Avengers: Endgame discussion with spoilers

[Squirrel]

Figured best to have a separate thread with spoilers hate ruining the movie for people that havent seen it.  So you are forewarned spoilers below. 

 

 

 

[Squirrel]

My main gripe is the first hour was pure trash except Thanos getting wacked. The rest was poor us we got our asses kicked.  Then the only way to solve it is to time travel back God time traveling is so overused. .  

 

Other big issue I had was they telegraphed everything from Stark dying to Rodgers staying back I  time.  The only truly shocking incident was black widows death which was pretty lame. 

As Far as plot issues.  Once Thanos came to the future the snap would never would have taken place.  

 

Then there is the final fight scene. Really every single avenger woman is fighting in the exact same area at one time.  Give me a break that was just lame as hell. 

[lightsout]

I thought the first hour was good build up. See where everybody is and how they are coping. They did telegraph a lot of bigger plot points but I could've guessed those two years ago as well. 

 

I loved it. They showed all the women 1) as service to that audience and 2) to show that they were active and capable, and show that they fared no better (in fact, I'd argue noticeably worse) than the men. They didn't have Captain Marvel swoop in and just destroy all on her own. That was a good thing. It showed her to be no match for a prepared and angry Thanos. 

 

Tony's sacrifice was nice. It was the perfect way to close out his decade long character arc. 

 

Cap staying was obvious the second they showed him going back. It wasn't that it was supposed to be a shock, it is that it's supposed to be a feel good ending for Cap.

 

Movie was great. 10/10

[lightsout]

And I read in the other thread saying it isn't a great standalone Marvel movie....well duh. It's not meant to be. It's literally a direct continuation of IW. If you watch IW and immediately start Endgame, it's practically seamless. 

 

So sure, you can't watch Endgame on its own if you haven't seen any/most Marvel movies but that isn't it's purpose. It is supposed to wrap that story because one movie would have been at least 4.5 hours long. They added an extra thirty minutes for the 10 minutes at the end and the 20 in the beginning. You COULD remove either and have a fine movie but the emotional connection to characters is part of the Marvel movie experience.

[Cary Kollins]

9 hours ago, lightsout said:

They didn't have Captain Marvel swoop in and just destroy all on her own. That was a good thing. It showed her to be no match for a prepared and angry Thanos. 

 

 

It seemed fairly even until thanos hit her with the power stone blast.

[Dex]

The movie put me through all possible emotions. Scanning YouTube now for audience reactions to revisit the feels.

[Dex]

The reaction to RDJ was similar in my theater. I went at 11am Friday and it was mostly adults like me which makes it that much more amazing. We were all little kids in that moment.

 

 

[Cary Kollins]

10 hours ago, Squirrel said:

As Far as plot issues.  Once Thanos came to the future the snap would never would have taken place.  

 

 

Pretty sure the rules for time travel in this movie don’t work like that. From what sorcerer supreme lady said, messing with the time periods creates new timelines, it doesn’t erase anything. So 2014 Thanos coming into 2023 doesn’t erase what happened in the current 2023 timeline. It just alters what happened in the 2014 timeline since Thanos peaced out of that. 

The biggest plot hole to me that I’m sure can be explained somehow is how Old Cap went through his life and still was able to meet the guys on the park bench at the end.

[Dex]

Also what happens now that Loki has the tesseract in the earlier timeline?

[MillionDollarCam]

I mean if you have read into their (the actors) contract details as well as their comments and the new shows coming out on Disney Plus, it’s easy to see who was going to be killed off and who was going to stay. Downey and Evans are definitely done so they were the obvious choices to kill off.

The only question I have is, how is Black Widows death going to work with her new movie? Is it going to be a prequel or are we going to have to use time travel again? The whole time travel thing is overused and has a more Star Trek feel than anything but that was obviously going to be the method used based of the credits of Antman and the Wasp 2.

The movie is what it is, a good way to say thank you to all the fans that supported MCU throughout the years.

[MillionDollarCam]

12 minutes ago, Dex said:

Also what happens now that Loki has the tesseract in the earlier timeline?

There’s rumors that his tv show on Disney Plus will adress that.

[Cary Kollins]

I wonder if this alternate timeline stuff is how they’re going to incorporate X-Men.

I read an interview with the writers who basically said “good luck lol” to future MCU writers in how they’ll have to deal with the events of Endgame. 

[Zaximus]

12 hours ago, Squirrel said:

My main gripe is the first hour was pure trash except Thanos getting wacked. The rest was poor us we got our asses kicked.  Then the only way to solve it is to time travel back God time traveling is so overused. .  

 

Other big issue I had was they telegraphed everything from Stark dying to Rodgers staying back I  time.  The only truly shocking incident was black widows death which was pretty lame. 

As Far as plot issues.  Once Thanos came to the future the snap would never would have taken place.  

 

Then there is the final fight scene. Really every single avenger woman is fighting in the exact same area at one time.  Give me a break that was just lame as hell. 

They needed the build up to put the characters in the needed state of mind.    It's important to realize it's been 5 years and they have been mourning/feeling guilt, etc. for that long.    If you jump right in when the last movie was a year ago (our time) it doesn't quite have the right build up.    And if they go right into it, you know people will whine that they figured out the science too fast.       Everyone knew time travel would be used so I don't know why anyone is surprised.    I knew right after the last Ant-Man movie that they would use that science to "fix" things.        The Thanos thing someone mentions later on this thread, but they pretty much explained it when Hulk was talking to Dr. Strange's mentor.       The woman thing was cheesy, but it was 20 seconds and if some little girl gets excited over it then I don't really care.

10 hours ago, lightsout said:

I loved it. They showed all the women 1) as service to that audience and 2) to show that they were active and capable, and show that they fared no better (in fact, I'd argue noticeably worse) than the men. They didn't have Captain Marvel swoop in and just destroy all on her own. That was a good thing. It showed her to be no match for a prepared and angry Thanos. 

 

Cap staying was obvious the second they showed him going back. It wasn't that it was supposed to be a shock, it is that it's supposed to be a feel good ending for Cap.

Yup Thanos is a super villain without the stones.     In fact, he's sometimes been good as well.   He would give almost everyone a challenge without them minus a few other entities in the comics.    And the Cap thing was built up for a long time.     He could never move on from Peggy and those "what if" ideas.     Also at the start of Endgame you could tell he was regretting not having more of a life for those years.    It made sense to me.     And a lot of us knew that the mantle was going to be handed off to Sam.

7 hours ago, lightsout said:

And I read in the other thread saying it isn't a great standalone Marvel movie....well duh. It's not meant to be. It's literally a direct continuation of IW. If you watch IW and immediately start Endgame, it's practically seamless. 

I compare it to the last 2 Harry Potter movies, where they split it up.    If you watch those two movies in sequence it's an amazing giant movie.

1 hour ago, Cary Kollins said:

 

It seemed fairly even until thanos hit her with the power stone blast.

Yeah, like above, Thanos is a beast.     Even without the stones he could have taken Captain Marvel, especially if he wasn't solo fighting off like 20 other people.

1 hour ago, Cary Kollins said:

 

Pretty sure the rules for time travel in this movie don’t work like that. From what sorcerer supreme lady said, messing with the time periods creates new timelines, it doesn’t erase anything. So 2014 Thanos coming into 2023 doesn’t erase what happened in the current 2023 timeline. It just alters what happened in the 2014 timeline since Thanos peaced out of that. 

The biggest plot hole to me that I’m sure can be explained somehow is how Old Cap went through his life and still was able to meet the guys on the park bench at the end.

I think Cap was able to come back because he kept the wrist device all those years that I assume "tethers" him to this reality.     I think it's possible that Peggy died some time back and he came home to see his friends and may just stay in that reality.

1 hour ago, MillionDollarCam said:

The only question I have is, how is Black Widows death going to work with her new movie? Is it going to be a prequel or are we going to have to use time travel again? The whole time travel thing is overused and has a more Star Trek feel than anything but that was obviously going to be the method used based of the credits of Antman and the Wasp 2.

I think it'll be a prequel.    They have mentioned a lot of stuff about her time before we met her (the "this isn't no Buddapest") type comments from Hawkeye etc.      There's a whole backstory there so it could be interesting.    I hope it's a Winter Solder type movie with mostly spy-ish stuff but I'm not sure they'll be able to elevate it past a regular action movie.

1 hour ago, MillionDollarCam said:

There’s rumors that his tv show on Disney Plus will adress that.

Yeah that will be interesting is what "type" of Loki we will get.     This was before he got more "good" in the later movies, etc.

57 minutes ago, Cary Kollins said:

I wonder if this alternate timeline stuff is how they’re going to incorporate X-Men.

I read an interview with the writers who basically said “good luck lol” to future MCU writers in how they’ll have to deal with the events of Endgame. 

Yeah good question but I seriously think they should keep X-Men separate, or at least in a different universe.     I think it would be too cluttered and X-Men seem to work better in a more darker world.     

 

Overall, we're talking a movie that is a culmination of like 22 movies and I'm not sure they could have done it any better.

[CarolinaNCSU]

Honestly the biggest thing to me, was just the fact that they stuck the landing.  All the hype, and they still put out (to me) one of the best Marvel movies ever? All of the feels, teared up during it, and it was a nice bow on a decade of movies. 

Yeah, there were some telegraphed things.  But the comics already essentially telegraph everything.  Not to mention, these are still comic book movies, not Best Picture nominees (most of the time). Fan service is going to happen, and I mean if we're seriously going to complain about 15 seconds of all the female characters teaming up?  fug outta here.  You might not get it, but guarantee my little niece is going to watch that part and get chills. 

Direction they go from here will be interesting.  Captain Marvel, Spider-Man, Black Panther, Doctor Strange, etc. will all be enough to carry another huge movie, but do Hulk, Thor, Hawkeye, etc. get pushed out/into the background?  Which new characters are coming?  If not the X-Men, I assume Fantastic Four might be nice to intro and help their image. Can't imagine Deadpool comes in.  So do they go more for the space/celestial movies, or pivot and find new Earth characters?