Lack of Deep Threats

[NAS]

3 hours ago, thennek said:

 Other than Samuel being out,  some of this probably has something to do with our offensive line injuries.  I think one of the reasons why the O-line has looked good is because Norv is calling plays to help them be successful while they are still learning. Those long deep route take a long time to develop. I will take the dink and dunk short passes and an effective run game over the deep long passes until the offense develops into being ready to doing this.

Not sure that's the case.  I was surprised that CAM is ranked in the top 10 among QBs who played 3 games, with "Time to Throw" average of  2.82 seconds.  That's about 0.10 seconds better than last year.  

 

[TheRed]

3 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

We likely won't agree...like you said, and I 100% do not agree that Kelvin is a bust. Is he the player we hoped we were getting at the end of the 1st round?  No, but he's not a bust.  He will finish his 5th year completely losing 1 to injury, and have over 3000 yards, with likely 22-26 TD's.  I'm not nearly as much of a fan of his as I once was, but he's not a bust in my books.

The Panther receivers have always been a little goofy unless you have Moose and Smith back there, and we have always run somewhat of a conservative run first defense here...but this years stable is the best we have fielded in some time, and Samuel will be coming back.

I simply cannot understand the logic of KB not being a bust as a first rounder in Newton's prime with the laundry list of failed picks from Hurney that are still talked about to this day.

Seems like moving the goal posts.

[thefuzz]

1 minute ago, TheRed said:

I simply cannot understand the logic of KB not being a bust as a first rounder in Newton's prime with the laundry list of failed picks from Hurney that are still talked about to this day.

Seems like moving the goal posts.

For me...it's the numbers, and the time.  He will likely sign another contract, one larger than we could imagine him getting, and will finish his rookie contract with 3000 yards and more than 20 TD's.

You play upwards of 6-8 seasons in the NFL....and IMO you aren't really a bust.

[TheRed]

1 minute ago, thefuzz said:

For me...it's the numbers, and the time.  He will likely sign another contract, one larger than we could imagine him getting, and will finish his rookie contract with 3000 yards and more than 20 TD's.

You play upwards of 6-8 seasons in the NFL....and IMO you aren't really a bust.

I'm speaking in terms of the Carolina Panthers.

We invested a first rounder in him. Unless he magically turns into Megatron, he is a bust for the Carolina Panthers. I get homer shades and all that, but reality is reality.

[NAS]

1 minute ago, TheRed said:

I'm speaking in terms of the Carolina Panthers.

We invested a first rounder in him. Unless he magically turns into Megatron, he is a bust for the Carolina Panthers. I get homer shades and all that, but reality is reality.

I agree, if you're 1 first round pick and not good enough to earn a second contract with your team based on your performance, then you're a bust!

[thefuzz]

2 minutes ago, TheRed said:

I'm speaking in terms of the Carolina Panthers.

We invested a first rounder in him. Unless he magically turns into Megatron, he is a bust for the Carolina Panthers. I get homer shades and all that, but reality is reality.

You can look at it that way, but I look at the player as a whole.

Is Chris Carter a bust?  Alshon?  Suh?  Star?  Teams change, philosophies change, coaches change...doesn't mean you are a bust of a player if teams go the other way.

[thefuzz]

5 minutes ago, NAS said:

I agree, if you're 1 first round pick and not good enough to earn a second contract with your team based on your performance, then you're a bust!

Not at all accurate, see my post right above this one.

 

[TheRed]

2 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

You can look at it that way, but I look at the player as a whole.

Is Chris Carter a bust?  Alshon?  Suh?  Star?  Teams change, philosophies change, coaches change...doesn't mean you are a bust of a player if teams go the other way.

I figured someone might mention Star, and I'm kind of on the fence. Seems like he has disappeared in Buffalo like he did here at one point after showing flashes in his first few seasons.

I'm going to say no, but I wouldn't exactly say we knocked it out of the park either because I genuinely think Star is the player DG hoped would anchor our middle for years to come. Instead that was KK who everyone thought was all but out the door at one point. Meanwhile Star acted as if he could barely be bothered when his contract year rolled around.

[thefuzz]

1 minute ago, TheRed said:

I figured someone might mention Star, and I'm kind of on the fence. Seems like he has disappeared in Buffalo like he did here at one point after showing flashes in his first few seasons.

I'm going to say no, but I wouldn't exactly say we knocked it out of the park either because I genuinely think Star is the player DG hoped would anchor our middle for years to come. Instead that was KK who everyone thought was all but out the door at one point. Meanwhile Star acted as if he could barely be bothered when his contract year rolled around.

Dude...what are you talking about?

All Star did was come to work, do his job (well I might add), and go about his business.  No bitching about contracts, no holdouts, etc...just a damn good player.

And I cannot agree with you to label players as busts if they don't do well for the only team that drafted them.  Drew Brees is another that comes to mind quickly.

[TheRed]

5 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

Dude...what are you talking about?

All Star did was come to work, do his job (well I might add), and go about his business.  No bitching about contracts, no holdouts, etc...just a damn good player.

And I cannot agree with you to label players as busts if they don't do well for the only team that drafted them.  Drew Brees is another that comes to mind quickly.

You brought him up. I responded.

I think you've got some serious homer shades on for DG. *shrug*

[NAS]

Which is why emphasized performance when judging why that second contract didn’t happen. 

[thefuzz]

6 minutes ago, TheRed said:

You brought him up. I responded.

I think you've got some serious homer shades on for DG. *shrug*

Did you respond about any of the others I brought up, or just the one that DG drafted?  I almost left him off the list, just for that reason.

DG made some really bad moves, but made more good ones than bad ones. 

 

I don't think that drafting KB or Star was a bad choice.  I don't believe that drafting Shaq was a bad choice.  I do think that drafting Vernon was a bad choice.  I don't think that drafting CMC was a bad choice, and I don't think that grabbing DJ was a bad choice.

KB is most certainly not a bust....IMO.  Jeff Otah is.  We haven't had many 1st round busts in some time now, but Vernon could sneak in there.

[TheRed]

4 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

Did you respond about any of the others I brought up, or just the one that DG drafted?  I almost left him off the list, just for that reason.

DG made some really bad moves, but made more good ones than bad ones. 

 

I don't think that drafting KB or Star was a bad choice.  I don't believe that drafting Shaq was a bad choice.  I do think that drafting Vernon was a bad choice.  I don't think that drafting CMC was a bad choice, and I don't think that grabbing DJ was a bad choice.

KB is most certainly not a bust....IMO.  Jeff Otah is.  We haven't had many 1st round busts in some time now, but Vernon could sneak in there.

Hey guy. I even said above that Star wasn't a bust. Keep it in your pants.

But there's no way on earth you can call Otah a bust and not KB. You have told on yourself with that remark.

[thefuzz]

Just now, TheRed said:

Hey guy. I even said above that Star wasn't a bust. Keep it in your pants.

But there's no way on earth you can call Otah a bust and not KB. You have told on yourself with that remark.

I have called Otah a bust many times, and have never called KB a bust.

When you cost a team multiple 1st round picks, and you appear in a total of 29 games over your CAREER, you are most certainly a bust in my book.  Injury or not, that's just about the picture perfect example of a bust in the NFL.

Underwhelming?  Sure, but KB certainly isn't a bust.