In hindsight, should Rivera/Hurney have been retained for the 2019 season.

[1of10Charnatives]

Just now, Mr. Scot said:

He still refuses to part ways with Jason Garrett though.

How bout them Cowboys?

[d-dave]

This was Rivera's last big chance here, and he can still make a strong impression with the end of the season and the P word.  

What's been so maddening about Rivera's tenure is we always have felt on the cusp of turning the corner.  Sure, we have been much more "in the conversation" than under Fox or other coaches.  But we seem to melt on national TV or important games.  We more often than not come out flat when we need to come out hot.  We'll look like world beaters, then get taken to the wood shed two weeks apart.  

Rivera is a good coach, and he will get snapped up in seconds once he's fired.  Finding someone who will actually be "better" is going to be hard, especially with the QB question up in the air.  Allen has made strides, but if you have a chance for the top rated QB in the draft, do you skip on them because of Allen and go for another area of need, or do you take the QB?

Hurney 2.0 has been so much better than the first go around.  I don't see a reason to can him unless you find someone else who is going to implement your vision better.  I think his time away really helped him gain perspective and become a better general manager.

[1of10Charnatives]

3 minutes ago, raz said:

i think a new coach is exciting.   it brings hope.   a different hope than the hope we can field a team significantly better than our coaching staff - knowing that's what its going to take with rivera

I saw a movie once called A New Hope.

[Mr. Scot]

1 minute ago, uncfan888 said:

From everything we know about Tepper, I doubt he'd tolerate us wallowing in mediocrity. He wants a winner. Hopefully that means he'll put the best GM and coach in place and get out of the way 

The drama surrounding Kevin Colbert's sudden "year to year" status (and possible power struggles with Mike Tomlin) combined with the knowledge that Tepper both knows and respects Colbert has tightened my tinfoil hat a little.

[MHS831]

The best football coaches are strategic motivators.  Ron is neither. 

 

[uncfan888]

Just now, Mr. Scot said:

The drama surrounding Kevin Colbert's sudden "year to year" status (and possible power struggles with Mike Tomlin) combined with the knowledge that Tepper both knows and respects Colbert has tightened my tinfoil hat a little.

Don't depress me this morning

[Mr. Scot]

1 minute ago, MHS831 said:

The best football coaches are strategic motivators.  Ron is neither. 

Oh, I think Rivera is a motivator for certain.

The problem is he pretty regularly gets outcoached.

Someone else on here has pointed out that Rivera is much more of a "just line our guys up and go at 'em" kind of guy than a master strategist. It's not that he isn't smart (he certainly). He just doesn't seem to be anywhere near as smart as a lot of the coaches he's facing.

[MHS831]

If you were a player, what coaches would you like to play for?

Me, you ask?

Just now, Mr. Scot said:

Oh, I think Rivera is a motivator for certain.

The problem is he pretty regularly gets outcoached.

Someone else on here has pointed out that Rivera is much more of a "just line our guys up and go at 'em" kind of guy than a master strategist. It's not that he isn't smart (he certainly). He just doesn't seem to be anywhere near as smart as a lot of the coaches he's facing.

Do you?  I question his motivational abilities.  You have 2 weeks to prepare for an undefeated team that would put you back in the NFC South hunt (because New Orleans plays SF too) and you come out looking like (spoiler alert) children who have just been told there is no Santa.  I see motivation at times, but I do not see an escalating pulse as the year progresses.  Maybe just me--but give me a Pete Carrol or Mike Tomlin.  As a player, I would risk my life for those guys.

[bigskypanthersguy]

Ron should be gone for multiple reasons, but a few trends in particular sink his ship, so to speak.

Multiple years in a row where he's been blown out.

The Foxian philosophy of, essentially, we're rams charging directly at you without any modification of philosophy or gameplan if the other team knows how to stop that, and much like his predecessor, Rivera teams seem to mostly rely on the other team beating themselves rather than scheming to beat the other team.

The handling of Newton's injuries and the backup qb situation.  Not all on Ron, but he should've insisted to Hurney that some decent vet stopgap of some kind should've been signed just in case Allen flamed out and Newton wasn't ready to go.  Clearly Cam wasn't, and this season has frankly never quite recovered.

Lastly, I understand Rivera was a linebacker, but I've never been a fan of the Tampa 2 style of defense, especially since qbs frequently attack its greatest weakness in the middle, especially on third downs or third and longs, and there's rarely if ever an adjustment there.

Much like Mr Scot, I was excited to see that we hired him at first, and he spoke a good game about attacking the opponent's weakness and such.

It seems, however, that this introductory speech was more fool's gold than an actually prosperous proposition, and I'm willing to cut our losses at this point.

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, MHS831 said:

If you were a player, what coaches would you like to play for?

Me, you ask?

Do you?  I question his motivational abilities.  You have 2 weeks to prepare for an undefeated team that would put you back in the NFC South hunt (because New Orleans plays SF too) and you come out looking like (spoiler alert) children who have just been told there is no Santa.  I see motivation at times, but I do not see an escalating pulse as the year progresses.  Maybe just me--but give me a Pete Carrol or Mike Tomlin.  As a player, I would risk my life for those guys.

I see him as a motivator in the sense that players do want to play for him.

But does he do a good job of preparing them to play? Eeeehhh, no.

[MHS831]

5 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Oh, I think Rivera is a motivator for certain.

The problem is he pretty regularly gets outcoached.

Someone else on here has pointed out that Rivera is much more of a "just line our guys up and go at 'em" kind of guy than a master strategist. It's not that he isn't smart (he certainly). He just doesn't seem to be anywhere near as smart as a lot of the coaches he's facing.

He gets outcoached a lot.

[MHS831]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

I see him as a motivator in the sense that players do want to play for him.

But does he do a good job of preparing them to play? Eeeehhh, no.

I agree.

[Mr. Scot]

2 minutes ago, bigskypanthersguy said:

Ron should be gone for multiple reasons, but a few trends in particular sink his ship, so to speak.

Multiple years in a row where he's been blown out.

The Foxian philosophy of, essentially, we're rams charging directly at you without any modification of philosophy or gameplan if the other team knows how to stop that, and much like his predecessor, Rivera teams seem to mostly rely on the other team beating themselves rather than scheming to beat the other team.

The handling of Newton's injuries and the backup qb situation.  Not all on Ron, but he should've insisted to Hurney that some decent vet stopgap of some kind should've been signed just in case Allen flamed out and Newton wasn't ready to go.  Clearly Cam wasn't, and this season has frankly never quite recovered.

Lastly, I understand Rivera was a linebacker, but I've never been a fan of the Tampa 2 style of defense, especially since qbs frequently attack its greatest weakness in the middle, especially on third downs or third and longs, and there's rarely if ever an adjustment there.

Much like Mr Scot, I was excited to see that we hired him at first, and he spoke a good game about attacking the opponent's weakness and such.

It seems, however, that this introductory speech was more fool's gold than an actually prosperous proposition, and I'm willing to cut our losses at this point.

I've challenged people before to go back and watch the video of that speech.

Tell me if that guy sounds anything like the guy we ultimately got.

[bigskypanthersguy]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

I've challenged people before to go back and watch the video of that speech.

Tell me if that guy sounds anything like the guy we ultimately got.

I've made no bones about being a defensive guy, but I really want an offensive HC this time, if only because we've played the defensive HC card so many times and imo it just hasn't really worked.  

And on the subject of defense...

I will never understand the inclination to leave yourself open to a power run offense with using a hybrid 3-4 this year when our division largely feeds off of a power-run offense.