Gettleman is getting absolutely destroyed by national media... STILL

[firefox1234]

When I see these threads I cant help but laugh when I think that Gman was a Shula away from bringing this team a Super Bowl and being a legend. What a alternate reality that would have been

[carpanfan96]

17 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Which always leads back to the question, why didn't Hurney benefit from them?

I've broken this down before but I'll do it one more time...

Ask somebody what they liked about Dave Gettleman's time here and the answer is pretty much always "winning'.  The Panthers won more consistently with Gettleman In charge than at any other period In team history. And as an aside, trying to credit that success to a guy who put together four straight losing seasons previous to that is pretty stupid, especially given that most of his best picks came because he put together one of the sh-ttiest teams in the league the year before.

Ask somebody what they like about Hurney and the answer sure as hell isn't "winning" because he never did that consistently (three winning seasons out of eleven, two of those early while the roster still had significant influence from Seifert and it just got worse the longer he was in charge). No, the most common answer is "he drafted my favorite player" or "I liked this pick or that pick". With him, the focus is on little details rather than the big picture, which it kind of has to be because the big picture sucked balls.

Flip over to the dislike side and what's the most common complaint about Gettleman: "He cut my favorite player" or some variation of that. The most common complaint about Hurney? Pretty obvious, don't you think? (and already alluded to above)

So the bottom line for me is that the people who prefer Gettleman do so for practical reasons while the people who prefer Hurney tend to do so for emotional ones. Those things tend to come out when the two of them are discussed. It's also painfully obvious when people resort to saying things like "oh, you just love Gettleman". No, I love winning, but that's the kind of response you'd expect from somebody who's thinking emotionally.

Football is not a game that benefits from emotional decisions.

As for why didn't Hurney benefit, I think Hurney being fired lit a fire under Rivera and I think Hurney failed on the fa front and since late picks hadn't been hitting the teams depth was poor and 2009-2010 cap descisions bit the team on the ass. 

Obviously some of that is on Richardson and staff, but mostly it's on Hurney. 

Taking emotions out of the equation and I think that Gettleman's roster was starting to age from the lack of draft picks over the time period he was in charge. (We drafted the fewest players during that window) The roster, especially on defense was getting to a point it had to be retooled. 

 

So I think no matter who was in charge last year the result would've been the same. Age doesn't sneak up on you in Football, it hits like a Mack truck and that's what happened last season. 

 

This year and possibly next year are very important seasons for Rivera and Hurney. Even with the extra time from making the move to a 3-4, if the team doesn't look improved and make strides they might not make it through this transition. 

[MasterAwesome]

40 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

He's benefitting from the previous guy yet still managing to fail.

Not that hard to figure out.

Benefiting how...? Let me ask you simply: whose roster was it last year? Gettleman’s or Hurney’s? If your answer is both, then they both get blame for last season’s failures. You can’t pick and choose.

Otherwise, does Hurney get the credit for Gettleman’s first season with the Panthers when we went 12-4 since he benefited from Hurney’s players? Your system of assigning blame and credit is such an ambiguous process of cherry-picking.

[Mr. Scot]

29 minutes ago, carpanfan96 said:

As for why didn't Hurney benefit, I think Hurney being fired lit a fire under Rivera and I think Hurney failed on the fa front and since late picks hadn't been hitting the teams depth was poor and 2009-2010 cap descisions bit the team on the ass. 

Obviously some of that is on Richardson and staff, but mostly it's on Hurney. 

Taking emotions out of the equation and I think that Gettleman's roster was starting to age from the lack of draft picks over the time period he was in charge. (We drafted the fewest players during that window) The roster, especially on defense was getting to a point it had to be retooled. 

So I think no matter who was in charge last year the result would've been the same. Age doesn't sneak up on you in Football, it hits like a Mack truck and that's what happened last season. 

This year and possibly next year are very important seasons for Rivera and Hurney. Even with the extra time from making the move to a 3-4, if the team doesn't look improved and make strides they might not make it through this transition. 

The thing to is that you have to look at their success as a combination. Rivera was a winning coach under Gettleman. Under Hurney, not so much.

Why? I'd say it's because Gettleman and Rivera had complementary strengths and weaknesses. Hurney and Rivera, on the other hand, seem to be weak in some of the same areas.

If we're talking personally, I think Rivera and Hurney are both really nice guys. Unfortunately, I also think neither of them is very good at their jobs, and the combination of the two of them looks a lot more ready to fail than to succeed.

As an aside, if the Giants succeed or fail it will be due to Gettleman and Shurmur as a combination, not just the two of them as individuals. That's how it works.

Hope I'm wrong about Hurney/Rivera, but we'll see.

[Mr. Scot]

6 minutes ago, MasterAwesome said:

Benefiting how...? Let me ask you simply: whose roster was it last year? Gettleman’s or Hurney’s? If your answer is both, then they both get blame for last season’s failures. You can’t pick and choose.

Otherwise, does Hurney get the credit for Gettleman’s first season with the Panthers when we went 12-4 since he benefited from Hurney’s players? Your system of assigning blame and credit is such an ambiguous process of cherry-picking.

Last year's roster was Hurney's, and I said so prior to the season. Did he benefit from leftover players? Sure, but that doesn't matter. All that ultimately matters is who's in control of putting the roster together. In 2017, that was Gettleman. But in 2018, it was Hurney.

Someone asked me before last year started to go on record as saying that the 2018 season belonged to Marty. They did so likely expecting it to be a successful one. I said yes not because I had any expectations, but because that's how it works.

Earlier this offseason, I asked people to go on record saying that this is Marty's roster regardless of whether it rises or falls. Nobody wanted to do it.

[WOW!!]

I don't know why you put up the bat signal..smh

All you're going to get out of this is biased opinion, contradiction, and flawed theories..

In the end we will see how GMan does when he has to find his own Franchise QB and build around that..

[Mr. Scot]

One other note on the emotional side of things...

The people who liked having Gettleman here pretty much never start threads about him these days. He's not part of the Panthers anymore, so why bother?

The Eternally Butthurt over Steve Smith / Josh Norman / Jon Beason / whomever else crowd however seems to scour sports media on a daily basis looking for some reason to talk about him.

With some guys, I'm not surprised. It's disappointing when it comes from guys like @Proudiddy though.

[frash.exe]

if only we had a fanbase that appreciated winning more games instead of poorly contrived and flawed scathing remarks about personnel decisions by pisshead journalists

i’m not saying gettleman should still be here, but we definitely wouldn’t have re-hired the guy whose mess gettleman spent years trying to clean up while making the team more competitive than it has ever been in any other time frame. 

the whole series of events that led to hurney being right back where he was before october 2012 was one of the most illogical, reality questioning periods i’ve seen as it pertains to the panthers, and i saw immediately how it was going to play out and all you folks lapped it up like spoonfed gimps and accepted it. i don’t like to throw the word “sheep” around, but when it comes to panther fans, you guys rly seem to like the idea of following some big time morons right off of a cliff face.

[Mr. Scot]

1 minute ago, frash.exe said:

if only we had a fanbase that appreciated winning more games instead of poorly contrived and flawed scathing remarks about personnel decisions by pisshead journalists

i’m not saying gettleman should still be here, but we definitely wouldn’t have re-hired the guy whose mess gettleman spent years trying to clean up while making the team more competitive than it has ever been in any other time frame. 

the whole series of events that led to hurney being right back where he was before october 2012 was one of the most illogical, reality questioning periods i’ve seen as it pertains to the panthers, and i saw immediately how it was going to play out and all you folks lapped it up like spoonfed gimps and accepted it. i don’t like to throw the word “sheep” around, but when it comes to panther fans, you guys rly seem to like the idea of following some big time morons right off of a cliff face.

No other team in the league thought Marty Hurney was worth hiring for even so much as a regional scout position.

But Jerry Richardson... Oy 

[MasterAwesome]

6 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Last year's roster was Hurney's, and I said so prior to the season.

Someone asked me before last year started to go on record as saying that the 2018 season belonged to Marty. They did so likely expecting it to be a successful one. I said yes not because I had any expectations, but because that's how it works.

Earlier this offseason, I asked people to go on record saying that this is Marty's roster regardless of whether it rises or falls. Nobody wanted to do it.

Okay fair enough, but then why are you throwing in little asides like “Hurney benefited from Gettleman’s players but still failed”? Isn’t this the same point people are making about Gettleman when they say he benefited from Hurney’s core during his success? But you seem to have issue with people when they say that.

Also, you are highly critical of Hurney but most of your criticisms revolve around his first stint with the Panthers. He justifiably deserves criticism for that, but do you not acknowledge that he seems to be making smarter moves this time around? I think many of us are cautiously optimistic about “Hurney 2.0”, but your mind seems to already be made up about him setting our franchise up for failure. You can point to last season’s record, but as many people have already stated, our downfall can largely be attributed to the deterioration of Cam’s shoulder...which you are on record as stating is a big concern. If our roster was capable enough to start 6-2, then I wouldn’t attribute poor roster management to our downfall...it appeared to be a combination of Cam’s shoulder plus inept defensive playcalling from our first-year defensive coordinator.

[GoobyPls]

Anyone who has the slightest bit of football knowledge knew Gettleman was a disaster. He’s a megalomaniac that’s stuck in his old ways, he thinks he’s the smartest guy in the room at all times when in reality he’s usually the most clueless.

[Mr. Scot]

1 minute ago, MasterAwesome said:

Okay fair enough, but then why are you throwing in little asides like “Hurney benefited from Gettleman’s players but still failed”? Isn’t this the same point people are making about Gettleman when they say he benefited from Hurney’s core during his success? But you seem to have issue with people when they say that.

Also, you are highly critical of Hurney but most of your criticisms revolve around his first stint with the Panthers. He justifiably deserves criticism for that, but do you not acknowledge that he seems to be making smarter moves this time around? I think many of us are cautiously optimistic about “Hurney 2.0”, but your mind seems to already be made up about him setting our franchise up for failure. You can point to last season’s record, but as many people have already stated, our downfall can largely be attributed to the deterioration of Cam’s shoulder...which you are on record as stating is a big concern. If our roster was capable enough to start 6-2, then I wouldn’t attribute poor roster management to our downfall...it appeared to be a combination of Cam’s shoulder plus inept defensive playcalling from our first-year defensive coordinator.

Gettleman did benefit from good players that Hurney left behind. He also was saddled with bad ones and a horrible cap situation. That's why crediting his success to Marty Hurney is stupid.

Marty Hurney likewise benefited from good players that Dave Gettleman left behind. He was also saddled with problems like Matt Kalil. But as before, any success or failure from 2018 forward is Hurney's alone.

The 2017 season is the one oddity because all of the offseason work was done by Gettleman. Crediting Hurney for that success would be like having one member of a wrestling tag team do all the work in a match, having the second guy tag in just to make the pin and then saying it was the second guy who won it.

Bottom Line: I want this team to win championships, and I don't trust the combination of Marty Hurney and Ron Rivera to do it.

It's not that complicated.

[Mr. Scot]

7 minutes ago, GoobyPls said:

Anyone who has the slightest bit of football knowledge knew Gettleman was a disaster. He’s a megalomaniac that’s stuck in his old ways, he thinks he’s the smartest guy in the room at all times when in reality he’s usually the most clueless.

I've seen your posts. You don't qualify as somebody who "has the slightest bit of football knowledge"... or any of it.

Heck, we know from past experience that you don't even watch the games.

[AggieLean]

Im just glad he’s gone, and if we suffer another losing season, I’ll be glad to see Hurney go.

I just want consistency, and neither have shown the ability to build teams that are consistent