If you can only fire one,who goes Hurney or Rivera?

[ncfan]

23 minutes ago, Car123 said:

You can't win the super bowl without impact players. How many impact players did DG give us? One or two. Almost all of his players are JAGs.

2 of the top OGs in the league.  One we couldnt afford to keep because you dont pay max deals to guys at the same position (yes im looking at you Marty)

CMC

Moton

Samuel

KK Short (outside this year has been one of the top 3 DTs in the league)

Star (again couldn't afford to keep)

Bradberry 

Armah

Daryl Williams

Bene Benwikere- yes he is no longer here and bad now.  But as a rookie the dude was better than Jackson.  First team all rookie team, graded out as the top rookie DB is rookie year.  Never was the same after his broken leg

 

 

And while we're talking about "key players"

Why didnt those Hurney guys carry us to some wins.   

Its wasnt until Gettleman brought in key guys such as Ginn, Harper, Coleman, etc that they started winning

Yes Hurney drafted well with those high draft picks he got the chance to pick at after the dumpster fire he built.  But its a team sport.  Your not winning off 3-4 guys

People defending would sit here and defend the Browns bringback Hugh Jackson in a few years when they start winning.  Because he "draft Baker Mayfield and Miles Garrett, and traded a mid pick for Jarvis Landry"

It doesnt work that way

 

 

And sitting there throwing "well he drafted Butler, Ealy etc" while defending the guy who draft Pickles, traded the eventual 33rd pick for Armanti Edwards, trading a 1st for Everrett Brown, Sherod Martin, Fua, etc.  

You have Zero leg to argue on

[LinvilleGorge]

11 minutes ago, Car123 said:

Gamble was #31.

Nope. He was definitely 28th. Can't remember the details of why, but there were trades involved. Our original draft pick that year would've been #31.

[ncfan]

1 minute ago, Car123 said:

Searcy played in one game and that was our best defensive game. Not sure how you can say he wasn't doing anything.

He got beat in preseason, was avg in camp, and essentially won the job by default in camp

[Mr. Scot]

3 minutes ago, Car123 said:

Who were the impact players on those teams? Yep, Hurney guys. You think we'd sniff the playoffs without Stewart, Cam, Olsen, Kuechly, CJ, Norman, Davis, Kalil? I do admit that DG's dumpster diving helped (a lot more than his draft picks).

There are 53 impact players on a team, 45 of them active on a given game day.

You can try to credit a dozen guys for all the success of the team if you want, but the funny part about that is those dozen guys would actually be among the first people to tell you that you're wrong.

 

[Car123]

1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Nope. He was definitely 28th. Can't remember the details of why, but there were trades involved. Our original draft pick that year would've been #31.

Didn't realize. Thanks.

[Mr. Scot]

2 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Nope. He was definitely 28th. Can't remember the details of why, but there were trades involved. Our original draft pick that year would've been #31.

You're correct. Gamble was pick #28 (we traded up, as I recall).

[Mr. Scot]

26 minutes ago, panther4life said:

Why on earth do some people insist on pretending 2014 was a successful season. 7-8-1 is not good, even if it’s the best in a down year for the division and sneaks you into the playoffs

I'll give you a choice:

You can have a season where we go 7-9 and make the playoffs or a season where we go 9-7 and don't.

Which would you rather have?

[NJPanthers12]

3 hours ago, panther4life said:

I’m sure most would choose both, but curious to see who you think is holding us back more.

This is simple. The smug moron who refuses to change his ways and throws his players under the bus. Ron is single handedly holding this franchise back. 

[LinvilleGorge]

3 minutes ago, ncfan said:

He got beat in preseason, was avg in camp, and essentially won the job by default in camp

I would love it if we could get a GM and some coaches in here who value the safety position. We've been living off of a mid-late round draft picks and afterthought free agents at the safety positions for the majority of the franchise's history. I think it would shock people what a difference it would make in our secondary to have a true sideline to sideline centerfielder type of FS. Even the majority of the good safeties we've had have all been of the slower big hitter old school type safeties. 

[Car123]

3 minutes ago, ncfan said:

2 of the top OGs in the league.  One we couldnt afford to keep because you dont pay max deals to guys at the same position (yes im looking at you Marty)

CMC

Moton

Samuel

KK Short (outside this year has been one of the top 3 DTs in the league)

Star (again couldn't afford to keep)

Bradberry 

Armah

Daryl Williams

Bene Benwikere- yes he is no longer here and bad now.  But as a rookie the dude was better than Jackson.  First team all rookie team, graded out as the top rookie DB is rookie year.  Never was the same after his broken leg

 

 

 

Lol, Benewikere started 6 games as a rookie. He did well late that season but he wasn't on Jackson's level. Jackson has been a top 20 rookie. Bene then had a bad 2015 in the slot and followed that season with the infamous Julio game. He was never heard from again.

Armah doesn't do much. Any FA FB can do what he does. Do we even use a FB outside of first & goal on the 1.

Bradberry is average. I don't expect him to be back after 2019. We can do soo much better.

[Car123]

12 minutes ago, ncfan said:

2 of the top OGs in the league.  One we couldnt afford to keep because you dont pay max deals to guys at the same position (yes im looking at you Marty)

CMC

Moton

Samuel

KK Short (outside this year has been one of the top 3 DTs in the league)

Star (again couldn't afford to keep)

Bradberry 

Armah

Daryl Williams

Bene Benwikere- yes he is no longer here and bad now.  But as a rookie the dude was better than Jackson.  First team all rookie team, graded out as the top rookie DB is rookie year.  Never was the same after his broken leg

 

 

And while we're talking about "key players"

Why didnt those Hurney guys carry us to some wins.   

Its wasnt until Gettleman brought in key guys such as Ginn, Harper, Coleman, etc that they started winning

Yes Hurney drafted well with those high draft picks he got the chance to pick at after the dumpster fire he built.  But its a team sport.  Your not winning off 3-4 guys

People defending would sit here and defend the Browns bringback Hugh Jackson in a few years when they start winning.  Because he "draft Baker Mayfield and Miles Garrett, and traded a mid pick for Jarvis Landry"

It doesnt work that way

 

 

And sitting there throwing "well he drafted Butler, Ealy etc" while defending the guy who draft Pickles, traded the eventual 33rd pick for Armanti Edwards, trading a 1st for Everrett Brown, Sherod Martin, Fua, etc.  

You have Zero leg to argue on

Cam, Kuechly, Rivera didn't hit their prime yet.

[panther4life]

4 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

I'll give you a choice:

You can have a season where we go 7-9 and make the playoffs or a season where we go 9-7 and don't.

Which would you rather have?

I’ll answer your question, please return the favor. 

I’ll take the playoff season. Getting lucky because you’re division sucks does not equate to the GM doing a great job.

So would you change your tune on Hurney if we had gone to the playoffs every time his teams won 7 games if it snuck us into the playoffs. Or even half the times he managed 7 or more wins?  As you’re well aware 09 and 2010 were the only years he did not manage at least 7 wins.

 

 

[LinvilleGorge]

4 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

I'll give you a choice:

You can have a season where we go 7-9 and make the playoffs or a season where we go 9-7 and don't.

Which would you rather have?

Hindsight is always 20/20, but you're giving us way too much credit for being the best bad team in the NFC South that year. If given the choice of going 7-9 or 9-7 next year, 10 out of 10 people would choose 9-7. 9-7 historically gives you about a 50/50 chance of making the playoffs. 7-9 gives you low single digit chances. We just got really, REALLY lucky that year.

[Mr. Scot]

1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I would love it if we could get a GM and some coaches in here who value the safety position. We've been living off of a mid-late round draft picks and afterthought free agents at the safety positions for the majority of the franchise's history. I think it would shock people what a difference it would make in our secondary to have a true sideline to sideline centerfielder type of FS. Even the majority of the good safeties we've had have all been of the slower big hitter old school type safeties. 

That's gotta start with the coach.

A GM generally doesn't give a damn what system you run. He just asks the head coach what kind of players he wants and then goes shopping for them.