The Offensive Line Situation

[MHS831]

Sorry folks--no Cam redundancies here.

There is something brewing here that is encouraging.   Suddenly, the holes we have on the offensive line seem to be shrinking.  Here is a position-by-position analysis:

1.  Center.  Paradis has had a rocky start by most intelligent observations; he was hired to replace Ryan Kalil, and of all the centers in the NFL, he probably has the most matching skill set.  Paradis is 30 years old and has two years remaining on his contract.  I think he will get better as he strengthens the leg and learns the Panther system better.  Here is the reason (from an August article) that best describes his reason for a slow start--coming off surgery, new system, and this:   “He’s got a combination of intelligence, strength and agility,” Van Roten said of the 6-foot-3, 300-pound Paradis. “That’s what it takes to play center, especially in this offense. We put a lot on our center to get up there and start the play call for the quarterbacks. If Cam wants to change it he can change it, but more often than not, we go with what the center calls."  I am fairly certain that Paradis was not starting play calls in Denver.    Paradis has 2 years left on his contract, so we should draft a center in the middle of the draft or so to groom and compete, but C as it is needs to be upgraded.  The point here is Paradis should continue to improve as he gets more comfortable and his leg gets stronger.   (Suggestion:  Draft a C  to groom and compete)

2. Left Guard.  I am pleased with Van Roten's development.  He is a good pulling guard and when there is an established LT beside him, he should get better in pass protection.  He is not a dominant run blocker, but he is one of the best pulling guards we have seen.  As a former OL coach in high school on a state championship team, I can tell you that the hardest block in football to teach and execute is the pulling seal block.  You have to cross the center, enter the hole and turn back to seal second-level pursuit by blocking him back inside (opposed to kicking an end or LB out).  If you make the block, the RB goes for a nice gain--but the block is rarely completed successfully.  Van Roten makes this block.  Like Paradis, he will be 30 in February, so he is in his prime (for a G). He is in a contract year, so expect him to be re-signed at a reasonable deal.  If he wants Norwell money, we could put Little or Daley there.

3. Right Guard.  Turner is a road grader  He is a solid to good RG and is paid like an elite RG.   Reguardless (ha!) He seems to be locked into the position through 2020.  However, in 2021, barring an extension (he will be only 28 at the time), he is set to earn $15,300,000.  I do not see that happening for a linemen who is not even the best OL we have.  We will be signing Moton then--the best OL we have.  Regardless, RG is set for another season beyond this one.

4. Left Tackle.  With Daley's immediate success at LT, there is reason for optimism.  My theory?  If Daley can hold down the LT job, I really think we have a starting G in Little.  I am guessing that Little's concussions are due to the fact that he tends to waist bend, and that puts your head out there like a Titleist on Tiger Wood's tee.  DEs club and rip.  It is the club that worries me.  At G, there is more waist bending because weight distribution is a bit different.   So if Daley takes the LT job, Little is great depth at T or G.  He could take the RG job in 2021 instead of paying Trai Turner $15m (cap hit still $5m) if we do not extend him.

5. Right Tackle.  Moton is very solid.  He is playing on a rookie contract through 2020, and should seek a big deal in 2021 (which is why I think we either extend the Turner deal to offset his $15m salary or let him walk).  Moton will be getting a deal in the $18m range (today;s dollars) so I doubt we are in position to spend $35m on the right side of the OL.  

Here is the big picture:  Paradis has been improving and should continue to return to form and learn the system.  We could have found a GEM in the draft, a LT from Columbia that has been solid against some tough talent.  (The Saints will be a good test for him).  Watch Paradis and Daley---their development over the next 8 games is key.  Personally, I think we need to find the future Center in this year's draft.  Is our future LT on our roster?  I think we have to think so at this point.  Van Roten is good at pulling, but he is not a complete stud in all aspects of the game.  He will be 30 next year--I think LG is a position we need to watch, but if Little sits next year, he should get reps at backup G and LT.

In the draft, I think we will take a WR and C--and maybe QB.

I think DT and S will be our priorities on defense.

Just thoughts because it has been SO fluid.

 

[Khyber53]

17 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

Sorry folks--no Cam redundancies here.

 

Just thoughts because it has been SO fluid.

 

That's some fine analysis of the O-line situation and I think I agree with you across the board. I do think Center is the next piece to look to upgrade, but Paradis does seem to be coming along quickly. And don't forget beyond the injury and team change, he's seen changes on the line beside him AND just importantly a change at QB. Maybe with time he'll be a Ryan Kalil-like fit here.

[Snake]

I like the optimistic approach but fact is they need to play better or we won't have any QBs. Allen got blasted more than once by the Titans. We he was protected he was throwing lazers looking like Rodgers but you can only do that if your line holds. Hopefully they have a strong day Sunday. 

[Jeremy Igo]

Good topic. 

 

I am worried for Little's long term prospects in this league. 

I am so thankful for Daley. Without him , whooo buddy this would be a really bad team. 

[Mr. Scot]

I've said in many places that I think the quick passing game is making our line look better than they really are.

The 49ers absolutely destroyed us in part because they had people who could cover for at least a few seconds.

I don't really believe Greg Little has a long-term future.

Daley has looked good in spots but looked worse than Matt Kalil ever did against the Niners.

Turner is decent but I don't think he's ever going to live up to his payday.

 

[Snake]

1 minute ago, Jeremy Igo said:

Good topic. 

 

I am worried for Little's long term prospects in this league. 

I am so thankful for Daley. Without him , whooo buddy this would be a really bad team. 

Head injuries are tough. Hopefully he can sit out and get his mind right. He has all the tools to be better than Daley. It also shows if you do invest draft picks into a position they do pan out. It's costly to keep investing but if any position is worthy of it it's LT. 

[Jon Snow]

1 minute ago, Jeremy Igo said:

Good topic. 

 

I am worried for Little's long term prospects in this league. 

I am so thankful for Daley. Without him , whooo buddy this would be a really bad team. 

This^.  Sometimes it's better to be lucky than good.  But Hurney's ledger still has too much red in it to keep him around.  The dude owes this team 7 full drafts of hits to break even. 

[Moo Daeng]

I feel like Turner has hit a plateau.  He's not been great. I'm not writing Little off just yet but his medical future is clearly in question. He looked pretty good while playing and I don't know how anyone can be down on the selection based on unforeseen concussions in the future.

[Snake]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

I've said in many places that I think the quick passing game is making our line look better than they really are.

The 49ers absolutely destroyed us in part because they had people who could cover for at least a few seconds.

I don't really believe Greg Little has a long-term future.

Daley has looked good in spots but looked worse than Matt Kalil ever did against the Niners.

 

To be fair the 49ers have been picking top 10 for years and have more talent than most of the league. One good season out of 10 does that. It's much harder to keep that consistency up when you're above average for that span. Not making excuses just pointing out that they are extremely talented because of previous failure. 

[Untouchable]

Right side of the line is solid.  Resign Moton.  Not opposed to finding a prospect to groom behind Turner because of his contract though.

Center needs a prospect to groom with Larsen being shot.  Probably day 2 of the draft.

LG - I'd stick Daley in there if Van Roten can't be retained on the cheap.

LT - Little is the best one on the roster but if there is concern about his head I'd draft another OT early.  If there isn't I'd still draft another one but can then make a case for waiting in the draft.

[raz]

has turner always been this fat?  there was a shot of him on tv after he screwed something up and i don't remember him being that fat

[Mr. Scot]

7 minutes ago, raz said:

has turner always been this fat?  there was a shot of him on tv after he screwed something up and i don't remember him being that fat

Not that I recall.

He's never exactly had washboard abs but I'm pretty sure I saw the same shot you did.

[Cuttinedge]

10 minutes ago, raz said:

has turner always been this fat?  there was a shot of him on tv after he screwed something up and i don't remember him being that fat

Contrary to what a lot will say he’s under performed since being paid. Was very little  drop off when he was out and DW filled in for him   

He’s paid like a elite RG and he’s average at best.  Paradis is another under performer big time. 

[panthers55]

1 hour ago, Jon Snow said:

This^.  Sometimes it's better to be lucky than good.  But Hurney's ledger still has too much red in it to keep him around.  The dude owes this team 7 full drafts of hits to break even. 

So Hurney drafting Daley was luck?  And Hurney has been back for 2 years and done well. What happened a decade ago with a different owner will have no impact on Tepper's decision about Hurney.  You might still be pissed but Tepper will base it on the now not ancient history.