Worst FO/Owner in Charlotte sports

[45catfan]

2 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

George Seifert was PRIOR to coming to the Panthers. His stint here basically outed him as a product of an extremely successful machine of a franchise.

Seifert got exposed just like Berry Switzer in Dallas and Jon Gruden with Tampa.  Both won Super Bowls with the players/system of their predecessors (Jimmy Johnson and Tony Dungey), but once those players were fazed out and/or they tried to install their systems, the wheels came off.  

[kungfoodude]

4 minutes ago, Stoney said:

Understood.

I'm talking about by Panthers and Bobnets fans as it relates to the time said coach was in Charlotte.

I did find one. Larry Brown.

[MechaZain]

26 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

I did find one. Larry Brown.

The fanbase was calling for his head in the end, it was a lot like Phil Jackson with the Knicks. I think the only reason his stint in Charlotte isn't considered a stain on him is because it was the end of an already legendary career and the national media wasn't paying close attention to the Bobcats. I'd talk to fans of other teams and they always just assumed the coaching wasn't the issue because we had Larry Brown. 

[kungfoodude]

44 minutes ago, MechaZain said:

The fanbase was calling for his head in the end, it was a lot like Phil Jackson with the Knicks. I think the only reason his stint in Charlotte isn't considered a stain on him is because it was the end of an already legendary career and the national media wasn't paying close attention to the Bobcats. I'd talk to fans of other teams and they always just assumed the coaching wasn't the issue because we had Larry Brown. 

Well he did lead us to our first playoff berth. I would agree that most of his reputation would be why he would be considered, not necessarily his time here. Pretty sure he still has the highest winning percentage for any Bobnets coach with more than a year. 

[CRA]

blows my mind how someone could not vote Jordan at this point.  

[CRA]

5 hours ago, 45catfan said:

People have a hard time differentiating MJ the player/person to MJ front office/owner.  MJ the person/player is absolutely superb, but as a front office guy/owner, he's horrible. There is no way as in ZERO someone can honestly say the Panthers were ran worse under Richardson than Jordan has ran the Hornets.  Even if you hate Richardson...and the hate runs really deep around here, the facts (wins, playoffs, division titles, Superbowl appearances, staying power, competitiveness and even loyalty of fan base etc...) say otherwise.  

well, MJ the player is the GOAT.  A true icon as well. 

as far as the person goes? Well, Jordan IMO was lucky he came up in the era he did.  He was largely protected.   In ways that don't exist today.   Jordan would have never achieved Jordan status if he came up today.  Still an all time great in terms of play.  But his vices and flaws would have been headline news.   And we would know a lot more about them.  

LeBron probably is the real GOAT if you take into account player/person IMO. 

[Jimmy]

Dude, you don't have enough options....

 

SHINN???

[kungfoodude]

11 hours ago, Stoney said:

If you look at some of the other Hornets related sites the MJ sycophants absolutely crucify Larry Brown, it really is ridiculous.  The Bobnets haven't hired many legitimate NBA executives during Jordan's reign of terror and the few they have hired, Larry Brown being one, have all been undermined from within.

Steve Clifford actually has the best win/loss record of any Bobnet coach and he coached 410 games vs. 192 for Larry Brown (2nd best winning % behind Cliff).  Cliff coached the squad to 2-of-3 playoff appearances in the history of the Bobnets as well as their only playoff wins ever (games, not a series). 

Both coaches were run off on rails with the full support of the foolish majority of "fans".

I think a lot of that has to do with the failure of the fans to see that MJ has always been the problem with the Bobnets. The coach is always easy to blame, as is the GM when you have the talent evaluation issues that the franchise has had. But people overlook that Jordan has almost always had complete control over personnel decisions for the franchise, even before he was a majority owner.

Now that he is the owner, the criticism is finally coming his way. All the pieces around him keep changing and he is a constant. Even the most blind of fans will see the truth eventually.

[rayzor]

On 6/30/2019 at 4:50 PM, AggieLean said:

Shinn is the worst sports owner this city has ever had. 

Johnson, Richardson, and Jordan aren’t much to write home about, either. Tepper doesn’t really have to do much to be the best. Hell, him building that practice bubble already has him in consideration as the best lol

Agreed. Shinn blew them all out if the water as far as how not to run a team. He ran it like a drunk 12 year old kid managing a fantasy basketball team. You get one good player with some value, trade him for three with no value and then expected people to fill the arena with a horrible team and no chance of winning and then moved the team to New Orleans because the city wouldn't give him an even bigger and emptier arena for him to march a horrible team into? Winner of the worst owner award right there.  

Johnson had no clue what he was doing. Good guy and very smart, but clueless when it came to running a pro sports team. Jordan seems like he's throwing darts at a dartboard blindfolded, and JR....ugh. Miserable human who tried to bully the world around him to fit some arcane paradigm where the world revolves around him and people like him (rich white boss MAN) and as we found out, that became more important to him than running a successful team. None of those three could produce consistent winners, but none were the weasel shinn was.

JR was slimy, but at least he kept the team here. Johnson was incompetent, but he brought a team back. Jordan is ???? but he brought the hornets back.

Shinn would have traded his mom away if he thought he could have gotten 2 baby sitters and a bag of pretzels for her. 

Tepper seems like a very decent human, something only Johnson could claim among the other owners, but he also seems committed to building and winning and has the smarts to pull it off. 

[djp14]

7 minutes ago, rayzor said:

Agreed. Shinn blew them all out if the water as far as how not to run a team. He ran it like a drunk 12 year old kid managing a fantasy basketball team. You get one good player with some value, trade him for three with no value and then expected people to fill the arena with a horrible team and no chance of winning and then moved the team to New Orleans because the city wouldn't give him an even bigger and emptier arena for him to march a horrible team into?

Talk about revisionist history. From 1992 until they moved (2002), they never had a losing record, and made the playoffs 7 times. Winning 4 playoff series. I'd gladly take more "horrible teams" like that.

Shinn probably still wins "worst owner" for moving the team, but it wasn't like they were putting a crap product on the floor.

[AggieLean]

Man, the Hornets were my first love. I’ll never forgive Shinn for moving the team. 

My fandom was done once the OG team left the city; I followed them to New Orleans. While, I do hope this current hornets team prospers, due to it being the hone state team, I’m not a fan. 

[Carl Spackler]

30 minutes ago, djp14 said:

Talk about revisionist history. From 1992 until they moved (2002), they never had a losing record, and made the playoffs 7 times. Winning 4 playoff series. I'd gladly take more "horrible teams" like that.

Shinn probably still wins "worst owner" for moving the team, but it wasn't like they were putting a crap product on the floor.

The only reasons it wasn't a crap product were the 1991 and 1992 lotteries gifting the franchise with Larry Johnson and Alonzo Mourning.

LJ and Zo, after a few trades that were either even or slight downgrades, became Jamal Mashburn and PJ Brown.

[djp14]

5 minutes ago, Carl Spackler said:

The only reasons it wasn't a crap product were the 1991 and 1992 lotteries gifting the franchise with Larry Johnson and Alonzo Mourning.

LJ and Zo, after a few trades that were either even or slight downgrades, became Jamal Mashburn and PJ Brown.

LJ and Zo were both gone by 1996. They still managed to make the playoffs 5 of the next 6 years.

The Shinn/Bob Bass Hornets weren't going to win championships, but they were decent teams. Better than what has been served up to us since 2004.

[Carl Spackler]

42 minutes ago, djp14 said:

LJ and Zo were both gone by 1996. They still managed to make the playoffs 5 of the next 6 years.

The Shinn/Bob Bass Hornets weren't going to win championships, but they were decent teams. Better than what has been served up to us since 2004.

I know, what I'm saying is the only reason the team had talent after 1996 was because of the haul it received for Zo and LJ in trades.

Zo became Glen Rice, who became Eddie Jones.

LJ became Anthony Mason, who became PJ Brown and Jamal Mashburn.