What a lot of folks are missing

[Mr. Scot]

To start with, let me quote from a post that says a lot of the same things I've been thinking...

When a team goes on the skids, the first thing that usually gets said is "Fire the Quarterback." Why? Because it takes the least thought and energy.

QB throwing a lot of interceptions? It's all his fault, gotta be. Team not winning? QB is screwing it up.

Next, a few people will move a few neurons around and put a wee bit more thought to it and come up with "Fire the Coach!" Everything runs through the coach, right, so let's fire him and that jerk of a quarterback, too, while we're at it.

But man, anyone who has ever played anything more than fantasy football or Madden knows is that problems like Carolina had at the beginning of the season are much more complex than can be laid on a single person's shoulders. No matter how much some idiot wants to do that.

Look at our discourse around here lately. Even with the last two wins, there has been someone to scapegoat after each game. Jake's a constant, Fox and Hurney, too. Pep's been a big one this year, Godfrey is a popular one right now, Smitty as well. Heck, I remember threads about how we should trade Johnathan Stewart not too long ago.

Really, what gives? Should we just line everyone up and cut a pink slip to every third player in line? What about pack in the season now after two wins, hire a U-Haul truck for the coach and start tuning in to watch Falcons games instead?

Give me a break. You want to know what? It's something that I believe makes some people on this board physically sick -- we've won games now, with all of the same players in place. And guess what? The team is actually getting better, believe it or not. The problems are being worked out and Fox might pull a rabbit outta his hat before the season's over.

Hell, I'm going to keep watching, and I sure hope he does. Why? Because this is my favorite team and I always want them to win. But I'm also an adult and have realized that sometimes your team loses one. I'm big enough to go on about my life and wait for the next week.

Any thoughts of "Man, that guy's game sucked this week," or "We looked a little weak in the secondary" are just watercooler conversation material. But man, some of you folks want to see blood, you act like the failures of a player on a sports team were a personal let down to you and you deserve revenge.

Get a grip. Pull for your team, man up and take the lumps in loss and enjoy the wins. But let it go, and don't salivate over your next chance to be a star and start your very own "Fire Jake" "Fire Fox" or "Fire Everyone" threads (supplies limited, call now to get your very own!).

It highlights an issue that's fairly common in fans, that being the "lottery mentality" when approaching team issues.

"Lottery mentality" is essentially the notion that one single thing - the proverbial 'winning ticket' - can cure everything that ails us. Right now, there's a load of that kind of thinking going around the fanbase on this board.

The tickets of choice? Backup quarterbacks are one of the most often purchased, just ahead of new coordinators and coaches. Are these things a good move sometimes? Sure, but they're rarely the cure-alls that people make them out to be.

And that's the thing that so many people are missing when they look at the 2009 Panthers. Too many think they've found the problem, when more often than not what they actually see is a problem.

Some examples:

Jake Delhomme's passing issues are a problem, not the problem.

Jeff Davidson's playcalling is a problem, not the problem.

Ball security issues - including those from previously reliable guys like DeAngelo Williams - are a problem, not the problem.

Lack of a complementary receiving threat is a problem, not the problem.

Offensive line weaknesses are a problem, not the problem.

Defensive struggles against the run are a problem, not the problem.

Even Danny Crossman's special teams coaching is a problem, not the problem.

Way too many people here think that we can fix just one of those things and it will all be all right. Unlikely. It'd sure be nice if it was that easy, but in the real world it just isn't that simple. People have been playing the "this team is too talented to be this bad" card, and based on that notion limiting their thinking to a single issue, the "one thing" that's at the root of it all. This, as the old saying goes, is missing the forest for the trees.

Reality is that every team in the league, even the Redskins, Lions and Bucs, contains players that are the best in the world at what they do. Every team has talent, and loads of it. Every team also has issues, and plenty of them. The nature of the game is that someone has to win, and someone has to lose.

Truthfully, the line that separates which team does what is often so razor thin you can barely see it. Teams rarely get to be bad based on weakness at solely one position or one aspect of the game, including the leadership of a coach or QB. Those sorts of things can keep a good team from reaching its potential, but by themselves they just aren't enough to turn a good team into a bad one.

Bottom Line: The Panthers have multiple issues right now, and fixing them is not so simple as benching a guy here or there. So logically speaking, if you want to sound off about a problem you see, by all means do so.

Just don't go into it with the notion that fixing that one issue fixes everything.

[CarolinaKid704]

Always a good write up Mr. Scot.....

but we can argue this till the cows come home. Winning cures all. We had the same team as last year 12-4 - even the Fox haters, Jake haters werent saying anything then.

[kornicova]

Good post Mr. Scot

In saying all that fixing one thing can have flow on effects, ie jake playing better will effect how well the rbs can run and some of the coaching decisions will look a lot better.

[Mr. Scot]

Valid points, and also worth mentioning the element of time.

We didn't get where we are overnight. Thus, it isn't going to be fixed in the course of a practice or two.

[kornicova]

So a lot of that could depend on how patient mr. Richardson is.

Will he give it the time needed or will he get rid of fox meaning we're at square one?

[Mr. Scot]

Sort of goes back to my discussion of Fox being in "win now" mode.

I really wonder if a lot of folks have considered that starting at "square one" could very easily set us back a year or two. The notion that a new guy comes in and immediately turns it all around is a tad unrealistic.

Does it happen sometimes? Sure, but it's the exception, not the rule.

I favor John Fox being fired if results and conditions dictate such, but folks shouldn't favor this idea based on the belief that Bill Cowher, Rob Ryan or anyone else will sweep in like a savior and everything will suddenly be sunshine and roses.

[Kevin Greene]

Some examples:

Jake Delhomme's passing issues are a problem, not the problem.

Jeff Davidson's playcalling is a problem, not the problem.

Ball security issues - including those from previously reliable guys like DeAngelo Williams - are a problem, not the problem.

Lack of a complementary receiving threat is a problem, not the problem.

Offensive line weaknesses are a problem, not the problem.

Defensive struggles against the run are a problem, not the problem.

Even Danny Crossman's special teams coaching is a problem, not the problem.

Taken as a whole, it simply confirms the organization needs to go in a new direction at the top two positions.

[KillerKat]

Jake Delhomme's passing issues are a problem, not the problem.

Jeff Davidson's playcalling is a problem, not the problem.

Ball security issues - including those from previously reliable guys like DeAngelo Williams - are a problem, not the problem.

Lack of a complementary receiving threat is a problem, not the problem.

Offensive line weaknesses are a problem, not the problem.

Defensive struggles against the run are a problem, not the problem.

Even Danny Crossman's special teams coaching is a problem, not the problem.

Bottom Line: The Panthers have multiple issues right now, and fixing them is not so simple as benching a guy here or there. So logically speaking, if you want to sound off about a problem you see, by all means do so.

Just don't go into it with the notion that fixing that one issue fixes everything.

Correct. All those together form the crap cluster that is the 2009 season. Delhomme is done and we need a new QB. We have to know what we have in Moore and give him a shot with the first team to see if he's the successor. If not, then we have to draft one or pick up someone via FA. Jake's time is up and I would rather go through the process of finding a better QB than sticking with him. This is something Fox and the FO should've addressed a long time ago and is one of the primary reasons I believe they should be gone.

It's unclear if Davidson's playcalling is all on him or as a result of Fox having his say in it. Davidson on this team is better than Henning was on this team, however inconsistant. Every now and then we see the samethings with Davidson that we did with Henning.

Williams and Stewarts fumbles have to be a mental thing that they got to get together. Williams probably felt a little immune after his fumble-less season last year.

The offensive run blocking is a head scratcher. Yeah last week they did good against a poor team, but before that they were not opening any holes. Perhaps they felt like Williams did after last season.

The defensive run game is getting better, but our secondary is still pretty bad. Godfrey can't cover or tackle. Gamble doesn't look like he is worth the contract he signed this offseason. We're still playing too far off of receivers sometimes!

Danny Crossman should've been fired a long time ago. How he has a job, I dont know. Another reason why Fox should be shown the door.

Sort of goes back to my discussion of Fox being in "win now" mode.

I really wonder if a lot of folks have considered that starting at "square one" could very easily set us back a year or two. The notion that a new guy comes in and immediately turns it all around is a tad unrealistic.

I know for sure that I realise this. But this team has far too many issues. Too many things wrong with it that it all points to coaching. Add all of that with Fox's lack of half time adjustments and sticking to a game plan that doesn't work, and I'll be fine going through the process of finding another coach and regime that will bring fire back to this team.

Finally, I also think that just because a poster is posting about a specific player or coach in a thread, that doesn't mean that the poster is ignoring other things wrong with the team. I see this over and over again. Poster A will state his opinion on something and then Poster B comes into the thread and acts as if Poster A isn't recognizing other faults or blaming it all on this one fault that Poster A talked about.

[Mr. Scot]

Taken as a whole, it simply confirms the organization needs to go in a new direction at the top two positions.

Technically they just did

We have to know what we have in Moore and give him a shot with the first team to see if he's the successor.

You know that's not gonna happen, right?

[KillerKat]

Technically they just did

You know that's not gonna happen, right?

Yeah it's something that needs to be done, but Fox wont =[

[Mr. Scot]

Finally, I also think that just because a poster is posting about a specific player or coach in a thread, that doesn't mean that the poster is ignoring other things wrong with the team. I see this over and over again. Poster A will state his opinion on something and then Poster B comes into the thread and acts as if Poster A isn't recognizing other faults or blaming it all on this one fault that Poster A talked about.

Valid, but I think you'd also agree there's a pretty large contingent that's oversimplified things. That's what I'm addressing.

[KillerKat]

Valid, but I think you'd also agree there's a pretty large contingent that's oversimplified things. That's what I'm addressing.

Probably. I don't know what the other person is thinking. I don't know if they are ignorant of other problems or blaming it all on one guy. That's why I haven't accused anyone of doing that before. I assume that they watch the same game as me and are just as aware as I am of other faults. I also realize Jake is the poorest starter on our team and at the most important position on a football team. So I understand all the flack he takes.

[Mr. Scot]

Probably. I don't know what the other person is thinking. I don't know if they are ignorant of other problems or blaming it all on one guy. That's why I haven't accused anyone of doing that before. I assume that they watch the same game as me and are just as aware as I am of other faults.

Which is probably sometimes true, and sometimes not. For my part, I'm more likely to attach credibility to someone's ideas if they can actually point out a specific issue. If all they ever discuss is one thing and the level of criticism generally doesn't rise any higher than "the defense sucks balls" or some such, it's tougher to take it seriously.

Regarding Fox and Delhomme, I disagree with the decision and have said so. In all fairness though, were I in the position I perceive Fox to be in (i.e. needing to win now) I might just make the same choice. I'd be lying if I said otherwise.

[Urrymonster]

All those saying our problems are a result of poor coaching, how do you explain our 12-4 season last year and never finishing lower than 7-9 under Fox? Surely if he gets the flak for this season, then he should get the plaudits for the prior years.

As Scott has said, it is not as simple as assuming all these problems stem from Fox and Hurney. We had a whole host of new coaches this season and considering how entrenched their predecessors were, it could suggest why certain positions have struggled to be 'on the ball' as they are suddenly being asked to do different things after years of following the same principles.

It could well be that the opposition has fallen on a few tendencies that are 'showing our hand'. Not every opponent has exploited our problems and we have not looked incompetant against all opponents. A Scott pointed out, the standard of talent is there in any team so winning in this league is often a coin flip.

Or could it simply be an all round 'age factor' that has crept into several of our game changers and a few sophomore slumps from the youngsters?

Do not be quick to just declare that Fox and Hurney have out warn their welcome here.

The defense is finally playing like fans have wanted in a while. They are attacking, they are blitzing, LBs are creating pressure and sacks. Davis and Beason look like pro bowlers out there. Even the line is chipping in to give opposing teams problems in their passing game. Is it perfect? No. But bar press coverage not many make too many complaints about our D these days, other thant he scapegoat Godfrey...

Considering how bad it appeared in the pre-season, I would think the coaches are doing something right? Obviously that is all down to Meeks and not Fox...

Personally I have grown tired of many of Fox's attributes, but I certainly am not counting out his ability to run a team. Few have alluded that he is losing the locker room, if that is true then THAT is the only reason he should go, not his coaching - he is fine in that department.

It seems a lot of people are still whining and crying about extending Jake and franchising Pep. Let's look at it another way. The fan backlash would have been insane if they had not franchised Pep after being able to lock Gross up long term. Trust me they would be under more pressure to win if they had let him go. Jake's deal was a no brainer considering our cap problems once Pep was franchised.

Unfortunately that seems to be the main root for people being unhappy with the FO, forgetting the great moves they had made up until then. Also forgetting the impressive moves they have made since Kemo went down. They did not panic, took their time and found people who could genuinely help at minimal cost. Frankly I am looking forward to seeing th DTs in action next camp, we could well have found one or two LONG TERM answers at the position. Who knows, but I was impressed that they were pro active and did what needed to do without chucking money at a no namer or potential headache...

No one and I genuinely mean NO ONE on the outside of the organisation knows why this team has under performed. Frankly though you can't pin it all on Fox, nor Hurney, nor Jake or even Pep. Several issues have cropped up after a mightily impressive 2008 (get over the playoffs already) are we that impatient of a fan base to not even see if Fox can do what he has always done and rescue the season when it appears lost? That is his main attribute and a source of good coaching. He never gives up.