If the Panthers trade up in the first round of the draft....

[carpanfan96]

Cam playing or not isn't going to accept his team rolling over and loosing on purpose. They won the game, get over it. Trade up, stand Pat, trade down. Doesn't matter at all. That game and loosing it on purpose for draft spots is the dumbest thing I've ever heard from a fan base in my entire life. 

[Manther]

People on here preaching about the win mentality do not understand the concept of strategic retreat.  They will also be the same ones gracing all the crap we see in preseason saying the game doesn't matter and we need to see what practice squad can do.  We had a lot more benchers then we used in that game.  NO's leadership just wanted the loss more.

[carpanfan96]

1 minute ago, Manther said:

The same people on here preaching about the win mentality do not understand the concept of strategic retreat.  They will also be the same ones gracing all the crap we see in preseason saying the game doesn't matter and we need to see what practice squad can do.  We had a lot more benchers then we used in that game.  NO's leadership just wanted the loss more.

Players don't want to retreat and not win, they want to win and make the playoffs. There is no concept of strategic retreat when the difference between 8-8 and 7-9 or 6-10 can be the difference of having a job or not tomorrow. Former players that are coaches are going to have the same type of mentality as well. 

[LinvilleGorge]

3 hours ago, Lumps said:

 

lol if you think teams never tank games no matter what. that's irony and ignorance

Yep. The Bucs were leading the Saints at half in week 17 in 2014and benched pretty much all of their starters at half to go on and lose and secure the #1 overall pick.

[Manther]

21 minutes ago, carpanfan96 said:

Players don't want to retreat and not win, they want to win and make the playoffs. There is no concept of strategic retreat when the difference between 8-8 and 7-9 or 6-10 can be the difference of having a job or not tomorrow. Former players that are coaches are going to have the same type of mentality as well. 

Correct, so if you want a loss, you play your worst players so they  develop and experiment with the playbook, you know, like we do in preseason...and everyone on here posts about its ok the game doesn't matter...blah blah blah. 

 

We did a little of each.  Saints did more.  I'm not faulting players.  I'm faulting leadership.

[carpanfan96]

Just now, LinvilleGorge said:

Yep. The Bucs were leading the Saints at half in week 17 in 2014and benched pretty much all of their starters at half to go on and lose and secure the #1 overall pick.

Yep I remember that, bet you the players were pissed. I would have been. 

[Manther]

1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Yep. The Bucs were leading the Saints at half in week 17 in 2014and benched pretty much all of their starters at half to go on and lose and secure the #1 overall pick.

but but but the Bucs suck..........

[LinvilleGorge]

Just now, carpanfan96 said:

Yep I remember that, bet you the players were pissed. I would have been. 

Maybe. 

I do know one thing though, the Saints sure do like tanking meaningless Week 17 games to sully the draft dreams of division rivals. Honestly, it's smart.

[LinvilleGorge]

1 minute ago, Manther said:

but but but the Bucs suck..........

I wasn't saying that tanking was always successful. They got their pick and their QB, it just hasn't really worked out for them.

[carpanfan96]

11 minutes ago, Manther said:

Correct, so if want a loss, you play your worst players so they  develop and experiment with the playbook, you know, like we do in preseason...and everyone on here posts about its ok the game doesn't matter...blah blah blah. 

 

We did a little of each.  Saints did more.  I'm not faulting players.  I'm faulting leadership.

That was my point

 

Rivera is a former player who puts a ton of former players on his staff. Young coaches too. 

Wharton, Crotchery, Blackburn, Jacobs, Brown are all younger coaches who are recent former players. They aren't going to accept the coach or front office telling them to loose a game. Rivera also wouldn't put up with that mess, they are gonna go out and try to win every single game for better or worse. 

 

It's why players love playing for Rivera, they know he isn't gonna put up with any B.S and he's going to do everything he can to win for you as a player and give you a chance to succeed. 

 

It's also a part of his biggest weakness as a coach as well, but you take the good with the bad when you have a top ten NFL coach. Which Rivera most certainly is. 

[Manther]

1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I wasn't saying that tanking was always successful. They got their pick and their QB, it just hasn't really worked out for them.

Its all good.  Look we all would have preferred RR got his head out of his ass after the Steelers game and we wouldn't be talking pre-seasoning a game for 10 draft spots.  He has lost his drive and his focus and cares most about his relationship with his players.  

The only thing that stopped us from having the greatest collapse in NFL history is because the Saints wanted the loss more.

 

[Manther]

1 minute ago, carpanfan96 said:

That was my point

 

Rivera is a former player who puts a ton of former players on his staff. Young coaches too. 

Wharton, Crotchery, Blackburn, Jacobs, Brown are all younger coaches who are recent former players. They aren't going to accept the coach or front office telling them to loose a game. Rivera also wouldn't out up with that mess, they are gonna go out and try to win every single game for better or worse. 

 

It's why players love playing for Rivera, they know he isn't gonna out up with any B.S and he's going to do everything he can to win for you as a player and give you a chance to succeed. 

Yes we have player's coach.  I'd rather we have rings.

[LinvilleGorge]

For a "player's coach", Rivera sure isn't shy about transferring all of the blame to his players for losses. Missed opportunities, right?

[carpanfan96]

1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

For a "player's coach", Rivera sure isn't shy about transferring all of the blame to his players for losses. Missed opportunities, right?

Most players don't want to be coddled and the coach to take blame, some are different though.

When you have a QB like Cam Newton, Rivera is the perfect coach.

They are both gonna hold players accountable for mistakes but in different ways. Rivera is a players coach but he isn't the type to coddle and he's gonna call it like he sees it as a former player. It's why the team plays as hard if not harder for him in December as they do in September.