Kyle Allen can’t become a franchise QB? Think again..

[mav1234]

Just now, Daddy_Uncle said:

He has the CMC factor creating long drives. Don't kid yourself. He makes way too many mistakes and when he isn't making mistakes we are saying he is very lucky for not making one. Put him on a really bad team and he looks like trash. A 100% healthy Cam and nobody is beating us

I agree on Cam, but it isn't just CMC.  Allen is extending drives, converting 1st downs... On our 90 yard TD drive in the 2nd quarter CMC had 3 carries for 7 yards and a reception for 3.  Allen was 7/7 that drive.

[Call Me James]

Just now, mav1234 said:

The "skillset" evaluation done on rookies is not binding...  it does not indicate potential all the time...  if it did, Brady never would have become what he is today.

I agree comparing Allen to some of the all time greats is a little ridiculous tho.

The skillset evaluation is fair.  But all of those guys had time to develop those skillset into the NFL game.

It took those guy around 3 seasons to become lock-in QBs for their teams and closer to 6 or 7 before they became the guys they are today. 

If Kyle Allen wants to be the QB of the future like the guys in this comparison he's going to need to show a lot of growth between now and the end of the season or Cam Newton retires. 

He's likely going to finish out the season as Cam doesn't look on track to be healthy. And then we can determine if he's going to look like Brady, Brees, Rodgers, Wilson, or Manning instead of Trubisky, Mayfield, Tennehill, Grossman, Vince Young. 

 

[mav1234]

3 minutes ago, TheRumGone said:

Man you are really fuging losing it. Why does the name Tom Brady come up every fuging thread about Allen. 
 

this fan base is straight up retarded. Time to go to reddit for football talk for good. 
 

peace

to be fair brady was mentioned in the OP :P lol .. he is also a classic example of a QB that does not have a canon for an arm but whose offense can push the ball deep.

he is also one of the greatest all time so any comparison to allen is fuging dumb.

[Auspanther]

One thing I’ve observed in the last two games of watch Allen, he really struggles to throw to the right . 

[mav1234]

1 minute ago, Call Me James said:

The skillset evaluation is fair.  But all of those guys had time to develop those skillset into the NFL game.

It took those guy around 3 seasons to become lock-in QBs for their teams and closer to 6 or 7 before they became the guys they are today. 

If Kyle Allen wants to be the QB of the future like the guys in this comparison he's going to need to show a lot of growth between now and the end of the season or Cam Newton retires. 

He's likely going to finish out the season as Cam doesn't look on track to be healthy. And then we can determine if he's going to look like Brady, Brees, Rodgers, Wilson, or Manning instead of Trubisky, Mayfield, Tennehill, Grossman, Vince Young. 

 

Oh for sure. I'm not crowning Allen. I am happy with how he is growing as a player and has made some plays and played within what the defenses give him.  

But it is worth noting that not only is Allen very young in number of games started, he had relatively little college experience too.  So he is a MUCH greater unknown IMO than some guys coming out.  

[CRA]

Just now, Auspanther said:

One thing I’ve observed in the last two games of watch Allen, he really struggles to throw to the right . 

A couple weeks ago people were saying he could only throw to his right 

[Call Me James]

Just now, mav1234 said:

Oh for sure. I'm not crowning Allen. I am happy with how he is growing as a player and has made some plays and played within what the defenses give him.  

But it is worth noting that not only is Allen very young in number of games started, he had relatively little college experience too.  So he is a MUCH greater unknown IMO than some guys coming out.  

Right. But Occam's razor. He doesn't have much experience because he's been unable to impress. 

He's probably in the same pedigree as DA. I enjoy what he's done since filling in for QB1 though. 

[t96]

41 minutes ago, mav1234 said:

anyway, a lot of those dudes were on downright atrocious teams. hard to compare.  Allen isn't being asked to do as much as they were and isn't needing to.

Brady wasn’t asked to do anything more than Allen has been. 

[KillerKat]

*Compares Allen to All-Pro Hall of Fame Quarterbacks.*

*Expects to be taken seriously*

*Hilarity ensues*

[CRA]

12 minutes ago, mav1234 said:

Tom Brady, as of last week, had the highest completion % of throws >20 yards... but, that's because there is more to a deep ball than just chucking it up as far as you can and letting someone run under it - which is why I believe Allen WILL get better in this area.  Or at least, I hope he does, since we will need him to for a playoff run.

Two different things. 

Tom Brady at this point in his career can’t make all the NFL throws.  That was the bar that was just laid out.  Brady proves you don’t have to be able to make all the textbooks throws to have success. Even at this current age he is a top tier QB.....and he can carve up defenses with a tailor made offense geared toward the throws he can make well. 

You don’t need to be able to make the throws a healthy Cam or Stafford or Rodgers can make to  have  success.   You need an offense that slows a QB to play to what he does well.  

Take a healthy Cam.  Carolina will include a ton of out routes that probably half of NFL QBs can’t make without getting picked. And if other QBs do take them they lob them out well before the WR even breaks outside.  

People are comically hard on Allen.  He has very little experience.  Cam has struggled at various points in his career with throws as have most QBs.  Allen needs time to grow.   He is 23 with 7 games under his belt

[GoPanthers123]

2 minutes ago, KillerKat said:

*Compares Allen to All-Pro Hall of Fame Quarterbacks.*

*Expects to be taken seriously*

*Hilarity ensues*

At the time they may not have looked that way, that is the point - don’t write off a rookie in a position that takes years to develop.   Hindsight and all. 

[1of10Charnatives]

6 minutes ago, KillerKat said:

*Compares Allen to All-Pro Hall of Fame Quarterbacks in their first full year of play*

*Expects people to understand the comparison and not take it out of context*

*Pointlessness ensues*

FIFY

[arbnranger]

29 minutes ago, mav1234 said:

Dude. I am a huge Allen supporter.  You are acting like a crazy homer.  It is okay he isn't the most perfect person ever to play QB.  We can comment on his play without being dicks, without being unreasonable, and with highlighting areas of need.  Many of us regularly point out his improvements.  That is good.  But he is far from perfect, and he is lacking in vertical passing attack.  

To illustrate, prior to this game, he had the lowest completion percentage of *any other QB* this season on passes>20 yards.  Given he went something like 2/7 this last game, that doesn't bode well for that changing.  Our WRs are not AMAZING, but he has serious deficiencies in his deep ball atm.  Hopefully that changes, since as I noted, he HAS connected on them before.

Totally agree ... 

And that’s not to say he won’t or can’t get better but as of right now... he ain’t hitting that long ball . 
 

 

 

[1of10Charnatives]

2 minutes ago, arbnranger said:

Totally agree ... 

And that’s not to say he won’t or can’t get better but as of right now... he ain’t hitting that long ball . 
 

 

 

He fixed the fumbling issue. I'm inclined to view hitting the long ball in the NFL is a bit more a challenge than not fumbling in the pocket, but at least his improvement provides some basis for hope his long ball can improve with time. I'm just glad that A) the coaching staff is willing to let him throw deep when it's not his strength and B) he was able to do so against the Titans without giving up any INT's on them. 2/7 ain't great, but just throwing it deep even if you don't connect has some value because it at least forces the db's to run with your receivers instead of just homing on CMC. Let's hope that percentage goes up as he gains reps and builds chemistry with his WR's.