Bench: I’m going to keep Will Grier safe

[CRA]

11 minutes ago, GOOGLE JIM BOB COOTER said:

since 2011 the difference between the panthers and the browns has been cam newton. it's 0%. you are out of your damn mind if you think will fugin grier could step in and win a super bowl with this roster like we're the 2015 broncos.

nothing is constant.  Everything evolves.  

you would have said going into 2003 we had a 0% chance too.   We didn't almost win in 2003 because Jake was close to being Newton.  Different team, different time, different everything.  

We don't know what Grier will be.  Just like teams didn't know what Tom Brady would be.  That is why people like sports.   Who is the GOAT in Carolina? It ain't Cam.  It isn't some #1 overall draft pick.   It was some kid the entire league passed on and was told he would be a special teamer here.  No one was banking on that kid doing much when drafted.  Definately nothing in the ballpark in terms of what he actually did. 

We have a great QB in Cam.  One that has some health concerns.  Legit ones.  Not sure how anyone can get mad about adding some young talent behind him.   Unless you are primarily a Cam fan more than a Panther fan.  Then I get that. 

 

[Cpt slay a ho]

I think people underestimate what Grier would have to do to become a starter, barring injury the dude would have to perform like a top 5-10 qb. Injury would be the only time he sees the field other than the above scenario, and again he’d have to perform like a top 10 qb then to keep the front office from seeking a better replacement.

in other words Grier would have better luck climbing Mount Everest 

[Carl Spackler]

23 minutes ago, GOOGLE JIM BOB COOTER said:

99 picks passed before quarterback guru marty hurney pounced and you already got the man in your avi lmao

got you all up in your feelings now

[CRA]

3 minutes ago, Cpt slay a ho said:

I think people underestimate what Grier would have to do to become a starter, barring injury the dude would have to perform like a top 5-10 qb. Injury would be the only time he sees the field other than the above scenario, and again he’d have to perform like a top 10 qb then to keep the front office from seeking a better replacement.

in other words Grier would have better luck climbing Mount Everest 

I haven't read this thread. 

But Grier was drafted to be a backup to Cam Newton.  Pretty simple.  And the older Cam gets based on his style of play the more important it is to groom a capable backup. 

[Mr. Scot]

26 minutes ago, Carl Spackler said:

What is this "history" of which you speak? Conjecture based on third-round picks who aren't Will Grier, didn't go to the Panthers and don't have the team around him?

Taking a mighty swing there with the "he won't be good because he wasn't a first-round pick" logic

I mean, it's not like there are guys that were picked in the third round  who have won Super Bowls, right? 

And sure as hell nobody picked even lower than the third round has ever won one, much less a bunch of them.

Guys like that would never be up to that task. There'd be a 0% chance of that occurring.

 

[therealmjl]

33 minutes ago, GOOGLE JIM BOB COOTER said:

it's the most important position on the field because a great quarterback can hide a lot of flaws on your roster (cam has hidden tons of them) and because of how irreplaceable elite quarterbacks are. will grier is not prepared to step in and keep this team competitive and as history indicates he likely will never be prepared to do so. if anyone in the league thought that he could, he would have been picked in the top half of the first round. it is not up for debate. the league doesn't think grier is ready to contribute and he is blocked by an elite quarterback who, according to primary sources, is expected to recover from offseason surgery.

this team is fuged if it has to rely on a "solid backup" so why waste a valuable asset on one? and you would be willing to draft a backup higher than the 3rd? lol the grier-hive is real. 

yeah should definitely trust their judgment there. can't think of any other times they have significantly overvalued a quarterback in the draft.

this quarterback-starved league saw daniel jones become the 6th overall pick but let grier fall to 100 and the team that took him hopes that he doesn't play a single snap. talk about a vote of confidence!

when cam newton was picked you defended the guy who called him "disingenuous," said he had a "fake smile," and said he "lacks accountability and trustworthiness" and "sets a bad example"

now today you've lied about me. you accused me of "hoping to see him throw a bunch of interceptions" but couldn't link the post because it doesn't exist. you're the same person you were when you went to bat for nolan nawrocki. 

[CRA]

1 minute ago, GOOGLE JIM BOB COOTER said:

7-9, top 5 defense, won 4 of their last 5. yeah i'm taking that team over this current roster minus cam newton lol

yes it is what the hell. this fan base is the absolute worst jfc

im fine with solidifying his backup. im not fine with wasting a legit asset to do it; one that could have improved the chances of this team winning a super bowl. 

oh look another suggestion of ulterior motives. seems to me you and mrscot resort to that because you have nothing else.

Cam might end up the GOAT.  I have always said he would and should.  Luke presents a potential challenger as well  But that title is CURRENTLY is held by 89.  89 is still the GOAT in terms of wearing a Panther uniform.  Honestly, Cam has yet to leap Pep either. 

[Mr. Scot]

3 minutes ago, GOOGLE JIM BOB COOTER said:

you gonna link me to that post? you know i'm not going to stop reminding you, right? hell i'm still here reminding you of the time you defended the racist PFW guy

It's earlier in this thread.

And you pulling out the race stuff  tells me the reality is that you're actually frightened that Grier might be good because then he could be seen as a threat to Newton. Apparently frightened to the point that you're going off the rails about it.

CRA has you pegged.

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, GOOGLE JIM BOB COOTER said:

then it shouldn't be hard to find. link it.

i brought up your defense of nolan nawrocki's racist hit piece to demonstrate your own inconsistency on the matter. OP made a harmless joke. you said that person was "dumping on a player who just wants to come in and contribute" which stands in stark contract with your treatment of the man who famously wrote a racist hit piece on the eventual #1 overall pick cam newton.

No you brought that up because you're losing and that's what you resort to when that happens.

People can actually see through that, you know.

[Carl Spackler]

13 minutes ago, GOOGLE JIM BOB COOTER said:

lol i would hope you were just trolling because the alternative is just

yikes

I mean I DO really like Grier (his dad is super cool and they're from my hometown), but Cam is my favorite player of all time and that's who I want on the field

[therealmjl]

2 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

No you brought that up because you're losing and that's what you resort to when that happens.

People can actually see through that, you know.

Why is everything on here about “winning” or “losing”?

this is a message board dude. Not a competition. 

[Carl Spackler]

12 minutes ago, CRA said:

Cam might end up the GOAT.  I have always said he would and should.  Luke presents a potential challenger as well  But that title is CURRENTLY is held by 89.  89 is still the GOAT in terms of wearing a Panther uniform.  Honestly, Cam has yet to leap Pep either. 

Dude, Cam won MVP. That trumps anything anyone else here has ever done. Add in what he accomplished as a rookie and his guiding us to four playoff appearances and he's way above Pep

[MasterAwesome]

28 minutes ago, GOOGLE JIM BOB COOTER said:

i didn't say "backups are literally worthless" or that they have "negative value"

i said that using a 3rd round pick on a player that you hope never plays a down for your team is negative value because it quite clearly is. the gap between cam newton and "solid backup" is wider than any other player on this roster, bar none. no player on this team is harder to replace than cam and you could legitimately argue that no player in the nfl means more to his team than cam. it literally doesn't matter who is backup is because the end result is the same. 0% chance of winning a super bowl without him. value is in betting he stays healthy and adding another piece that can contribute to this roster. negative value is wasting your 3rd highest pick on a guy who will only play significant minutes if the season is already lost.

I know you didn’t explicitly say that, otherwise I wouldn’t be asking for clarification. You did heavily imply that, considering you were and seemingly still are assigning value based on best case scenario. You said best case scenario is that Grier doesn’t play at all...which means he was negative value.

I’m saying we can’t simply assign value based on best case scenarios, or else there would be zero need for depth. Based on your logic, it seems like any backup has zero value because we are better off without them playing.

The gap between a *healthy* Cam Newton and a solid backup is enormous, but we don’t know if his health is going to hold up. I’m not sure how you could see hobbled Cam last year and not even entertain the idea of having a contingency plan. The idea of throwing your hands up and saying “well, if our starting QB is injured then we’re screwed” is not how things work in the NFL. GMs have to account for the possibility of injury...that’s what depth is all about. Does Grier give us a better chance of winning games over an injured Cam or an UFA QB like Kyle Allen? Possibly...and THAT is what will ultimately determine his value.

[CRA]

8 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

It's earlier in this thread.

And you pulling out the race stuff  tells me the reality is that you're actually frightened that Grier might be good because then he could be seen as a threat to Newton. Apparently frightened to the point that you're going off the rails about it.

CRA has you pegged.

in fairness, I don't think has is scared Grier might be good.  I think he believes Grier is a waste of a pick.

I claimed he was more a Cam fan than a Panther fan.  Because at this point, it is negligent based on where Cam is to not invest in the talent behind him.   Which is smart.  We need to groom a guy that can have this team compete if Cam is down.  And you don't need a Cam clone for that.  Because the game plan changes and who does the heavy lifting on the O.   

Cam is great.  But there are probably other players that can use talent on this roster in ways he can't.  Doesn't make them better than Cam but there are ways to win games without Cam.  We got CMC, Moore, Samuel, etc.  Those are great pieces for a less diverse QB to work with.  Those are YAC machines.