Is Short a bust?

[grimesgoat]

Chart below shows DT production from all DTs taken in the first 3 rounds of the 2013 draft.  If Short is a bust, he's the best bust of the bunch...

 

Player	Draft #	Position	Pro Bowls	Games	Starts	Tackles	TFL	Sacks	QB Hits
S Richardson	13	DT	1	93	91	352	49	23.5	76
Star Lotulelei	14	DT	0	96	95	171	29	11.5	24
Sharrif Floyd	23	DT	0	44	24	95	13	9.5	22
Sylv Williams	28	NT	0	89	63	132	21	5.5	14
Kawann Short	44	DT	2	96	73	286	59	32.5	87
John Hankins	49	DT	0	86	74	235	28	12.0	36
Bennie Logan	67	NT/DT	0	89	63	233	36	7.0	17
John Jenkins	82	NT/DT	0	70	24	133	7	2.5	7
Jordan Hill	87	DT	0	31	1	50	11	7.0	15
Bran Williams	94	DT/NT	1	86	77	231	26	5.5	13

[thefuzz]

Dumbass take.

No, if you can get this type of production out of a 2nd round player.....woo wee, you struck the jackpot.

Marty kicking the can down the road was the dumbass mistake.

[Zaximus]

No way, dude was a beast, just been hurt.    Even Otah wasn't a bust, dude was a monster when healthy.

 

[grimesgoat]

3 hours ago, Snake said:

How much do you pay a DT who has been a ghost for 4 years? 

 

3 hours ago, Snake said:

But the contract is part of the performance. He has done nothing after it and got paid to be top 10. And for some of you to even put CJs name with his is disgraceful. CJ worked his butt off for his bloated contract and was regarding high sack counts till his twilight years. KK is 30 and has had two monster years. 

Short signed his extension before the 2017 season.  Below are Short's stats before and after his contract (not including the 2 games he played this year).  His numbers are virtually identical.

	Games	Sacks	Tackles	Avg T	TFL	Avg TFL	QB hits	Avg QBH
Bef Contract	64	22.0	191	3 per gm	39	.61 per gm	60	.94 per gm
Aft Contract	30	10.5	91	3 per gm	19	.63 per gm	24	.80 per gm

 

On a side note, I believe Short going to IR opens up around 11m in cap.  His cap hit this year is only 7.6m, meaning we should have some room to extend some of our guys this year if we want to.

[Toomers]

14 minutes ago, grimesgoat said:

 

Short signed his extension before the 2017 season.  Below are Short's stats before and after his contract (not including the 2 games he played this year).  His numbers are virtually identical.

	Games	Sacks	Tackles	Avg T	TFL	Avg TFL	QB hits	Avg QBH
Bef Contract	64	22.0	191	3 per gm	39	.61 per gm	60	.94 per gm
Aft Contract	30	10.5	91	3 per gm	19	.63 per gm	24	.80 per gm

 

On a side note, I believe Short going to IR opens up around 11m in cap.  His cap hit this year is only 7.6m, meaning we should have some room to extend some of our guys this year if we want to.

How does going on IR open up cap room? 

[grimesgoat]

24 minutes ago, Toomers said:

How does going on IR open up cap room? 

No clue.  OTC and Sportrac are both showing his cap number at 7 and change.  I was thinking it should be near 20.

You follow this pretty closely.  If annual salary is non-guaranteed, does it get paid if the player is on IR? Websites could be wrong - just don't know. 

[Toomers]

19 minutes ago, grimesgoat said:

No clue.  OTC and Sportrac are both showing his cap number at 7 and change.  I was thinking it should be near 20.

You follow this pretty closely.  If annual salary is non-guaranteed, does it get paid if the player is on IR? Websites could be wrong - just don't know. 

Hurney restructured his(and Trai’s) contract before the season. Moved about 10M down the road. IR doesn’t give you anything back. 

[grimesgoat]

10 minutes ago, Toomers said:

Hurney restructured his(and Trai’s) contract before the season. Moved about 10M down the road. IR doesn’t give you anything back. 

yep - see it now.  Didn't think it was right but missed the restructure column on the details page.  Thanks.

[Mr. Scot]

3 hours ago, TheMaulClaw said:

He's not a bust he just may be done.  The coaches don't assign busts a C on their chest.

Pretty much.

I've probably said it a dozen times before, but the single hardest thing about deciding what to offer a player isn't how good they are now, but trying to predict how long they're going to stay good.

It's one of the big reasons why the Panthers fell off such a steep cliff after the 96 season. Bill Polian had signed a bunch of older guys that he thought would be able to keep going for way longer than they actually did. The team got very old very fast, and it showed on the field.

There aren't that many Bruce Matthews, Jackie Slater type players in the league.

[Snake]

2 hours ago, Scum of the Turf said:

You're a bust

Your right, cause I busted in your mom last night. 

[Snake]

1 hour ago, Mr. Scot said:

Pretty much.

I've probably said it a dozen times before, but the single hardest thing about deciding what to offer a player isn't how good they are now, but trying to predict how long they're going to stay good.

It's one of the big reasons why the Panthers fell off such a steep cliff after the 96 season. Bill Polian had signed a bunch of older guys that he thought would be able to keep going for way longer than they actually did. The team got very old very fast, and it showed on the field.

There aren't that many Bruce Matthews, Jackie Slater type players in the league.

With the way the NFL moves today you are better off drafting well and moving on with high priced FAs. Of course hurndog is back to kicking the can down the road to what led us to about a decade of pain. 

[raz]

6 minutes ago, Snake said:

Your right, cause I busted in your mom last night. 

well that escalated quickly

[Snake]

Just now, raz said:

well that escalated quickly

[Forty-Eight]

On 10/1/2019 at 9:32 PM, Snake said:

Had a few good years but got paid and has been pretty much avg or hurt since. 

Heck yes he is. Short is so overrated here in the carolinas. Dude got paid living off Star’s plays and quit playing hard once he got paid. Short dropped into the 2nd round bc of lack of effort coming out of Pittsburgh. I always thought we should’ve paid Star and not Short.