Vice President of Football Operations title attached to it and Tepper specifically stated that he wanted someone with a background in pro personnel.

Gee, wonder why he'd want that? 

[TheRumGone]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

The thing about the assistant GM position is that it isn't just that. It also has the Vice President of Football Operations title attached to it and Tepper specifically stated that he wanted someone with a background in pro personnel.

Gee, wonder why he'd want that? 

I’m wondering if this will be Colbert. But he’s up there in age as well. He made it sound like the assistant GM/VPFO would be someone to groom since Marty is “senior”. Colbert obviously doesn’t need to be groomed. 

Honestly I like the collaborative effort having 2/3/4 guys come together. More ideas, better outcomes if they can work well together. 

[stratocatter]

Maybe Marty gets bumped up with a title and compartmentalized responsibilities.

I badly wanted him fired starting from the Stewart/Otah draft as I recall, trading your next year first is just a do not ever do that thing for me. Or don't ever do it to take Otah when you could have traded back and passed on Stew and had Otah plus more instead of less, and had the pick the next year. I remember I was working and got a break and saw all of that.

I also thought, as things went on, that JR was pulling a lot of strings. Most people where I posted then did not think so. There was no way to know for sure.

As time has passed and we have seen Marty work post JR I think I was right. So a lot of the stuff he did that was really screwed up, he was told to do. Some of it, well you learn by your mistakes. Everyone makes them. The way I see it anyway.

But he has not done a bad job this time. None of these guys are perfect and for all Gettleman's "scout and film watching" cred, he was very inconsistent as a talent evaluator.

I'm way more concerned about having a bad pick in the coaching search, how good the scouts will be, stuff like that, than I am about Hurney. Plus I enjoy seeing all the anti Hurney crusaders blowing gaskets.

 

[panthers55]

12 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

You found a source that barely discusses the position at all and want to run with that? Okay.

And how does Tepper's "Marty Hurney is an incredible... Well, let's not give him that kind of compliment. He's a very good" comment from the original press conference fit into this narrative?

It actually points out the role of VP and the role Hurney will have going forward. Again this doesn't mean Tepper doesn't have bigger plans and won't replace Hurney at some point. But the fact that normally you fire the GM and let the new guy hire the coach and we are not doing that suggests at least for this year, Hurney is still the GM in charge. Seems he is more worried about a coaching change than he is a GM change at present. 

[panthers55]

6 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

The thing about the assistant GM position is that it isn't just that. It also has the Vice President of Football Operations title attached to it and Tepper specifically stated that he wanted someone with a background in pro personnel.

Gee, wonder why he'd want that? 

And he said that he wanted that guy to link the business and football side not take over the football side. And he actually didn't bring up the pro scouting issue but said what he did in response to a direct question. Hardly indicative that was a major issue or something driving the decision to hire the VP position.

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, TheRumGone said:

I’m wondering if this will be Colbert. But he’s up there in age as well. He made it sound like the assistant GM/VPFO would be someone to groom since Marty is “senior”. Colbert obviously doesn’t need to be groomed. 

Honestly I like the collaborative effort having 2/3/4 guys come together. More ideas, better outcomes if they can work well together. 

One of the things I find interesting about Colbert is not just that there's loads of speculation about him coming here, but that a good portion of it is coming out of Pittsburgh.

Honestly though, when I look at this particular role, I see Caserio more than Colbert. Caserio does indeed have a background in pro personnel. Also worth noting, this is Dan Morgan's background as well.

Everything I've read suggests that Tepper wants Marty to focus on the draft because that's where he feels his skill set lies. This new position would then handle the pro personnel side as well as business related things, which to me sounds like contract negotiations and salary cap management.

As to Colbert, the thing about him is that he's technically under contract through the draft. So unless Pittsburgh is inclined to let him go early (which I wouldn't expect) you can't have him until April.

I still think it's a good likelihood that he comes here though, but maybe not as a long-term GM. Perhaps more as a consultant to help rearrange the operations and then let the next guy take over (possibly Caserio).

 

[Mr. Scot]

6 minutes ago, panthers55 said:

It actually points out the role of VP and the role Hurney will have going forward. Again this doesn't mean Tepper doesn't have bigger plans and won't replace Hurney at some point. But the fact that normally you fire the GM and let the new guy hire the coach and we are not doing that suggests at least for this year, Hurney is still the GM in charge. Seems he is more worried about a coaching change than he is a GM change at present. 

Only if you stick with this as your sole source. 

If you look around in other places, not so much.

[panthers55]

6 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Only if you stick with this as your sole source. 

If you look around in other places, not so much.

I tend to believe the original source that Tepper controls given he did the interview and wants to control the content. While other pundits are likely more worried about clicks and speculation which may be true or not. Do we want to believe the insider source or hear it from Tepper himself. He has no reason to speulate while everyone else surely does.

[Mr. Scot]

3 minutes ago, panthers55 said:

I tend to believe the original source that Tepper controls given he did the interview and wants to control the content. While other pundits are likely more worried about clicks and speculation which may be true or not. Do we want to believe the insider source or hear it from Tepper himself. He has no reason to speulate while everyone else surely does.

I tend to check out numerous sources to make sure I get the full picture.

You've posted several times about this in the last 24 hours. You seem triggered at the idea that Marty Hurney might not retain his status as a full power GM 

[TheRumGone]

12 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

One of the things I find interesting about Colbert is not just that there's loads of speculation about him coming here, but that a good portion of it is coming out of Pittsburgh.

Honestly though, when I look at this particular role, I see Caserio more than Colbert. Caserio does indeed have a background in pro personnel. Also worth noting, this is Dan Morgan's background as well.

Everything I've read suggests that Tepper wants Marty to focus on the draft because that's where he feels his skill set lies. This new position would then handle the pro personnel side as well as business related things, which to me sounds like contract negotiations and salary cap management.

As to Colbert, the thing about him is that he's technically under contract through the draft. So unless Pittsburgh is inclined to let him go early (which I wouldn't expect) you can't have him until April.

I still think it's a good likelihood that he comes here though, but maybe not as a long-term GM. Perhaps more as a consultant to help rearrange the operations and then let the next guy take over (possibly Caserio).

 

Marty has whiffed big time on our FA signings so I’m good if we bring someone in who works on that side and Marty sticks to the draft while we groom a replacement. I’m pretty sure that’s the role DG had with the Giants. Pro personnel. 
 

I’m not gonna get angry he’s still around if he’s being checked with other smart people in the room and there is some collaboration.
 

Marty has drafted some elite talent even after round 1. Kalil, CJ, Hardy, Norman, Smitty, Jenkins, Mathis etc. But he can’t put a winning football team together overall consistently. And he’s does some mind-numbingly stupid draft trades and sometimes goes with his gut on draft day which turns out to be horrific. So if there are people in place where Marty isn’t the de facto number 1 decider I’m good with it.

i think that’s where Tepper’s head is at.

[Mr. Scot]

5 minutes ago, TheRumGone said:

Marty has whiffed big time on our FA signings so I’m good if we bring someone in who works on that side and Marty sticks to the draft while we groom a replacement. I’m pretty sure that’s the role DG had with the Giants. Pro personnel. 

I’m not gonna get angry he’s still around if he’s being checked with other smart people in the room and there is some collaboration.

Marty has drafted some elite talent even after round 1. Kalil, CJ, Hardy, Norman, Smitty, Jenkins, Mathis etc. But he can’t put a winning football team together overall consistently. And he’s don’t some mind-numbingly stupid draft trades and sometimes goes with his gut on draft day which turns out to be horrific. So if there are people in place where Marty isn’t the de facto number 1 decider I’m good with it.

You're correct. Gettleman was a pro personnel guy.

I'm also okay with the idea of confining Marty to the draft while handing a lot of the other GM duties over to the new guy. Tepper has spoken repeatedly about Marty as a drafter but refers to him as "not a bad" GM. That says a lot.

In that same vein, the press conference gaffe where he did the "let's not give him that kind of compliment" thing was hysterical. I'm still laughing at that.

Bottom line: Indications are pointing to his days as a full power GM being over shortly.

[raz]

yeah, marty's getting neutered