Jourdan Rodrigue does not believe we are getting rid of Tory Smith

[top dawg]

2 minutes ago, Toomers said:

What is it? Because isn’t a reason. What money are you planning on using on FA. Cutting him a month from now may do no good. Draft time? Too late? TC? Screw this year? We didn’t need a OL. 

  I, and many others, have shown numerical reasons why. Age, injury, decline, WORST hands in NFL. That’s part of his body of work and much more relevant than something he did 5 years ago. Or 2. 

  You have stuck with “Because”....

well done

Whatever. I'm sure that if they need the money now, or at some point in the furlture, it will be right there in the bank, and they will use it. Not one of you have given one reason as to why Smith needs to be cut right now, and you know why? Because there isn't a reason.

[LinvilleGorge]

2 minutes ago, top dawg said:

Whatever. I'm sure that if they need the money now, or at some point in the furlture, it will be right there in the bank, and they will use it. Not one of you have given one reason as to why Smith needs to be cut right now, and you know why? Because there isn't a reason.

You've just ignored every reason given. That doesn't mean multiple reasons haven't been provided to you. He's not worth $5M. None of that $5M is guaranteed. Nothing is going to change to make him worth $5M. That's it, that's all. That's the only reason well ran franchises need to make easy calls like this one. You think Torrey Smith would still be on the roster of the Pats or the Steelers when they could clear up $5M by jettisoning him? Yeah, not a chance. 

[top dawg]

1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

You've just ignored every reason given. That doesn't mean multiple reasons haven't been provided to you. He's not worth $5M. None of that $5M is guaranteed. Nothing is going to change to make him worth $5M. That's it, that's all. That's the only reason well ran franchises need to make easy calls like this one. You think Torrey Smith would still be on the roster of the Pats or the Steelers when they could clear up $5M by jettisoning him? Yeah, not a chance. 

And just because you say he is not worth 5 mil doesn't make it so. Hell, with a healthy Cam, he just could have a resurgence. Hell, if Moore or Samuel get hurt, I'd rather have Smith than any old bloke you can pull of the damned couch, or lose draft capital because we're trying to scramble. You just don't know what's going to happen or what the market is even going to look like. There is absolutely no reason to cut him until you need to do so. Period!

[LinvilleGorge]

 

6 minutes ago, top dawg said:

And just because you say he is not worth 5 mil doesn't make it so. Hell, with a healthy Cam, he just could have a resurgence. Hell, if Moore or Samuel get hurt, I'd rather have Smith than any old bloke you can pull of the damned couch, or lose draft capital because we're trying to scramble. You just don't know what's going to happen or what the market is even going to look like. There is absolutely no reason to cut him until you need to do so. Period!

Sigh... you should start paying attention to how the perennial contenders run their organizations. Then you might understand why so many of us are so frustrated. It's not a coincidence that we've never put together back to back with seasons.

[Toomers]

18 minutes ago, top dawg said:

Whatever. I'm sure that if they need the money now, or at some point in the furlture, it will be right there in the bank, and they will use it. Not one of you have given one reason as to why Smith needs to be cut right now, and you know why? Because there isn't a reason.

We are not keep him anyhow. 

Need money for FA

Dont really care but it’s better for the player

OK,,your turn.....

 This is how you answer questions. See how that’s done. Now try that without all the deflection of you don’t have a clue what you’re talking about. Or you would have answers like mine above. 

[tiger7_88]

16 hours ago, Toomers said:

 So, to sum up that mess. We should never, ever discuss anything bad until it actually happens. Can’t comment on direct statements from team reporters. Can’t complain about a team with a losing record and holes everywear. 

 Just post Go Panthers every 5 minutes. We can call it the 55 forum and everything is sunshine and unicorns. 

  Circles? That’s all a conversation with you is. I told you why I don’t care about players, cutting Torrey doesn’t hurt the team. CJ did. So I really don’t care when they cut him. Just so the money is used in FA. And as you again avoided, do you really expect him to be worth 5M somehow? So what’s the point of keeping him? Any reason at all. And where you defended CJ move that hurt the team, now suddenly it’s team first. At this point you’re just making it up as you go along. 

Frankly, I don't know if your efforts to engage 55 in discussion are (1) gallantry, (2) stubbornness, or (3) insanity.  

[Ricky Spanish]

45 minutes ago, Toomers said:

I can’t get an answer for this either. They always tap out on that one. 

@LinvilleGorge

My response:

You can still negotiate a deal for a FA knowing you can easily clear 5 million with that pen swipe. No point in making a permanent change without the ability to hit undo if nothing comes of it. 

We can agree to a deal in principle and then make the corresponding roster moves to make the money work. 

But cutting Torrey with no backup plan in place to replace him doesn't make sense, and cutting him then signing him to a cheaper deal doesn't make sense because that limits what you can do with him if we DO land a FA we like. 

So it makes sense to keep him at the moment and he'll probably be the first cap casualty if the need arises. 

Having said all of that, if we end FA without signing anyone and he's still on the roster at that price, I'ma be upset. 

[tiger7_88]

4 hours ago, Toomers said:

What’s the value of an aging injured WR with the worst hands in the NFL? 

 

I wonder what a Venn diagram of the Funchess Haters and the Torrey Lovers would look like?

[top dawg]

8 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

 

Sigh... you should start paying attention to how the perennial contenders run their organizations. Then you might understand why so many of us are so frustrated. It's not a coincidence that we've never put together back to back with seasons.

I do understand, but I think that having a little patience during this time of transition is very important. If things don't change within a couple of seasons, I don't believe that Tepper is just going to sit idly by. But being knee-jerk is never a solution, and the historically good franchises are evidence to that assertion. 

[LinvilleGorge]

9 minutes ago, Cracka McNasty said:

@LinvilleGorge

My response:

You can still negotiate a deal for a FA knowing you can easily clear 5 million with that pen swipe. No point in making a permanent change without the ability to hit undo if nothing comes of it. 

We can agree to a deal in principle and then make the corresponding roster moves to make the money work. 

But cutting Torrey with no backup plan in place to replace him doesn't make sense, and cutting him then signing him to a cheaper deal doesn't make sense because that limits what you can do with him if we DO land a FA we like. 

So it makes sense to keep him at the moment and he'll probably be the first cap casualty if the need arises. 

Having said all of that, if we end FA without signing anyone and he's still on the roster at that price, I'ma be upset. 

I disagree, but I can respect it.

[Toomers]

1 minute ago, Cracka McNasty said:

@LinvilleGorge

My response:

You can still negotiate a deal for a FA knowing you can easily clear 5 million with that pen swipe. No point in making a permanent change without the ability to hit undo if nothing comes of it. 

We can agree to a deal in principle and then make the corresponding roster moves to make the money work. 

But cutting Torrey with no backup plan in place to replace him doesn't make sense, and cutting him then signing him to a cheaper deal doesn't make sense because that limits what you can do with him if we DO land a FA we like. 

So it makes sense to keep him at the moment and he'll probably be the first cap casualty if the need arises. 

Having said all of that, if we end FA without signing anyone and he's still on the roster at that price, I'ma be upset. 

And no one will care as long as he’s cut during FA, and the money used. Today is not the issue. 

   But what is the reason to keep him if you are never paying him 5M. At that price, here not a backup plan, he’s an anchor. 

Why, at 5M, is there even a scenario you would pay him. There’s not. OR shouldn’t be. 

 So how does it help to have a player you don’t intend to pay stick around as insurance you can’t afford. 

All very reasonable responses though....respect 

[PhillyB]

42 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

He's not a starter, he is however our most expensive WR on the roster.

that's because we have two rookie contracts and a journeyman slot guy. five mil is really not a big contract in today's receiver market and he is well worth it imo

[tiger7_88]

1 hour ago, grimesgoat said:

In 2017, with an legit-armed QB, he caught 32 balls for 430 yards and a couple of TDs.  He also was useful in "taking the top off of the defense".  He is useful in the film room and knows the playbook.  Yes - I'd pay 3m per year for that kind of production/player.

In 2015, with a legit-armed QB, Philly Brown caught 31 balls for 447 yards and a 4 TDs.  He also was useful in "taking the top off of the defense".  

Phlly Brown was a JAG.

Torrey Smith, at this stage in his career, is a JAG.

JAGs aren't a difficult thing to find in the NFL.  Many JAGs will be cut in camp and after pre-season.

Don't pay over minimum salary dollars for a damn JAG.

[Ricky Spanish]

8 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I disagree, but I can respect it.

I'm just saying, Logically speaking there's no NEED to do it now. The move can wait until it NEEDS to be made, then it should be. Until that happens though, I get why we aren't moving on at the moment. The money he is owed isn't guaranteed and we can recoup it at any point before the season starts, so why do it immediately?

If we cut him now, we're short a WR and then that becomes another hole we have to fill in FA and the draft.

If we cut him then bring him back, we are most likely going to be guaranteeing him at least 1 million of that 5 million, meaning we would only net save 4 million. So if we signed a guy and needed all 5 million to work with, we'd be SOL.

If we wait until after FA and draft, if a stud falls to us or we snag a vet WR for around 5 million then we show Torrey the door and free up 5 million in an instant. No harm no foul.

Also by waiting, we hold leverage over him in negotiations. It's a dirty move (that I really wouldn't anticipate Hurney doing) but if we wait until after the draft, other teams have filled out their rosters with young up and coming and cheap talent. IT'd be harder for torrey to find a job. That's when we could strong arm him and say "you will either take a pay cut and play for just over league minimum, or attempt to find a job and expect league minimum."

@Toomers

this response answers your most recent response at the bottom. It's leverage.